Bibles, Millions of Them, Distributed to Eastern European Schools: Dirk Smith is with us from Eastern European Ministries to talk about the spread of Christianity in former Soviet Bloc countries.  Sometimes, other nations know our history better than we do. They”€™re learning from our past and implementing elements of a Christian society – including the Bible being taught in public schools! Join us now to learn more!

Air Date: 08/06/2018

Guest: Dirk Smith

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton

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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Rick:

Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live! Where we”€™re talking about today”€™s hottest topics on policy, faith, and the culture. We always do that from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

We’re here with David Barton, America’s premier historian and the founder of WallBuilders. Tim Barton is a national speaker and pastor, and the president of WallBuilders. And my name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas legislator.

You can find out more about us, and the organization, and the radio program, at WallBuildersLive.com, that’s our main website. And then WallBuilders.com, you can get a lot of great materials there to equip and inspire you and your family to help restore our Constitutional Republic.

But we’re going to be talking about some interesting things happening in America today and around the world. And we’ll take that biblical, historical, constitutional, view on all of them.

David:

As a matter of fact, Rick, let me jump in with one of those interesting things. This has not made much news, but this is kind of earth shattering. Let me just take you through this. In Georgia, the public schools are putting the Bible back in schools, they are hanging crosses on the walls in the school rooms, they’re putting the Ten Commandments up, and they’re beginning to teach Christianity in the schools – that’s in Georgia.

Rick:

Wait, wait. How are they doing that? I thought that was unconstitutional.

David:

Well, that’s in the country of Georgia in Europe.

Rick:

Aw, okay.

David:

So, Georgia in Europe–

Rick:

Different constitution.

David:

Here in America, we’re making sure kids don’t say God in public–

The

A Real Change Going On

Rick:

Right.

David:

–and that we don’t have any kind of prayer going on that anybody can see and–

Rick:

Not that– let’s not confuse our listeners– not that our Constitution would prevent the state of Georgia from doing that either. But the courtstitution given to us by that illustrious Supreme Court that we never empowered to do those things, it does prevent the state of Georgia from doing that, unfortunately. Anyway, go ahead.

David:

It does. But it’s, I think Newt Gingrich told me that as I recall it is like, oh yeah, you would never imagine that that when you said Georgia you think, “€œWow, that”€™s in America.”€ No, that’s a former Soviet country. And it’s interesting that all across Europe these former Soviet countries are having a real, I don’t want to use the term “€œrevival”€, I think the word “€œreformation”€ is a better term for it. There’s a real change going on there.

I remember Estonia they said, “€œMan, under Soviets it was so secular, abortion was so common, and as a result our birth rates declined, and we we need more births. And by the way, we should be protecting unborn life.”€ So, they actually meant it. There are new coins in Estonia to show an unborn child to remind you as you’re spending your money we want to protect unborn children.

Christianity Around the World

David:

And you look at other European nations. You look at Poland, Poland is becoming so openly Christian right now. They are so moral and sound in so many areas. The people in Poland recently voted to reinstate a sabbath. They want a seventh day off. They voted to not have abortion in the nation of Poland, that”€™s the nation voting. In Ukraine it’s more than 90 percent Christian, openly Christian, in Ukraine. You’ve got the same thing going in Hungary, and Romania, and Czechoslovakia, and Croatia. It is just absolutely fascinating to see what’s happening with these Christian nations.

I was just with the leader from an African nation, 83 percent Christian, and he’s talking about the Christian Reformation going there. And you know what’s interesting about every one of these nations is they love America. They think America is a Christian nation. They think America is what they want to be. And it”€™s like, oh, guys, you don’t know where we are right now. That’s what we used to be a couple of decades ago. But it is so crazy when we go to these countries they just absolutely love America.

Rick:

So, they’re looking at who we used to be, or I guess, looking at how we got the positive results as a nation that we”€™ve gotten over the last 200 years.

David:

And that’s it. That”€™s how we got the positive results and that’s what they want to be. They want to become strong too and they see that Christianity did that in America and that’s what they want.

Rick:

So, how do you get that? Well, one of the ways you get that is you bring the Bible into the classroom. That was part of the formula that the Founders gave us. In fact, David, what’s that quote by Benjamin Rush about– here’s the father of our public school system under the Constitution and he talks about teaching the Bible in schools.

David:

Well, not only talked about teaching it, he actually wrote a piece in 1791 giving essentially a dozen reasons we would never take it out of schools. So, he talked about the significance that would have on the culture, and on behavior, and everything else. It was inconceivable that we would do that and that’s why we even had a unanimous U.S. Supreme Court decision in 1844 the said, “€œWhoa, whoa, whoa, if you’re going to be a government operated school you’re going to teach the Bible. That’s what we do in America, it’s a government school.”€

The Courtstitution At It Again

David:

So, we really had that position for such a long time until the Supreme Court, again the courtstitution, changed our history, turned it on, and said, “€œWe can’t do that”€ in 1963. But the result they came from having people who were self-controlled and having people who were essentially moral. And what that did to business, and what that did to economics, and what that did to our military outlook which was so different than the tyranny that happened in so many male militaries elsewhere across Europe. They look at that and they say, “€That’s the kind of history we want, too.”€ Sure we had mistakes and we didn’t always do things right.

But as President Franklin Roosevelt pointed out whenever we had advances in America it was because we were following the Bible. And any time we didn’t advance it was because we weren’t following the Bible.

So, I find it interesting that other nations tend to know our history better than we ourselves do. For example, I was in Ukraine, I was shocked in driving across Ukraine all these billboards of George Washington in the Ukraine. I mean,  a lot of Americans don’t even know George Washington today. So, there is such a respect for our history and what we stand for that there is good stuff starting to happen in Europe and they do recognize the Bible is the key to that.

And one of our good friends, Dirk Smith, who works with a Bible Society, particularly in Eastern Europe, has got some just really phenomenal news on what’s happening in those countries and how they are coming to be what America used to be.

Rick:

Yes. So, if you’re a nation that wants to repeat a formula that produced good results, you look at that formula and say, “€œWhat are the pieces of that formula?”€ And the American formula, the secret sauce, that produced such great results, at the heart of that was most Americans knew the Bible, we taught it in our schools, we taught it in our homes. So, we lived out those biblical commands and that produced great results because that’s the instruction manual given to us by the Creator that made us. So, if we implement those things we get good results.

Now, these other countries are going, “€œWe want that too. And how do we get that?”€ Well, you get that by putting the Bible into your culture and into your classrooms. And Dirk Smith’s going to tell us about how millions of kids over in these former Soviet Bloc countries– it’s just incredible– are studying the Bible and they’re getting it at school.

Stay with us. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

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Rick:

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Rick:

Welcome back to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. Dirk Smith is back with us from Eastern European Ministries. Dirk, it’s been a couple of years has we had you on. And last time we had you on we were talking about the millions of Bibles being distributed across Eastern Europe – just phenomenal what’s happening there. Thanks for your time. Thanks for what you do.

Dirk Smith:

Hey thank you. Good to be back with you.

Rick:

Now, just to put this in context, these are former Soviet Union, Soviet Bloc, countries and you’re not just distributing Bibles – there are schools teaching the Bible. Have I got that right?

The Bible In Public Schools

Dirk Smith:

Yeah, that’s exactly right. We are helping the nations of Ukraine, Romania, and Croatia. All three are putting the Bible in the public schools and teaching the Bible as curriculum in their public schools.

Rick:

And we’re talking big numbers here since you guys have been doing this for decades, but over 4.5 million public school students–

Dirk Smith:

That”€™s right.

Rick:

–have received a Bible from you guys. That’s incredible.

Dirk Smith:

Yeah, that’s right. Yeah, Ukraine is probably the frontrunner. They are– at the end of 2016 we had supplied right half of the public schools with Bibles for their public schools. And at the end of “€˜17 we were– we”€™re obviously well above that now. “€˜17 was a crazy year for us. We increased our distribution ministry-wide by 59 percent.

And that’s not because we’re out knocking on doors and saying, “€œHey, would you like a Bible?”€ It’s because these nations are coming to us. Word”€™s getting out that they can actually get a Bible which they’ve never had in their language before. And the requests are just pouring in.

Rick:

Wow. Wow. Man, I was shocked last time. I’m still shocked because this is hard to comprehend. Here we are pushing the Bible out of the school in America even though it had such a tremendous positive impact on this culture, and this society, and was the foundation of the greatest nation in the history of the world. We’re pushing it away. These nations are saying, “€œWe want some! Bring it in! We know there’s answers here.”€

The Perfect Storm

Dirk Smith:

Yeah. And it’s the perfect storm, Rick. They had 70 years of atheism and they saw what that brought them.

Rick:

Yeah.

Dirk Smith:

Unfortunately, we’re headed down that same path. And if we don’t right the ship here in our country I don’t know what our rock bottom will be.

Rick:

Right.

Dirk Smith:

But they rock bottom and they have said, “€œNo more. We know this is the answer.”€ They’ve expanded it even in the nation of Ukraine. They originally were offering a– it was an elective class that was called “€œChristian Ethics”€. Ninety nine percent of the students took the class. They realized it was having such a positive effect. They said, “€œLet’s get away from this elective and let’s teach Christian Ethics in every subject in every classroom.”€

So, we now are assisting with seminars that are taking place in Ukraine teaching their teachers how to teach Christian ethics, or ethics based on the Bible. And to give their students a foundation in their nation that is a Christian worldview, a biblical worldview.

Rick:

How’s the– is there pushback over there? Do they not have the same naysayers that we do, or not as loud, I guess, screaming separation of church and state and all those things? What’s the response whenever these schools adopt these programs?

They”€™re Seeing the Results

Dirk Smith:

Well, they are seeing the results and they’re very pragmatic. For us, we tend to be academic in our faith. They are very experiential and they’re seeing the effects. So, the test scores are going up and the discipline problems are going down. So, even for those people who may not have as strong a faith, they’re saying, “€œWell, good grief. This just makes sense–“€

Rick:

Yeah.

Dirk Smith:

“€œ–let”€™s do this.”€ So, there is really not a lot of pushback. Now, what they will push back on is any proselyting. You will get pushback on proselyting. But again, as you and I both know, you put a Bible in somebody who can read and who’s intelligent and you don’t have the proselyte, God’s going to do the proselyting.

Rick:

Yeah. Yeah.

Dirk Smith:

Our words matter. We say, “€œHey, I taught and I converted–“€ I”€™ve got news for you, brother, I never converted anybody. God converted them all – the Spirit”€™s done every bit of it.

Rick:

That’s exactly right. That’s exactly right. I just love the pragmatism here that they’re literally looking at– they’re going, “€œOkay, what works, what doesn’t work. We saw what didn’t work. We experienced, if not us, our parents and our grandparents, the tremendous pain that comes from having a secular society. So, now we want to see what happens when we have a society that has a better foundation. And we know what we’ve seen around the world when a nation adopts the Bible, so we want to do that.”€

And it’s not just in theory. You’re saying they’re seeing the results in the students. And that’s why they’ve now gone from elective courses to, “€œHey, we want every kid to learn these biblical ethics.”€

Million Dollar Sunday

Dirk Smith:

Exactly. And they’re not forcing it down their throats. They’re giving them the option. If if a student says, “€œHey, I’d rather not take this.”€ Than they they don’t have to take it. So, it’s not forced, it’s not mandated, from that aspect. And I appreciate that. I’m glad that that’s not the case. God doesn’t force us to love Him. It’s an elective for us as well. And it just makes sense though for us to fall in love with the Creator who created everything around us. And it is a shame that in our country it’s not happening.

But we’re seeing it not only in Ukraine, our million dollar Sunday annual campaign, which kicks off September 1st, we’re putting Bibles in Poland, in Serbia, in Romania, in Croatia, Ukraine, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Russia. These are some of the highlighted projects that we’ve got in our million dollar Sunday campaign this year.

Rick:

And that’s a 2.4 million dollar goal that will result in hundreds of thousands of Bibles. What is the– how can people be a part of that? Is that something they can– pastors can obviously talk about Sunday morning. And as you say on your website, the ways to engage – pray, give, share. This million dollar Sunday is an ideal time to do that, right?

Dirk Smith:

Absolutely, yeah. They can get to our– we have two different websites. Of course there’s EEM.org and then there’s MillionDollarSunday.org. And MillionDollarSunday.org will give them all the resources they need. They can contact us. Everything is downloadable. There will be two videos out there that they can utilize to promote this. But again, five dollars provides one child, or one person, a Bible in their language that they’ve never had before. And it’s an awful lot of money.

An Opportunity to Unify

Dirk Smith:

And it’s an opportunity for us to unify. We’re seeing unity over there. I was just there about a month ago and was in Ukraine, was in Serbia, and was in Croatia, and I came away with this feeling, just this overwhelming feeling of unity. This desire to unify around the Bible and the recognition that the Bible is something we can all agree on. And we’ve got to get that into the hands of– they are feeling we’ve got to get that in the hands of our people. It’s a shame that here in our country, how many of them do I have on my bookshelf?

Rick:

Right.

Dirk Smith:

You probably are the same way.

Rick:

Right. Right.

Dirk Smith:

But how am I doing with that? Am I really all in or am I just punching a clock? Am I just going to– our language matters. We say, “€œI’m going to church”€. If you read the Bible that’s just messed up. You can’t go to church. We are the church.

Rick:

Yeah.

Dirk Smith:

It”€™s time that the church gets up and moves, and acts, and does, what Jesus envisioned us doing. And died for us to do.

Making A Difference in Nations

Rick:

Amen. Amen. Well, and even just today, folks at home, think about that. All those Bibles you”€™ve got sitting on the shelf, the days we go where we don’t even pick it up and spend time reading those love letters from God and getting that instruction for our lives. These people are hungry for even one of these Bibles. And Dirk, on the website, MillionDollarSunday.org, you can go to the donate page, it is so easy. Five bucks will supply a Bible. Fifty dollars for a library. A thousand for an entire school. You can be a part of this campaign that’s going to make a difference in nations.

And I can’t help but think, Dirk, this is an investment not just in the kingdom, but who knows–

Dirk Smith:

Yeah.

Rick:

–that it would be an investment in these kids in this generation that a generation from now, or two generations from now, will come back to our nation because we have believers in those countries. Whether it’s international negotiations or whatever it might be – we have no idea the puzzle pieces God’s putting together here.

Dirk Smith:

Amen.

Rick:

I’m amazed that the door is open to do this.

Dirk Smith:

Amen, Rick. One of my dear friends who is a Ukrainian Orthodox priest in Ukraine, his name is Dr. * and he made this statement about five years ago. He said, “€œYou know, Dirk, I firmly believe we can change the face of this nation in one generation if we get Bibles in the hands of our children.”€ And I thought, “€œYou know, *, you’re spot on, brother.”€

One Generation

Dirk Smith:

Because look what has happened in the United States. I’m about to turn 55 and in my lifetime we’ve pulled prayer out of the schools, we have pulled Bibles out of our schools, and look what’s happened. How–

Rick:

In one generation.

Dirk Smith:

How are we doing?

Rick:

Yeah.

Dirk Smith:

It’s very true – when we walk away from God, and again, I don’t ever think we will legislate morality. It is up to each individual to do what they need to do. But, boy, when we let God be pushed out of our society and we as His people don’t stand up and say, “€œNo, I’m going to love. I’m going to do what Jesus did and I’m going to follow His teachings and do it boldly.”€ I feel we are just grieving the Spirit–

Rick:

Yeah.

Dirk Smith:

–and He looks at us and says, “€œWow, what’s going on?”€

SPEAKER: M12

Amen, amen. No doubt. Dirk, before I let you go, just a quick note on Eastern European Ministries and its history. I didn’t realize you guys started in 1961 when you were having to sneak Bibles behind the Iron Curtain.

Dirk Smith:

Yeah, we began as Bible smugglers, Rick. We were smuggling them in spare tires, in car headliners, and all the rest of it. We had a little Bible and we still have a few of them, the originals, that we affectionately refer to as the Marlboro Bible because it was the size of a pack of cigarettes. And they knew they could smuggle those in pretty easily without the guards suspecting anything because they thought it was a pack of cigarettes. And, yeah, that’s the way this ministry began. Then, of course, the wall comes down and now we’re driving them across those same border checkpoints we smuggled them across in tractor truckloads.

Investing in the Kingdom, Investing in Our World

Rick:

Wow.

Dirk Smith:

And of course, now, we also believe in creating autonomy and I want to make that point. We don’t own any printing facilities. We put their people to work because from an economic perspective many of these countries, they appreciate having the jobs.

Rick:

Sure, yeah.

Dirk Smith:

I”€™ll put it that way. We print in country wherever we can.

Rick:

Love it, love it. Good stuff, Dirk. Fantastic, man, appreciate your time. MillionDollarSunday.org is the website. Folks, go there today, make a contribution, sponsor some of these Bibles over there. You’re investing in the kingdom and you’re investing in our world. We want these young people to get the instruction manual for life. We will see great results in their countries. And, boy, we’d love to see more of it in our country. Dirk Smith, appreciate you, man. We’ll get you back soon.

Dirk Smith:

Thanks, Rick. Appreciate it, buddy.

Rick:

Stay with us, folks. We”€™ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

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We Want To Hear Your Vet Story

Rick:

Hey friends! If you have been listening to WallBuilders Live for very long at all, you know how much we respect our veterans and how appreciative we are of the sacrifice they make to make our freedoms possible. One of the ways that we love to honor those veterans is to tell their stories here on WallBuilders Live.  Once in awhile, we get an opportunity to interview veterans that have served on those front lines that have made incredible sacrifices have amazing stories that we want to share with the American people.

One of the very special things we get to do is interview World War II veterans. You’ve heard those interviews here on WallBuilders Live, from folks that were in the Band of Brothers, to folks like Edgar Harrell that survived the Indianapolis to so many other great stories you heard on WallBuilders Live.

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Rick:

Welcome back to WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. Thanks to Dirk Smith for joining us today as well and bringing some great news in terms of the distribution of these Bibles across the Eastern European Bloc, former Soviet Union Block.

Back with David and Tim. Guys, I can’t help but think this is a, as I said, not just an investment into the kingdom, but this an investment culturally. You never know. David, I’ve heard you talk about how some of those African nations for instance that we went, and missionaries went, and sowed the gospel. And now there’s bishops and others from those nations that are now bringing truth back to America. Maybe that could happen with these Eastern European countries.

Tim:

Well, Rick, certainly it’s something that would be very exciting to see happen. It would be great to have more people promoting biblical truth in America. But I love what he said that where they used to have to smuggle Bibles in and they looked like little cigarette packs. And now they’re just driving them into the front gate. Open arms, welcome, “€œHey we need more of this. Bring it in.”€

Recognizing the Positive Benefits of the Bible

Tim:

And when you’re asking, “€œSo how are you marketing? And what are you doing to kind of publicize.?”€ No. They’re coming to us. They know who we are. They’re asking us to do this. It’s amazing the welcomeness to the Bible, the welcomeness to the gospel.

And ultimately, from a pragmatic level, it really reminded me of even someone like Benjamin Franklin as he promoted the Bible and argued for the benefits of what the Bible would produce. It really struck me that that’s where the pragmatic view of the founding fathers, even the ones like Franklin who was not a Christian, arguably, right, was not a Christian. Even they saw that just the practical benefits of what having a moral society would do. And ultimately there’s no higher morals than the moral teachings of Jesus.

So, let’s have kids learn what the Bible teaches. You don’t have to be a Christian, right, but they recognized at this point this shouldn’t just be something that schools could elect to do. No. Every school should be promoting this. And if a kid doesn”€™t want to take it they can opt out, that’s fine. But they recognize the practical benefit of Christianity which certainly is something that seems like we’ve lost in our culture today. But at least other nations in the world are recognizing the positive benefits of the Bible.

David:

Well, going back to what Dirk said about how they used to smuggle Bibles in. I hadn’t thought of this in years, but it”€™s a real flashback. Because the professor who taught me Russian while I was in college and a professor in education – I had two professors who were heroes in Russia, but they had both been banned from Russia because they were open Christians. And this was back in the dark days the Soviet Union, back before President Reagan ever took office.

So, we worked to smuggle Bibles into the Soviet Union. And I’ve still got some of those small Bibles that we worked to smuggle and I had not thought of that in years because things are so open now.

Getting the Good Stuff Going Up

David:

But, Rick, I thought the question you asked Dirk was really good about what kind of pushback do you get? And his answer was, “€œWell, the test scores are going up and the academic discipline is going down. So, we don’t get pushback.”€ Yeah, that”€™s right.

Rick:

They like those results.

David:

How about we do that in America too? It’s what we used to do.

Rick:

Yeah, yeah. You’d think we would want those positive results too. I thought, David, as he was describing it, it was almost like watching in reverse your book, America: To Pray or Not to Pray, your first book, remember?

David:

Yeah.

Rick:

How you did all the– you charted all those things. When we took it out here we saw the bad stuff go up and the good stuff go down. What they’re seeing is by putting it back in they get the exact opposite. They get the good stuff going up and the bad stuff going down. Imagine that.

Bibles, Millions of Them, Distributed to Eastern European Schools

David:

Imagine that. And by the way, in social science when you get a double correlation, that starts serving as proof. One correlation is not sufficient, but when you get a double correlation- in other words, you take it out and it goes wrong, you put it back in and it goes right- when you get that double correlation that becomes really, really, really, strong evidence. And that’s what they’re seen over there is we’ve shown how not to do it in recent decades they’re putting it back into how it used to be for America and how to do it. And that’s good for both nations – both America and those European nations for them to see both examples.

RIck:

EEM.org is their main website, Eastern European Ministries and the MillionDollarSunday website – we”€™ll have links to that as well at WallBuildersLive.com today. What a great investment in the kingdom and also the culture in general around the world. So, be sure and check those out today. Thank you so much for listening today. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live.