Standing Strong In Non-sensical Times – With Allie Stuckey At Patriot Academy: Should feelings take precedence over facts? Will fragmented worldviews be able to hold together in these times? How do you build a Biblical Worldview? What are helpful resources to understand what the Bible says about politics? Tune in to Allie Stuckey explain how to stay grounded and able to defend truth in crazy times.
Air Date: 10/21/2020
Guest: Allie Stuckey
On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton
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Transcription note: Â As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.
Faith and the Culture
You find your way to the intersection of faith and the culture. It’s WallBuilders Live where we’re talking about today’s hottest topics on policy, faith, the culture, the election, everything that’s happening out there, looking at it from a biblical, historical and constitutional perspective.
My name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas legislator and America’s Constitution coach. And normally, I’m here with David Barton, America’s premier historian and our founder of WallBuilders and with Tim Barton, national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders, but those guys have the day off. We are actually taking you back out to a great presentation at Patriot Academy by Allie Stuckey.
If you have not followed Allie Stuckey’s podcast, or read some of her articles, or even her new book, you got to do it. I’m telling you. Now, some people say okay, she’s all about women’s ministry. No, I’m telling you, she just has great perspective on the Scripture and its application to the hot topics of the day and I think everybody ought to be learning and listening. So great stuff.
And she shared with us at Patriot Academy, just some great information and really encouraging these young people to get engaged and make a difference in the culture. And we thought our listeners of WallBuilders Live needed the same encouragement especially as we approach the election with just a little bit of time left. This was a few weeks back that we had this opportunity to spend time with Allie.
We’ve got some other great presentations like this one from Patriot Academy. We’re going to be sharing Andrew Klavan with you here in a week or so. We had Dinesh D’souza, we had Dennis Prager, Jeremy Boreing, so many great speakers that came, Matt Walsh, Ben Shapiro, all of those are in the archives on our webpage right now.
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We’re going to take a quick break. When we come back, it’ll be Allie Stuckey at Patriot Academy.
A Moment from American History
This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. The year after the American war for independence ended, we begin addressing the issue of Muslim terrorists in North Africa who were attacking American ships and killing and enslaving American seamen.
Congress dispatched John Adams and Thomas Jefferson to negotiate peace, and when they asked the Muslim Ambassador the reason for the unprovoked attacks, he told them that it was written in their Quran that it was their right and duty to make war upon them whenever they could be found.
16 years of negotiations failed, and in 1801, America sent its military to crush the terrorists. When that war ended in 1805, the first American edition of the Quran was published, urging Americans to read the Quran to see for themselves that his teachings were incompatible with the safety and peace of non-Muslims.
To see the first American Qur’an and to get more information about America’s first war on Islamic terror, go to wallbuilders.com.
… here about our constitutional liberties who also care about any kind of disproportionate police force and want people to be treated fairly and equitably, and all of that. So there are people who are in this kind of nuanced middle between the crazies over to the left who want to defund the police, and then people who maybe are ignoring that we’re having any problems or issues that we need to talk through.
Well, there are a lot of honest people, a lot of honest Christians, a lot of honest conservatives that are just trying to wrestle with all of this coming from a place of what we just heard, facts and not feelings.
The Real Problem
And that seems to be the real problem, is that so many of our friends and I can only speak for myself and speak for at least the women that I know, we happen to be and I don’t mean this as a pejorative at all, more feeling and more emotional. And that’s a really good thing, that’s a gift and a strength that we women have.
But what I’ve noticed from a female perspective is a lot of women, conservative women, especially Christian woman, because they feel strongly, because we want to be empathetic and kind and loving and godly, we just kind of latch on to the most emotional solutions, the most emotional conversations about policy, about the current controversies, about issues instead of asking what are the actual facts.
What are the facts here? What are the statistics? And of course, when you do that, you’re often deemed unloving.
But my encouragement to you is that as you were seeing a lot of your friends who may be you thought that you are on the same page morally, ideologically, politically, theologically, as you were seeing them either go to the left or abandon the values that they once had to latch on to what are now popular talking points as they are kind of giving into emotionalism and they’re turning around to you and telling you that, oh, if you care about liberty, or a few questions, some of the activists on the Left in what their mission is, then you are not loving. My encouragement to you is to stay strong. This is the time now more than ever to know not just what you believe, but why you believe what you believe.
So the time has come and gone for us to have fragmented worldviews to where it’s like, okay, well, we believe this about the Second Amendment, we believe this about the First Amendment, we believe this about justice or social justice, we believe this about God, and it’s just kind of this mosaic of a worldview. That kind of worldview is going to fall apart under any kind of pressure. And what we’re feeling in America right now is a lot of pressure.
The Word of God as a Basis
And so for you to be able to stand the heat, for you to be able to stand strong amidst the pressure to give in to whatever the mainstream says the right problems and solutions are, you have to know not just what you believe but why you believe what you believe, you have to have a cohesive worldview so that even if you don’t know the answer to every problem, you can always go back to why you believe what you believe to be able to inform you.
So I as a Christian, the Word of God is the basis for my worldview. That doesn’t mean that everything I believe is perfect, or I’ve never been wrong, or I’m not still learning, because I am. Of course, I’m still learning how to view politics, view the government, view of the Constitution, all of it do justice through the Word of God and do that imperfectly, but that is my goal. And whenever I have a question about what is moral, what is good, what is just, what is the right reaction, what are good solutions? I first consult the Word of God because He is the Supreme moral lawgiver. Without Him, there is no moral law, there is no right and wrong, there is no truth and false.
So as a Christian, my encouragement to you is to ensure that you are building a cohesive worldview based on the inerrant and the objective Word of God, because we’re looking around and we’re seeing a world that is tossed to and fro by every new movement, by every new decision of the mob, by every new choice of Canceled culture. And they’re not grounded in any kind of objective truth. They don’t have a cohesive worldview. And how you stand up against that, how you stand up against the pressure is to have a cohesive worldview that is based on objective truth.
And so that’s my encouragement to you, is to stand strong, amidst the people who are trying to emotionally manipulate you and to agree with them, or else you’re bigot, to know what you believe in why you believe what you believe. For me, that means starting with understanding, knowing and studying the Bible, studying the Constitution, why are God given rights were given to us and why they are, in fact, God-given studying the policies that are pertinent to this present situation, maybe come up with some suggestions for solutions that you think could help people in the way of everyone being treated fairly and equitably, and all of that.
Allie’s Favorite Authors
And just make sure that you are hungry, and you are feeling a sense of urgency for knowledge, there have been so many people that have reached out to me asking me for resources to understand the issue of, for example, race in America, and all the stuff that we’re talking about right now.
And very rarely do you see in the mainstream or even churches recommending people like Thomas Sowell, like John McWhorter, like Walter Williams, like Jason Riley, all of these people who have written a lot about all the issues that we’re talking about right now, but no one wants to elevate their voices because they’re conservatives, and they have a different perspective.
So I encourage you to make sure that you are digging in, that you are learning, that you are taking in all the information that you possibly can, that you are sharpening your mind, and that you are equipped. I have talked to quite a few people over the past few days who believe in for example, defunding the police.
And I don’t always engage with the people who disagree with me, but I’ve really tried to have a conversation that okay, maybe I’m missing something, maybe there’s a logic behind this that I just don’t understand, and maybe there is but I have not heard it yet from the people that I have talked to. And again, I don’t mean to call people emotional in a pejorative way because not all emotions are bad, but feelings have to be subject to facts, or else they take us into really dangerous directions. And that’s what’s happening right now with the whole idea of defunding the police.
When you poke it just a little bit, what sounds really good, this very strong phrase against injustice, it sounds really good. But when you start to poke it just a little bit and you ask what happens if or what happens when, what happens to the women, to the children, to the elderly, to the disabled, what happens to those people?
Are they just supposed to call a social service worker and wait while the social worker comes and asks the armed robber to kindly leave their house? How is this going to work? And when you ask those questions, they don’t have an answer.
They claim that it’s from a position of privilege. That you’re even speaking in the first place, which is very clever and Marxist way to shut down any opposition in any conversation whatsoever.
No True Logic Behind the Left
But the fact of the matter is that there is no true logic behind the emotionalism that we’re seeing on the Left by way of solutions. So I would just encourage you to stay grounded, in fact, to stay grounded in the truth of God’s Word to again know why you believe what you believe. You will feel equipped, that will enable you to be able to speak the truth and gentleness and love without giving into this faulty idea that compassion has to come at the expense of facts and truth.
Too many people think it’s unfair, that it’s not right, to bring up statistics, to bring up facts to bring up truth because it’s unloving. That’s a lie. That’s just a way to shut you down so you don’t share your opinion. So stay strong, be grounded in the truth and I will answer a few of your questions, because you might have some questions on some specifics.
Yeah. Hey, Allie, first, can you address how you built a good worldview, right? Because when the crisis happens, sometimes you need that strong foundation already. What are some of your habits of learning? Like, as these young people are starting to really cement their worldview, not necessarily what you’ve read, but like your own habits, how much time you spend in those kind of things? Because it’s not just a college education, right? You’ve learned most of this on your own in your own study?
Yes, I would say when I was in college, so I graduated in 2014 and things obviously were political back then. That was the first time I ever voted in election when it was Romney versus Obama in 2012. So there were political things going on, but the environment, the tension that exists now didn’t exist then.
Building a Worldview
So I wasn’t paying as much attention then as I started to after college before during the 2016 election and that’s when I started feeling that first urge and surge have an urgency to learn more about the political system and the issues that are actually at stake and what the two parties really represent. Although I was familiar with that, I learned a lot more and myself after college, because I realized everything that was on the line.
So as far as learning for me and building a worldview, like I said, for me, that foundation starts with the only source of objective truth we have and that is the Word of God. And so I love the Bible. I’ve always loved the Bible. But again, it’s probably been since college and after college that I really dedicated a lot of time to studying theology. Most Christians do not know basic theology, and that affects your worldview, that affects what you think about politics, that affects what you think about culture. And I know you said, I don’t have to say what I read, but I do just want to offer a couple of resources that are really helpful to me.
So there are a couple of books obviously, the Bible itself, I have an ESV Study Bible, and it’s been very helpful to me. Politics ‑ According to the Bible by Wayne Grudem. Wayne Grudem is a wonderful resource and Politics ‑ According to the Bible is very helpful.
His bigger book, systematic theology is extremely helpful in understanding big questions that we have about creation, how the Bible was formed, why the Bible is trustworthy, questions about salvation, all of that, that you don’t think necessarily affect your political point of view or your views on social issues, but it’s all connected. It’s all connected. So those are two resources I highly recommend.
I also recommend just politically, some of the biggest influences on me. And you guys have probably all read Thomas Sowell, that he has probably been one of the, if not the biggest influence on how I think about economics and how I even think about a lot of social issues. And so he is someone that I highly recommend.
I mentioned earlier, John McWhorter, Jason Riley, Walter Williams, especially in this present moment, they have a lot to say about some of the racial tensions and the things that are going on. These are all really good resources.
I can recommend a podcast, not my podcast, I do recommend it. But one podcast that I really love that helps Christians build a worldview and approaching politics and things like that is called the Just Thinking Podcast. It’s by two guys and they are wonderful Christians who are really helpful in aiding Christians create a biblical worldview. So those are some of my resources.
I’m constantly taking in that kind of information. Now, I do listen to the other side. I mean, I still read the New York Times. I read the Washington Post. I watch a lot of the documentaries, the more social justice documentaries that people send me, it doesn’t change what I think because again, I’m grounded in what I know is true.
But I do think it’s important to at least entertain the ideas of the other side again so we can be as equipped as we possibly can when it comes to defending the truth. I do have questions over here on this side, I know.
Yeah. You get a kick out of this, Allie. So you started with Wayne and when I went to work for David Barton 25 years ago, “Systematic Theology” by Goodman was the first thing he made me read, not made me read. He said, hey, you got to read this. So anyway, good stuff, good stuff.
And Thomas Sowell, my oldest son is cheering you on right now because Thomas Sowell is his favorite absolutely and be required reading. Yeah. So let’s see, the box is kind of filling up here. I’m going to go, I guess a little bit backwards here. What if there isn’t a common foundation?
So you were talking about the worldview coming from a common foundation in this world we’re in now where we removed the Bible for so many years, and we have these different philosophies, what do you say to that?
How Do We Respond to Different Philosophies?
That is an excellent question. So we obviously cannot force someone to have our worldview, we cannot force someone to share the same basis for our worldview. There was a time in American history really not too long ago when the culture was generally or at least nominally Christian. And everyone kind of accepted the biblical idea that okay, at least there is a God.
Human beings are more important than animals; human beings are made to be free, these kind of generally biblical ideas people just have in their national consciousness. And thanks to the very hard work of post modernists in academia, and the media and all of our spheres of influence, that has kind of eroded.
And so we are very fragmented as a country because we can’t agree on the very basic and fundamental idea that God made us and therefore humans have an innate right, because we were given these rights by a Creator. And so because we don’t agree on that anymore, that of course, we can’t agree on rates anymore; of course, we can’t agree on policy anymore.
So all of that is absolutely true and we cannot force people to buy into that. You can try to compel people to see the logic behind your ideas, and how the ideas of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness that at least the idea that we have inherent rights, innate rights that cannot be arbitrarily taken away from us by the government, you can try to show people how that has led to the most human flourishing in the history of the world in the United States of America, of course.
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If we could all be on the page as a country simply saying, hey, we all want good things for humanity; we all want people to be free; we all want people to succeed; we just happen to disagree on what exactly that looks like and hey, let us empower the states and local governments as much as possible to make the decisions that are best for their local constituents, then that would be a good place to be and maybe the most hopeful we can be for what a united divided country would look like.
I don’t know, maybe I’m being negative. It’s part of my eschatology, my view of what the end times will be and what life will look like. I don’t know that we’re ever going to go back to being a so called Christian nation. I have a hard time seeing that happen. That’s okay though, the church is still going to be effective. God is still going to be faithful. We should still fight for liberty and there still victories to be won absolutely. But I don’t…
Duty is Ours; Results Are God’s
It doesn’t change our duty, does it? I mean, regardless of what we do right now today stays the same, “Duty is ours, results are God’s.”
Exactly, and I love that line. And I think that should give Christians a lot of peace because we look at a lot of these values slipping through our fingers and we’re wondering how the heck is that going to happen? But God is very clear. You put one foot in front of the other in obedience and you worry about today like Jesus says today has enough trouble for itself. Let tomorrow worry about itself, worry about tomorrow, tomorrow. A
nd so I think that is true for Christians today. I think we can feel very weighed down of thinking about the imminent arrival of socialism or just absolute godlessness and anarchy and a lot of the things we’re hearing about today. Even though it’s okay to be concerned with those things, and to see those things on the horizon and advocate for just laws and liberty and all of that good stuff, we can’t let that overwhelm us, and to paralyze us in fear right now, because then we won’t be doing the things we need to do to try to fight against that as much as we can.
Yeah, it’s good. Okay, let’s grab a couple these last ones real quick. We got two minutes here. Let’s see, what are some ways to help people believe in facts and not feelings? How do you shift them when they’re highly emotional into thinking about facts?
When We Don’t Want to Know the Truth
I have not had in my own conversations necessarily. Well, I won’t say I haven’t had great luck with that because I have been able to do that. I will just say that it’s very difficult and it depends. So it’s true that facts don’t care about your feelings. You’ve probably also heard feelings don’t care about your facts, which is unfortunately true. And the responsibility should be on the emotional person to subject their emotions to facts. But of course, that’s not always true. That’s been true of all of us.
When we’ve been in emotional situations, we don’t want to know the facts, we don’t want to know the truth, we feel good feeling the way that we feel so we just want our feelings to be validated. We’ve all been there. And especially when it comes to political situations, people are emotionally charged. They do not want their assumptions challenged because there is some kind of gratification that we get from emotional reactions, even that don’t have any grounding in truth.
So what I’ve tried to do because I’ve had several conversations over the past few days of people who disagree with me, who think that we shouldn’t be talking about okay, well, what does for example, systemic racism look like? What are some real tangible solutions? What are some real problems? People don’t want to hear that. They just want to have nebulous conversations without any solutions, with only propagating guilt and identity politics and things like that. And when you present any kind of facts or solutions, people get very upset.
And so when I’ve had these conversations with some of my friends over the past few days, I have had to validate their concerns, and to listen to their feelings, and to say that I understand their feelings and say, thank you for letting me know, here is my perspective. Now, I’m not saying that’s easy, I’m not saying they won’t be defensive. Because they, they still might, they still might, because what they want is for you to feel the exact same way that they do, and for you to believe the same things that they do.
Grounded in Truth, Open to Learn
And so when you don’t do that, they might still brush you off. But if you validate their concerns, and you let them know that you still… I have had to let several people know that we’ve had conversations about this. Hey, I love and respect you and I know that your heart and my heart are in the same spot.
We both want what is just in good and equitable. We both want that. Now, here’s where I disagree with the resources that you’re promoting or the narrative that you’re pushing or whatever or the meme that you’re sharing, the decontextualized Bible verse that you’re sharing.
And sometimes you just have to drop it. Sometimes you just have to say I love and respect you. We’re in different positions on this, but I look forward to talking more. And I’ve asked several people, please send me the resources that you have been learning from so I can understand your perspective. Again, knowing that I am grounded in truth, but also opening myself up to the fact that other people might share a perspective that allows me to learn something and learn something from their experiences. So…
It doesn’t sound like you’re afraid of a blind spot. Like you’re saying I might have a blind spot. I’m willing to listen just in case I do. And what you just said is a fantastic, tangible, tactical tool. And that is when you’re in that conversation is like Chris Voss, the great negotiator says, you acknowledge where they are, as you said, validate, there’s nothing wrong with that.
You can acknowledge, okay, now make sure I’m understand what you’re saying. You’re acknowledging and it doesn’t mean you’re agreeing, and at least allows for that conversation. I know people want to study more from us. So best place to get the podcast, the book or to follow you, to catch up on the podcast, so where they can get archives, all of that?
Yes. So Relatable can be listened to wherever you get your podcast, Apple podcast, Spotify, Google Play, but you can also watch on my YouTube channel, my Allie Beth Stuckey YouTube channel. You can listen at 6am, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, or that’s when it comes out. It’s of course available forever. And then the YouTube video is published at 2pm Monday, Wednesday, Friday Central Time. And so that’s where you can find me, you can go to AllieBethStuckey.com and a lot of my resources will be there in the coming days.
And it’s okay for Christian guys too, right? Where are you…
It’s not good for Christian guys. I am talking to Christian girls like when I am talking, but there are a lot of men, a lot of young men that listen to the podcast. And of course, they are welcome. And one more thing, I do have a book that’s coming out August 11 that’s available for pre ordered, it’s called “You’re Not Enough (And That’s Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love”, again, mostly targeted at women, but because we are focusing on the gospel, it is of course, applicable to anyone who wants to read it. So that’s it…
I love it. Are you going to give an audible version on that too?
The Importance Of A Biblical Worldview – With Allie Stuckey At Patriot Academy
Yes. Yes. Yes.
Excellent. Alright, Allie, thank you so much.
We’re out of time for today here on WallBuilders Live. That was Allie Stuckey speaking to the Patriot Academy and we wanted to bring that to you, great information. Check out her blog, check out her articles. We really appreciate her spending time with us. We appreciate you being here today, and encourage you to go to wallbuilderslive.com today for more of our programs. You can do that in the archive section and that’s also where you can make that contribution.
And it’s where you can learn more about the different programs that we’re doing, from helping pastors when we take them to DC to learn that history and bring that biblical perspective and constitutional and historical perspective, as well as the youth leadership we do to Patriot Academy and the WallBuilders leadership training program, and even our legislators training programs. There’s a lot of great information there. Check it out at wallbuilderslive.com.
We appreciate you listening today to WallBuilders Live.