Alexandria Cortez Could Abolish Immigration? It is Foundations of Freedom Thursday, a special day of the week where we get to answer questions from you, the listeners! Always answering your questions from constitutional principles! Tune in today as we answer your questions such as what does it take to get the Bible to be taught in schools? Did our Founders write about evolution VS creation? How far can openly socialist Alexandria Cortez go?  And so much more, right here on WallBuilders Live!

Air Date: 07/19/2018

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture


President Thomas Jefferson said, “€œI know no safe depository of the ultimate powers of the society, but the people themselves. And if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion the remedy is not to take it from them, but to inform their discretion by education. This is the true corrective of abuses of constitutional power.”€


Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live! Where we talk about today”€™s hottest topics on policy, faith, and the culture. Always from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

Today we let you drive that conversation in terms of what we’re going to talk about, what topics we’re going to pick, by you sending in the questions. Send them into [email protected], that’s [email protected]. It’s Thursday, Foundations of Freedom Thursday, and we love getting your questions on these foundational issues of constitutional questions, things that are happening in the culture, right now. How do we respond to these things accurately from a biblical, constitutional, and historical, perspective?

We’re here with David Barton, America’s premier historian. And Tim Barton”€™s with us, he”€™s a national speaker and pastor. You can find out more about all three of us– By the way, my name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas legislator.

You can find out about all three of us at And then  you can get some great tools at to make this not just a Foundations of Freedom Thursday, but get those foundations of freedom that you can instill in yourself and your family throughout the week.

David, Tim, looking forward to diving into these principles. You guys ready?


I think so, but let me do something upfront before we dive.


Go for it.

Did We Say That?


This goes back to a few weeks ago one of the programs we had where we were talking about good kings and bad kings in Israel’s history and how it relates to day. And we were talking that time about Josiah. And Josiah, I made the comment that as long as the priest Jahoida was around that Josiah did the right thing and that when Jahoida died Josiah left the reservation, did all the wrong stuff. My bad – that was King Joash who did that. Josiah was good all the way through from top to bottom. And thankfully, a couple of our listeners pointed out, “€œI think you meant to say Joash, not Josiah, and that’s exactly right.”€

So, just for those that may be curious or hadn’t heard, Joash was a good king as long as he had good counselors around him. When he lost those counselors he did not have the instincts and he was a bad king – one of the worst. It was Josiah, the young king, 8 years old, who did good all the way through his life. Did a great job, was one of the best kings Israel had. So, my bad on that mistake.

So, let’s go to the questions you”€™ve got, Rick.


Well, wait, before we do the question. So, Tim and I, I guess, apologize too because either we are so used to you talking so fast and we didn’t pick out which king you said, are we missed it as well, right, Tim?


Yeah, I probably was reading an e-mail at that point or doing something. When I saw the email from the listener and they said, “€œHey, Josiah was a good king.”€ I said, “€œWell, yeah, we know that.”€ And they said, “€œWell, you guys said that he had mess ups.”€ And I thought, “€œI don’t think we said that.”€ Then we went back and looked and I went, “€œOh my gosh, how did I miss that?”€ Because certainly, yeah, first of all we are grateful that we have audience members who are people who know the Bible.


That’s right.

Know The Word!


We encourage everybody – study to know the word of God. And, by the way, we also applaud the fact that when somebody is saying something that’s not biblically correct they will come back and say, “€œHey, guys, this is what the Bible actually says.”€ That is awesome. We are grateful that people will point that out. And certainly, we want to be people who follow the Bible. And as people that have read the Bible many, many, times and continue to go through it every year, yeah, that was a little embarrassing to see that we had mislabeled somebody. Although obviously, nobody’s perfect, *, everybody makes mistakes.




Certainly we knew Josiah was a good guy and that definitely was a mistake.


I love what you said too, Tim, we love having listeners that are paying close enough attention, that know the Bible well enough, and that will let us know and the e-mails were very nice. And of course, all three of us are constantly saying, “€œHey, we’re not perfect, we make mistakes for sure.”€ So, anyway, that was kind of fun too to get those e-mails and then also have an internal discussion about, “€œDoes anybody remember? Did we actually say that? How did that go?”€ Anyway, David, thank you for bringing that up and we set the record straight there.

Now let’s jump into some questions. You guys ready for that?


Let’s do it.


Alright, guys, then here comes the first one. It has to do with Bibles in schools. It’s from Mike. He said, “€œWhat does it take for the Bible to be taught in your school? I thought I heard 15 students, but I had a remark back from someone saying the school board decides yes or no. Please advise on this topic.”€

And of course, guys, he’s probably referring to being able to offer a Bible class as an elective. We’ve had guests on our program that do that sort of thing, they have Bible Curriculum in Public Schools. And, David, you’ve helped to develop some of those curriculums. So, I’m assuming he’s talking about an elective class, not a required class.

The Bible in Public Schools?


Yeah, what happens is– first off, just to answer the bottom line, yes, you can have the Bible in public schools as curriculum. There are groups out there that do that. The one group that I’m really close to is National Council of Bible Curriculum In Public Schools. They use the Bible as the textbook for the course. There’s about 200,000 kids that have gone through that. Twelve hundred districts use it.

So, it is out there. It is legal. There are other groups that do it as well. And have it and Bob of course and schools can easily be done. You just– and by the way, I say “€œeasily be done”€. It can legally be done, but the first time you raise it the principal may raise his eyebrows and, “€œWhoa, you can”€™t have the Bible school.”€ “€œYeah. Here’s all the court decisions – you can. And it’s across the nation.”€

So, what Mike is talking about with something we mentioned on a different program that state legislatures can do to help this. For example, in the state of Texas, Texas passed a law that said if 15 students go ask the principal for this Bible course the principal has to provide the Bible course. In other words, it’s not up to the principal to decide because it’s legally okay to have this course. So, it gives 15 kids the ability to trigger this. Let”€™s say you go to a principal and say, “€œI want the Bible taught in schools.”€ Well, if 15 kids say “€œwe do”€, in Texas you can get that as a trigger to get that moving.

And so we talked about that that would be good for other states to pass as well, get that kind of trigger going. Because if you have a superintendent that doesn’t want it, it”€™s still legal. You can do this. It’s all over the nation. But it’s a great thing for people to do in their school. So, whatever your school is, students go ask for it, parents go ask for it, get the information off the websites, it’s legal stuff that you can do, easy to do, it”€™s a great course to have.


Alright then, quick break, we’ll be right back. And by the way, again, we”€™re constantly giving people action steps on these types of things, so there’s a great way for you to get involved. Doesn’t even matter if you have kids in the school anymore. You might have had kids there years before, or maybe your homeschool parent, or private school parent, you can still help to get this program into your local school district. Obviously, the more we can get God’s word into schools, and even just from the literature and history perspective, getting that taught would be a very positive thing. So, be a part of helping to make that happen in your community.

Quick break. We’ll be back in a moment with another question from, you, our audience. And if you’d like to send those in, send them to You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.


Abraham Lincoln said, “€œWe the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts. Not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.”€

Moment From American History

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. After the final victory at Yorktown the Continental Army awaited the outcome of peace negotiations with Great Britain.

Pastor Israel Evans, a chaplain in the army, proposed to George Washington that they build a structure where church services can be held during the months of waiting. Washington approved the plan and urges officers to ensure that the soldiers attend that service.

Pastor Evans further knew if we were to secure the liberties they had fought for, sound education would be crucial.

He declared, “€œEvery parent and every friend to the freedom of his country ought to be attentive to the improvement of our youth and the principles of freedom and good government. And then the people will stand fast in their liberty for a long time.”€ Our schools today need to return to teaching the principles of freedom and good government in order for America to survive and prosper. For more information about Pastor Israel Evans and other colonial Patriots go to


Thomas Jefferson said, “€œThe constitutions of most of our states, and of the United States, assert that all power is inherent in the people that they may exercise it by themselves that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed. That they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, and freedom of press.”€


Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live on this Foundations of Freedom Thursday. Next question is coming from Bill out in Florida. He says, “€œLove the WallBuilders Live radio show. I try to listen here in Tallahassee, Florida on our local faith radio at noon. My question regards evolution from a historical perspective. Did our founders write about evolution, about creation?”€ So, he sent an article from a local newspaper that dealt with it and he really wanted to know what we thought about or what we could reveal about what the founders had said on this. He said, “€œThanks and keep up the great work.”€

That”€™s from Bill. So, David, I know you’ve mentioned Thomas Paine saying something about  intelligent design, basically, but that’s all I can remember on this one. What else do we have from the founders on evolution?

The Founders on Evolution


Well, there’s actually a lot on it. And the reason there’s a lot, let me give the background on this. Back on the seventy fifth anniversary of the Scopes trial, I was asked by a law journal to write a law review article for that. And so in working through that it was really interesting in that every major thesis of evolution today was in place, generally, by 600 years B.C.. So, what Darwin did was not come up with any new huge, major, ground shaking, cataclysmic, seismic, discoveries. He just basically kind of articulated what’s been out there for two millennia and kind of synthesised it and added some ideas and thoughts to it.

So, let me go through some of the background here and kind of lay out how a lot of what we hear in Evolution today is not new. And I want you to consider how much science has changed over this period of time and look how far we”€™ve progressed. But look how the modern science is still holding on to– I mean, we’re talking about stuff back in the days when there was no knowledge of an atom, or germ theory, or anything else.

And I’m not a Greek person, so I can’t pronounce all of these names, but I can tell you some things about them that if you look at Thallus and Anaxamandar– and that’s long before Aristotle. 2,000 years ago they were already debating the survival of the fittest and that’s, of course, one of the key things in evolution. So, 2,000 years ago they’re having debates back and forth on the survival of the fittest.

If you look specifically at some of the ideas of, let’s say, the Big Bang– Well, let me go through some – spontaneous generation, and that’s kind of the Big Bang thing, that was introduced 600 B.C.. The concept of primordial slime was 550 B.C.. The theory of survival of the fittest and natural selection, that was about 500 B.C.. You have the mutability and adaptation of species and that’s 400 B.C.. Before the birth of Christ, * is the one who came up with the idea of Mother Earth that that’s, all life came from Mother Earth, and sprang from Earth and evolved.

All of This Stuff is Old


You have Leibnitz– I love this, we’re talking about seventeen hundred A.D.. So, back before most of the founding fathers were born. He is the one who argued for intermediate species. And if you see an evolution chart where you’ve got from the monkey going to man, that’s the intermediate species, that’s how things kind of evolve from one species, to another species, to another, to another. We’re talking about that”€™s 1700 – that’s before the founding fathers. And I could just keep going through all these other things. Bufan is the guy that in about 1720 he taught that man was a quadruped and he was descended from the apes.

So, all of this stuff is old. So, when the founding fathers come around, everything that we still debate in evolution today was already written about back then, it was already available to them. And so you’ll find young men like Daniel Webster – when he was 18 years old at Dartmouth University, his final senior paper at the age of 18 was written about the evolution/creation controversy. And he clearly comes down on the side of creation, and talks about the science that was known at that time, and the failures of science to be able to prove evolution, and how that natural law does prove creation.

So, it’s kind of like the stuff we argue today. We think that because we have high technology today and we have these scientists that have all these electron microscopes and have broken the code on DNA and– they’re still arguing stuff that is 24, 25, 2600 years old and there’s been no modern discovery that has changed that. You’re still arguing old stuff – it”€™s the intermediate species, and survival of the fittest, and adaptation, and mutability. That’s all old stuff. And so that’s part of the answer to the question. I know that Tim covers this a lot with the young people that we do in leadership training.

Science Has Changed, But Truth Hasn”€™t


And it sounds like, just like what you said, science has changed, but truth hasn’t changed. It’s been what’s being published has changed and what people have tried to argue might have changed some. But you’re saying most of the core arguments were made hundreds, sometimes even thousands, of years ago.


Well, they were. And even the Big Bang was being written about back in about 1700 – that we came from this Big Bang. Well, now that we’ve got all this nebular possibilities through the Hubble telescope and all this stuff, we’re still talking about stuff that was done back in the 1770s hundreds on the Big Bang? We still haven’t figured out how black holes work, or what they are, or where they came from. And so we don’t have a clue on this stuff, but we’ve got a whole lot more science than we did in 1700. But we’re still using arguments that were offered from 600 B.C. to 1700 A.D..

And so you’re looking at 23, 2400 years that these arguments have been out there. And with all the science we have today we will continue to claim the arguments that were made when there was not much science to deal with.


Tim, how to young people, when you bring some of this up, how do they respond? Because I think the perception is all of this began with Darwin, he came up with all these things, discovered all of these things, to find out that, no, he was actually just writing on the things that had already been written about.


Sure, yeah. I think there”€™s a couple important points to cover. First of all, in the Founders Bible there’s an article that goes in depth on this with a lot of quotes from the founding fathers, with all the quotes my dad just mentioned looking back for thousands of years where people were kind of hypothesizing about, what are possibilities, what could have happened. And ultimately, as long as there have been people who didn’t want to believe in a God there has to be a way they can try to explain this.

So, these ideas couldn”€™t have started with Darwin because people didn’t believe in God long before that. And so how do you explain away God? So, these ideas are not new.

Deeper Into Darwin


And by the way, even looking at Darwin, it’s something that is always fascinating for young people. When we actually dig into Darwin and you look at his book on the Origin of Species. Or you break down a little deeper and you read the title and you realise, wait a second, it’s the survival of the favored races is what we’re looking at. And–


As a matter of fact, let me just read you the title of the book. Here’s the title of the book when it came out – The Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, Or The Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle For Life.

Now, that latter part you won’t find on most titles today. They’ve taken that out because having favored races is what Darwin is advocating.


Yeah, when you actually do a little reading into Darwin’s original writings, and actually, even the Origin of Species as it’s come to be known today, he says a lot of very racist things. He’s very anti black or least that blacks have not fully evolved particularly.


Well, particularly his book, The Descent of Man. That’s where you really see this racism come out especially in The Descent of Man.


And yes, it’s one of the things that we’re pointing out the kids is, look, there’s a level of irony, right. When you’re in the middle of the Black Lives Matter, and the Me Too movement, and all these things that are going on. And yet, the very education system that is promoting those very things is basing science and reality on the conclusions of a guy who– they attack the founding fathers because, “€œWell, the founding fathers were racist and therefore we can’t believe what they said, and we should remove the things they did and etc., etc.”€ And yet they praised Darwin who, oh my gosh, his writings are certainly not good.

Benjamin Franklin on Evolution


Anyway, we kind of digressed getting into Darwin. But the point is when you start digging into history and realize these are not new arguments, and the founding fathers actually gave some pretty compelling thoughts about why some of these things were wrong. In fact, Benjamin Franklin, one of my favorite things that he said addressing this. He said, “€œIt might be judged an affront to your understanding should I go about to prove this first principle and that is the existence of a deity and that He is the creator of the universe. For I would suppose you ignorant of what all mankind and all ages have agreed in.”€

Now, he continues on with his writing, but it’s just hilarious. He says, look, I shouldn’t have to prove to you that God exists for that would basically mean you’re dumb and don’t know what everybody knows throughout all of history.

But when you start reading the founding fathers writings and how they address this it’s so obvious where their position is. And yet, we just don’t know history today. We don’t understand even the evolution debate or where it came from, or the fact that this is not a new debate. But history is full of these examples. And so certainly it”€™s fun, especially with young people, to get in and see what these old writings say, what the founding father said. And realize that not only are these not new arguments, for the founding fathers, this was settled for them pretty much way before Darwin even was a thought for anybody.

For the founding fathers, it was there is a Creator. And you see in the Declaration, right, there is a divine creator and He has given rights to man, etc.. This was very much what the founding fathers called a self-evident truth.


Alright, guys, that wraps that one up. We’re going to go to break. We”€™ve got one more question for our final segment. Stay with us. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live on Foundations of Freedom Thursday.


President Calvin Coolidge said, “€œThe more I study the Constitution, the more I realize that no other document devised by the hand of man has brought so much progress and happiness to humanity. To live under the American Constitution is the greatest political privilege that was ever accorded to the human race.”€

Avalon Project


Hey, guys, this is Tim Barton with WallBuilders. I know you hear my dad and Rick talk a lot about our founding fathers about the original intent of our nation, a constitutional heritage that we have. And really we’ve seen how far we slipped away from that. And I know a lot of us as we hear my dad and Rick talk think, “€œI wish there was a place that I could go where I could see these documents and I could read and learn about the founding fathers firsthand.  See the things they did.”€

I want to give you some websites today that can help you accomplish that very thing. If you get online you can go to places like Library of Congress and you can look under their century of lawmaking or historical documents. You can go to the Avalon Project, to the Founders Constitution, Google Books, or even the internet archives.  

Or you can just go to We have a section for our WallBuilders Library. And under that section we have different subgroups for historical documents, historical writings, even a place where you can get helpful links to find out more information about other websites.  Where you can do research for yourself and find the truth for yourself. Friends, this is the time that we need to know who we are and where we came from. is a great place to go.


Thomas Jefferson said, “€œIn questions of power, then, let no more be heard of confidence in man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.”€


Welcome back to WallBuilders Live on this Foundations of Freedom Thursday. Got time for one more of your questions, but send them in for next week: [email protected], that”€™s [email protected]. This one’s about a new york congressional election.

More Than Openly a Socialist


David, Tim, it says, “€œOn June 26, a young 28 years old congressional candidate by the name of Alexandria Cortez upset a 10 term congressman, Joseph Crowley, in New York. She has a moment behind her, the likes of the overwhelming support that Bernie Sanders received in 2016. Miss Cortez is likely to become a U.S. congresswoman representing New York and is vowing to push for the abolishment of immigration and customs enforcement.

“€œCan she actually succeed in doing this? And what strategies would you recommend for Republicans social organizations in New York to counter the influence she’s having on the Hispanic population as she overwhelmingly represents? Especially keeping in mind that many of those citizens are mostly behind her because the shared culture and language they share and therefore assume she would be the best representative to look out for their interests.”€

And, David, I’ll just add to the question my own question for you guys. I’ve also seen where now she’s actually endorsing in races and it’s carrying a lot of weight. She’s– the media is just making her a darling and she’s openly a socialist. So, this is an interesting phenomenon to watch.


Yes, she’s more than openly a socialist – it goes much closer to Marxism. But I wouldn’t say she’s carrying a lot of weight. I would say the media is giving her a lot of weight. And in places where that you’re going to have a lot of socialism and Marxism, like in inner New York City where this race occurred, it might carry weight-and that’s because there already that way anyway.

Now, I’ll point out this is a Democrat Party primary that had a very low turnout. The turnout was very low. It was like 20%, she won in that. So, we’re talking half of the Democratic primary turnout which is like only 10 percent of Democrats in that area. So, to make this a national movement, no, that doesn’t hold up. Because by the time you throw the general population in, including independents and Republicans, you’re talking down in the small single digit percentages.

One Fourth of One Percent


Let me kind of handle the question this way – Can she do-She’s going to abolish ICE, and border, and immigration, and everything else, can she do that? Alright, let’s just point out there”€™s 435 U.S. congressman. And that means that if you’re in Congress you are one fourth of one percent of the House of Representatives. So, if you’re one fourth of 1 percent, 435 members in the House, right off the bat you’re going to have to come up with a whole lot more than just you. Which means you’re going to have to get 219 in the House to agree with you. And the chances that you’re going to get that done are slim.

But then, if you can, you are going to have to get through 60 votes over in the Senate to also do that. And that’s not going to happen. And if you could do that, will President Trump sign that? So, can she abolish it? There’s a better chance that Austin is going to have a blizzard on August 31st than of her getting any traction on this whatsoever. Again, she’s a media darling and is put out there.

And by the way, if I can kind of go back for just a moment. She is one fourth of 1 percent of the U.S. House and she represents, or her district will be about 760,000 people. Now, if we were back to what the Constitution originally set up, and this was changed for this very reason, but the Constitution originally said for each 30,000 inhabitants you get a member of Congress. Do you know how many members we”€™d have in Congress today if we still had that 30,000 number instead of 760,000?


A few thousand too many.


You’d be looking at over 11,000 members in the House of Representatives. So, that is a huge, huge, huge, number. So, imagine how little impact you would have then. But even now her impact is going to be very, very, minimal. And the media is talking about her in a big way, but she’s only a fraction of even the Democrat Party – much less the nation itself.

Propped Up Media Darling Situation


Well, that’s good to hear. And I think, even the like you said, the propped up media darling situation is because the media might agree with her, but not that a significant portion of Americans across the country agree with her. A lot of great questions from the audience today. Great answers, guys, appreciate you all”€™s time on the foundations of freedom today.

Folks at home, if you want to dive further into the foundations of freedom, I recommend two resources for you. The first one at is actually a television series called Foundations of Freedom. And it actually has some special guests on it and dives into a lot of these topics. And it’s very entertaining, and educational, and inspiring, for you and your families. So, be sure and check that out, it’s also a good Sunday school program. It’s called Foundations of Freedom and it’s available at

And then the second tool is to be able to listen to these programs, and the previous programs if you might have missed those, at our website under the archives section. But then to share those with your friends and family. It’s a great way for you to come alongside us, for you to get educated as you listen those programs over and over again, but also to educate your friends and family and the people within your networks. So, share that on Facebook, use all your social media tools to get the word out there.

Alexandria Cortez Could Abolish Immigration?


And lastly, I know I said two things, but lastly, if you”€™ll come alongside us and help us to spread the word. You can do that financially by partnering with us at and being a monthly donor, or a one time donation. That helps us to add radio stations, to do more leadership programs, more legislator programs, pastors briefings, all the different things that WallBuilder is doing. Your help in doing that allows us to spread that word even more and do our part in restoring America’s Constitution.

Thanks so much for listening today. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live.


Samuel Adams said, “€œThe liberties of our Country and the freedom of our civil Constitution are worth defending against hazards. And it is our duty to defend them against all attacks.”€