Cancel Culture-Perception Is Not Always Reality-With Roger Williams – Questions are important. Congressman Roger Williams is a victim of the cancel culture around him for standing for what he believed. Tune in to hear the full story!

Air Date: 02/15/2021

Guest: Congressman Roger Williams

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

 

Rick:

You find your way to the intersection of faith and the culture. It’s WallBuilders Live, where we’re talking about the hottest topics of the day from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective. Good to have you with us. 

My name is Rick Green. I’m a former Texas legislator and America’s Constitution coach. And I have the honor of being here with Tim Barton. He’s a national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. And David Barton. He’s America’s premier historian and our founder of WallBuilders. WallBuilders, by the way, comes from that scripture in Nehemiah that says, arise and rebuild the walls, that we may no longer be of reproach. This was founded 30 years ago by David Barton, for the very purpose of rebuilding the foundations in America. 

That scripture Nehemiah, if you kind of get a time machine and you go back to that day, if your city did not have those outer walls, you would be run over. You needed those walls for protection, for strength. And in the same way, our value system, our foundation in America, that’s what makes us strong. And when we lose the foundational values, when we lose the principles, the timeless principles of liberty that made America the most powerful, most free, most benevolent nation in the history of the world, if we lose the principles, then we lose the great benefits that come from those principles. And so WallBuilders is all about restoring those principles, restoring our constitutional republic by restoring the timeless principles of liberty upon which our nation was built. Those are, of course, biblical principles. 

So we’re sure glad you’re here with us. We always look at these things from, you know, whatever the hot topic is. And it could have to do with politics, it could be some sort of policy, it could be an election issue, it could be a cultural issue locally, and entertainment issue, you name it. But we are always going to take that biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective. And we’re glad you’re here to join us in that conversation. Check us out at wallbuilderslive.com for more information. And also, that’s where you can get archives of the program, you can get a list of stations, we’re on around the country, and you can make that one-time or monthly contribution. 

I got to pause for a second and say, listen, if you want to have truth, if you want to have more people educated on the truth of our country, then come alongside us, support us financially, and that basically makes you a force multiplier. It allows you to help us multiply our voice, reach more people, and therefore educate more people on how to be good biblical citizens in modern America. I hope you’ll consider doing that today at wallbuilderslive.com. 

Alright, guys. Later in the program, Roger Williams will be joining us, congressman from Texas, actually, my Congressman, and we’re going to talk a little bit about the canceled culture going after him. He’s on the Board of Regents there at Texas Christian University. Here in Texas, it’s his alma mater, he’s been on it for 20 years big donor to them in previous years. He was a big car dealer out of the Dallas area. And all because he voted with 140, I think colleagues to say, hey, I want to know more about this election before we certify these electoral votes, they are wanting to remove him from the board there from the Board of Regents at TCU. So tell you guys, the canceled culture continues. They’re wanting to remove congressmen from Congress, take committees away from people. I mean, it just seems non-stop. It’s going to be interesting to see what Roger says about it and how he’s fighting back on this.

Tim:

Yeah, it’s also interesting to see how the media can miss portray and mischaracterize some of what happened. Because if you look at Ted Cruz, when Ted Cruz was the senator there who lended his voice to say we want to go back and check some of these, we call into question some of what happened, you have one side who on extremes, one side on the extreme says this election was fraudulent, Donald Trump won, there’s no way Biden got 80 million votes. And I think there’s probably some level of validity and truth in that, we don’t know how much of that is true. But certainly, we know that fraud did occur on some level. Well, the other end, the other extreme says, there was no fraud, nothing bad happened. And anybody that says there was fraud or anything bad happen, you are attacking the Republic, and then they’ll throw all kinds of names against you. 

Well, Ted Cruz had a very good idea that let’s assign a committee and let’s go and let’s just investigate for a few days. Let’s do a full investigation to make sure we have all the information, and then we can make educated decision. Ted Cruz has been villainized for having a position that would seem totally logical on what’s going on. And the reason I bring this up, is the media is able to portray certain things that are not villainesque, right, that are not vile, that are not problems, but they can portray it. They can make somebody appear very bad in even unrealistic ways. And by the way, this can go for both sides. 

Because one of the things right now that we’ve seen in the last couple of days is Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has taken a lot of fire. There’s been a lot of scrutiny on the fact that she talked about she was there at the Capitol  complex on the January 6th event when the writers came and she told how she felt etc, etc, etc. Well, there’s been some on the right who have said she said she was in the Capitol building and surrounded by these protesters. Well, it’s not exactly what she said, it was the impression she gave perhaps. 

Certainly, looking at the emotions that she was expressing maybe, considering the fact that she was in a cannon house office building which was over a quarter mile away from where this was happening, and nobody breached a cannon house office building and they were police officers, and they were there to keep them safe and then they did escort them to an even safer location, she certainly was not endangered the same level as the people who were actually in the actual Capitol building. But this is where even what she said might have been misleading. But she did not say she was in the Capitol building, at least not in this long Instagram video she posted. And that’s what people are criticizing. 

But here’s the point. As the media has a lot of power to establish perception, and perception is not always reality. And that’s what I think happened a lot with Roger Williams, that there was a perception that he did something that arguably he really didn’t do. But because perception often determines people’s reality of what they believe did or didn’t happen, it’s why you see in TCU, for example, where you had so many faculty coming out and saying that this guy should be kicked off of everything related to TCU. He doesn’t reflect us. It became a very political game. 

And all of a sudden, he was on the wrong side of the political aisle, even though all he did was point out something very practical, that it looks like in some of these states there were some questions surrounding what happened. Maybe there were some fraud, things that would seem very logical and very practical, but because of the way media can pay perception, because of the political divide we currently are in, if you’re on the wrong side, then you need to be canceled. This is where not only is canceled culture dangerous, but the ability of social media and media to craft a narrative that is not always honest, makes cancel culture even more dangerous. Because a picture can be painted a view that causes you to be canceled, that none of that is reality and shouldn’t have happened.

David:

But just think about the culture that you would have if you were not allowed to question anything, if you’re not allowed to question the popular drive or the narrative this going on, if you’re not allowed to question it. And by the way, Roger Williams, probably had a really good background for raising some questions, which he did. 

He was the Secretary of State in Texas for a number of years, which meant he was in charge of running elections in Texas. So unlike most congressmen that are in Washington, DC, he actually has on the ground experience of working with elections and election procedures and voting machines and irregularities and what can happen and what can’t happen. And he probably saw stuff that just kind of made him scratch his head a bit and saying, oh, wait a minute, let’s look into this a little bit because this doesn’t make sense. I mean, he has an experience base, and now we’re saying, well, we’re canceling you and your experience base, we don’t care what experience you’ve had, or what questions you want to raise. You can’t question the narrative that we’re driving.

I mean, you can just use your imagination to see where that would lead in so many areas. You want to be able to raise questions and to object things along the way and make people think about it. And that’s what Jesus often did with his questions as he made you think, questions make you think. And so to not even be able to question something, takes out the possibility that that the narrative you’re hearing might not be true. But if you question it, and come back and prove it true, great, you know it’s true. It stands on its own. But when you have to support a narrative by removing opposition, that’s a real problem. And that’s part of what’s going on with trying to cancel Roger Williams for having raised questions. 

And he was known at the extreme ends that we saw some people claiming there was absolutely 100% fraud everywhere. What he was saying, he was saying, let’s look at this. And Tim, as you said, it’s like Ted Cruz, let’s just investigate. Let’s see if we can get to the bottom of this. Let’s see what we can find and then we can all be content with what the results are once we know what truth is. But Roger Williams has been attacked in a way that we really haven’t seen in a good while with congressman for simply standing in the way that he stood.

Rick:

But we’ll get it straight from the congressman. Stay with us, folks, Roger Williams with us when we return on WallBuilders Live.

BREAK

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. Alexia de Tocqueville, a political official from France traveled to the United States in 1831 and penned his observations in the now famous book, Democracy in America. Being from France, what he found in America was completely unexpected to him. 

He reported, “Upon my arrival in the United States, the religious aspect of the country was the first thing that struck my attention. And the longer I stayed there, the more I perceived the great political consequences resulting from this. In France, I’d almost always seen the spirit of religion and the spirit of freedom, marching in opposite directions. But in America, I found that they were intimately united and that they reigned in common over the same country.” de Tocqueville recognized that it was biblical Christianity and the morals it produced that made America great. 

For more information about Alexia Tocqueville and the positive influence of Christianity in early America, go to wallbuilders.com

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. Thrilled to have congressman Roger Williams with us. Congressman, always good to have you, sir. Thanks for coming on the program today.

Roger:

Well, thank you, Rick. And we sure appreciate what you guys are doing for us. Thank you. 

Rick:

Well, I just want to tell you how proud I was just watching you over the last couple of months and just thrilled to have you as my congressman, and I appreciate all that you do. I know you’ve been putting some tough spots, and you’ve taken a principled stand and for just being willing to ask questions, basically, which is really what was happening with the whole vote on the electoral college and say, I want to know more about what happened in the States. Looks like your alma mater, or at least the faculty at your alma mater, is at least threatening to ask that you be removed on the Board of Regents there. So tell us a little bit more about what’s happening there, and has that quieted down yet?

Roger:

Well, first of all, on the vote, we voted not to impeach the president, which is the right vote, of course. And then I voted to take another look see at the Arizona and Pennsylvania counts. I looked at it not from a standpoint of trying to overturn an election. But as you know, I was former Secretary of State, and it would be a natural for me to want to see where there were some problems. And that’s why I made that vote, which is the right vote. 

But it was surprising, because the next day, the faculty, not the Board of Trustees in which I’m a member, not the chancellor, which is the best we got in the country, the faculty decided that because I didn’t necessarily carry their political persuasions, that I should not be on the board. Well, that’s really different thing. While we’ve got to think our freedom of speech we’re supposed to be teaching that in our colleges across the country, so they challenged me, wanted me to be removed from the board. And kind of the rest is history, has been news for about the last two weeks. And we’ve talked a lot about it. It’s not about me, but it is about a freedom of speech issue. 

And faculties across the country, Rick, across the country, as you know, are teaching from the left side of the book. And a lot of the faculty has tenure. I think that it was 10 years, not something we have in real life for our Main Street, America. And that makes them not responsible to anybody. And the idea that you can’t agree to disagree, it bothers me because you wonder, what are the colleges teaching in our schools, right? 

Rick:

Yeah. Yeah.

Roger:

What are they teaching our kids if you can’t agree to disagree? We need to be given everybody the option, let these young men and women choose what direction they want to go, and not make up history, but talk about history and real history. So that’s been the issue. So we’ll see what happens. I mean, got a ton of support from my fellow trustees, and thousands and thousands of communications in support of what we’re doing. And what we’re doing is nothing, right. It’s freedom of speech…

Rick:

That’s exactly right.

Roger:

That’s what our country is built on. So it’s going to be interesting to see, I think the faculty was meeting the night and they offered an amendment that no elected political officials can serve on the board at TCU, which would never pass our Board of Trustees. I’m convinced to that. And it’s just another way of trying to get back at me and the way I think. And I’ve been on the board 20 years, and 20 years ago, I was not an elected official. But everybody know, for 20 years, I’m strong conservative. So why now, right? Well, I think we know why is that the educational world has never been Trump friendly, or conservative friendly, and they tied me up in that. So here we’re going.

Rick:

Yeah. And that’s part of why we wanted to have you on because it is the bigger picture issue of restoring civil discourse, being able to discuss things, being able to listen when somebody doesn’t agree with you, and give them a chance to speak. And it’s that silencing of the opposition and punishment for simply speaking up and saying, hey, I got questions, and how did you come to that conclusion and those kind of things, that’s the big concern, I think, for everybody is that this starts being carried out and people losing their jobs for having opinions and all of that. So what do we do to get back to a place of civil discourse and not have this just complete silence, you know, of anybody that disagrees with you?

Roger:

Well, it’s cancel culture, as you know, we’re right in the middle of it. We’ve got to get back there quick. And you know, both sides, I mean, have to get a hold of ourselves and like you say simply agree to disagree. Of course, personally, I’d love to see more business people running for congress running for local office or whatever. But you know, business people for the nature of this sport, if you want to look at it that way, and you guys are involved in it, why the heck would you do it, right? I mean, your family gets attacked, your home gets attacked. In my case, I’ve been wounded in a baseball game with shrapnel. I’ve been in a train wreck. I’ve been robbed on the streets of Washington. And it goes on and on. So, why would anybody do this, right?

Rick:

Right. 

Roger:

But you know, we have to understand that, that this is a country that has proven through the years that the last government is best government. We’re Christian-Judeo principled. We agree to disagree. But at the end of the day, we have the Constitution we support. And we’ve got to get back to that. You know, like right now I’m watching, I’ll be on the floor tonight where congresswoman Greene from Georgia has made some statements that many of us may not agree with. 

But at the same time, the Democrats are trying to get her off for committees, which is not the right thing to do. She was elected by almost a million people in Georgia, they need to decide what’s right and what’s wrong. They’ve totally gone around over ethics. The ethics committee we have they just run over them and that’s a bipartisan committee. They’ve chosen not to let anybody have their due process. So it’s a runaway freight train right now. And Joe Biden want to talk about unity, well, he gave that speech, and two hours later, he was dividing our country, did away with the pipeline, and on and on and on. So what do we need to do? 

I think we just need to get more and more people engaged in the process, and understand what the process is, and get involved. If we don’t have people that want to be engaged that understand conservative values, understand center left, center right, etc, we could have a problem.

Rick:

Let me ask you this before I let you go. How’s the temperature, the tone, the attitude of the group of guys and gals like yourself that are conservatives, with obviously big hit here with Biden taking over the presidency and the Democrats maintaining the majority in the House and getting a tie in the Senate that that gives them a essentially the majority? A few days have passed, or a week or two into this, are we starting to get our legs under says, the opposition here and are conservatives? I guess I’m asking you for some behind the scenes on how you guys are feeling. And are you starting to find some cohesiveness there with conservatives?

Roger:

Well, we are. We’re coming together. But let me take you back to back November and a lot of your listeners will, and many of us have already forgotten this, but we got to go back. You know, November 3rd was a really good day for conservatives.

Rick:

That’s right. That’s right.

Roger:

If you slide the presidential race over a minute, and we just talked about that, it was a great day for conservatives. I mean, we lost nobody. No income that lost are bigger. Okay? And we gained seats and Pelosi is sitting on a very, very thin margin here in the House. To get anything passed, she’s going to have to have Republicans and more than likely she’s not going to get that. So we had a very, very good day. And I think that result was a statement to deliver Left wing, that this is not where our country is going.

Rick:

And unexpected, right, Roger, I mean, you we were supposed to lose 20 something seats, I mean, a lot of the good folks, I mean, it was the exact opposite of what everybody said was going to happen?

Roger:

All the pollsters were wrong. I mean, they didn’t get it. And it just shows you a lot of people don’t want to, in many cases, they’re afraid to say they’re conservative. And so pollsters got it wrong. You’re exactly right, we’re going to lose 30 seats, it was going to be a bloodbath. And it was not. Okay. So now we fast forward to 2022, we got the right message. I mean, look at the message, lower taxes, less government, cut spending, defend borders, listen to your generals, understand the 10th Amendment, stand with Israel, of stand with police. That’s the message and it’s a winning message. So that hadn’t changed. We just have to make sure that we get out in two years, and that we get that message out. We do it in a cohesive way. We do it with a smile on our face. We pick up two or three extra seats in Texas, hopefully, Republican seats, which I think they will be, and we get the House of Representatives back. And if we don’t get the Senate, and of course, they’ll have the White House, we stop the nonsense. That’s how close we are.

Rick:

I love it. I love it. Well, man, we’re with you, and certainly looking forward to that happening, but also in the meantime, cheering you guys on and helping in any way we can to give you what you need to help stop some of that nonsense even as the minority party. So thanks for what you’re doing, man. And I know, I mean, you listed some of the things. I know it’s worse than that. I know, it’s a tough spot to be in and so we’re thankful for you. We need more patriots like you. So we appreciate you, sir. Thank you for coming on the program today.

Roger:

Thank you, Rick. God bless.

Rick:

Stay with us, folks, we’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton. 

BREAK

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Rick:

We’re back here on WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. Thanks to congressman Roger Williams, for joining us today as well. I got to tell you guys, I honestly did, I was watching as though the whole voting was taking place and objections were taking place. And when Roger got up and gave his speech about why he thought this needed to be looked into more, I was proud that that was my congressman. I was like, thank you for taking the stance. Same way I felt when Ted Cruz stood up with regard to this. 

So I think, Tim, what you said at the top of the program about how the media distorts these things and makes it look like something happened that didn’t even happen is absolutely right. And then it has real world effect. I mean, on Roger, it’s a position that he doesn’t depend on that position at all for his livelihood. But think of all the people that are now losing their jobs, losing all kinds of positions and different things over lies about what they did or did not do?

David:

Well, I thought Roger made some really powerful points. And one is if you know this way you’re going to be treated, tell me who’s going to run for office? Who wants to step up and face this kind of stuff for expressing your opinions, expressing your beliefs, expressing what you were elected to do and that was bring your viewpoint into the debate? So he made a great point that this is a real chilling effect in trying to get good average normal people run for office. 

But the thing that stood out to me as he was going through this is he’s got support from the administration, he’s got support from the other trustees, he’s got support from the alumni; he’s got support, except from the faculty, the faculty. Now, think about that, that these are the radical guys driving the debate, which probably explains why right now we know in polling, 53% of college students oppose free speech, 19% of college students think that violence is an acceptable response to free speech they disagree with. Where would they get those crazy ideas? Faculty. So look at how radical the faculty is compared to where the rest of the administration is. 

Tim:

And he pointed out that faculty can receive tenure, which is not a real world thing. Only in academia, can you be put in a position where well, you’ve been here long enough, you can’t be fired no matter what you do, or how incompetent you are. I had this experience when I was in college, where there was a professor who literally was crazy. And I went to the head of the program. It was a grad school program, went to the head of the grad program and I said, hey, this is what I’m dealing with. And they said, man, I’m so sorry. We know, the guy’s crazy, but we can’t do anything. He’s tenured. 

And this was the first encounter for me with this notion of tenure. And I thought, wait a second, you just acknowledged to me he’s crazy. Like, you know, he’s crazy, but you can’t do anything because he’s tenured! This is where we could look at a lot of the academic system. And it’s a reason we’ve talked about on this program before, there’s a lot of things in academia that we criticize, because there’s a lot of things in the system that don’t make sense. There’s a lot of things in the public school system that don’t make sense. There’s a lot of things in universities that don’t make sense. This is not being the least of them that you now I have professors who know that they don’t have to be accountable for what they say, and therefore they can say whatever they want. So they can promote ideas that are absolutely terrible and destructive, and nonsensical, but they don’t have to worry about any level of accountability because they’re not going to lose their job over it. And this is what our kids are getting every day when they go to college.

David:

You know, it’s interesting because the university recognizes it’s accountable. After this happened, Roger Williams, one of the state representatives here in Texas, called the Chancellor of the University and told the Chancellor hey, you know, I just want to remind you about state equalization grants, and Roger Williams. 

Now, that doesn’t mean a lot to a lot of people, but that’s a shot over the bow. State equalization grant, TCU gets hundreds of millions of dollars a year from the state of Texas in grants for students. And this legislative says, hey, we’re just reminding you, you get a lot of money from us and you’re going to throw a guy potentially off the trustees because of what he believes? You just need to know there could be consequences to that. Well, Tim, as you just went through, there’s no consequences to faculty, so they can be crazy. But administration has to live in a real world where there are consequences. And we really do need to get public schools and universities, everything else back to accountability, which is way the rest of the world works. And I think Roger comes out of this okay. I think he’s going to be fine. But just the fact that he’s having to go through this drama is pretty unbelievable.

Rick:

Yeah, and this stuff doesn’t stop until we stop it. And that requires people like Roger being willing to stand up and say no, not to cower down, not to back off, but to continue speaking truth, continue fighting for truth. That’s what we do here at WallBuilders. We hope that you’ll help us do that. Go to wallbuilderslive.com today, make that one-time or monthly contribution. And just as important, grab those programs and share them with your friends and family. Use that website as a place where you can get this information and then be a force multiplier by getting it into the hands of as many people as possible. Check it out today at wallbuilderslive.com.

Thanks so much for listening. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live.

 

You find your way to the intersection of faith and the culture. It’s WallBuilders Live, where we’re talking about the hottest topics of the day from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective. Good to have you with us.

My name is Rick Green. I’m a former Texas legislator and America’s Constitution coach. And I have the honor of being here with Tim Barton. He’s a national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. And David Barton. He’s America’s premier historian and our founder of WallBuilders. WallBuilders, by the way, comes from that scripture in Nehemiah that says, arise and rebuild the walls, that we may no longer be of reproach. This was founded 30 years ago by David Barton, for the very purpose of rebuilding the foundations in America.

That scripture Nehemiah, if you kind of get a time machine and you go back to that day, if your city did not have those outer walls, you would be run over. You needed those walls for protection, for strength. And in the same way, our value system, our foundation in America, that’s what makes us strong. And when we lose the foundational values, when we lose the principles, the timeless principles of liberty that made America the most powerful, most free, most benevolent nation in the history of the world, if we lose the principles, then we lose the great benefits that come from those principles. And so WallBuilders is all about restoring those principles, restoring our constitutional republic by restoring the timeless principles of liberty upon which our nation was built. Those are, of course, biblical principles.

So we’re sure glad you’re here with us. We always look at these things from, you know, whatever the hot topic is. And it could have to do with politics, it could be some sort of policy, it could be an election issue, it could be a cultural issue locally, and entertainment issue, you name it. But we are always going to take that biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective. And we’re glad you’re here to join us in that conversation. Check us out at wallbuilderslive.com for more information. And also, that’s where you can get archives of the program, you can get a list of stations, we’re on around the country, and you can make that one-time or monthly contribution.

I got to pause for a second and say, listen, if you want to have truth, if you want to have more people educated on the truth of our country, then come alongside us, support us financially, and that basically makes you a force multiplier. It allows you to help us multiply our voice, reach more people, and therefore educate more people on how to be good biblical citizens in modern America. I hope you’ll consider doing that today at wallbuilderslive.com.

Alright, guys. Later in the program, Roger Williams will be joining us, congressman from Texas, actually, my Congressman, and we’re going to talk a little bit about the canceled culture going after him. He’s on the Board of Regents there at Texas Christian University. Here in Texas, it’s his alma mater, he’s been on it for 20 years big donor to them in previous years. He was a big car dealer out of the Dallas area. And all because he voted with 140, I think colleagues to say, hey, I want to know more about this election before we certify these electoral votes, they are wanting to remove him from the board there from the Board of Regents at TCU. So tell you guys, the canceled culture continues. They’re wanting to remove congressmen from Congress, take committees away from people. I mean, it just seems non-stop. It’s going to be interesting to see what Roger says about it and how he’s fighting back on this.

Tim:

Yeah, it’s also interesting to see how the media can miss portray and mischaracterize some of what happened. Because if you look at Ted Cruz, when Ted Cruz was the senator there who lended his voice to say we want to go back and check some of these, we call into question some of what happened, you have one side who on extremes, one side on the extreme says this election was fraudulent, Donald Trump won, there’s no way Biden got 80 million votes. And I think there’s probably some level of validity and truth in that, we don’t know how much of that is true. But certainly, we know that fraud did occur on some level. Well, the other end, the other extreme says, there was no fraud, nothing bad happened. And anybody that says there was fraud or anything bad happen, you are attacking the Republic, and then they’ll throw all kinds of names against you.

Well, Ted Cruz had a very good idea that let’s assign a committee and let’s go and let’s just investigate for a few days. Let’s do a full investigation to make sure we have all the information, and then we can make educated decision. Ted Cruz has been villainized for having a position that would seem totally logical on what’s going on. And the reason I bring this up, is the media is able to portray certain things that are not villainesque, right, that are not vile, that are not problems, but they can portray it. They can make somebody appear very bad in even unrealistic ways. And by the way, this can go for both sides.

Because one of the things right now that we’ve seen in the last couple of days is Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has taken a lot of fire. There’s been a lot of scrutiny on the fact that she talked about she was there at the Capitol  complex on the January 6th event when the writers came and she told how she felt etc, etc, etc. Well, there’s been some on the right who have said she said she was in the Capitol building and surrounded by these protesters. Well, it’s not exactly what she said, it was the impression she gave perhaps.

Certainly, looking at the emotions that she was expressing maybe, considering the fact that she was in a cannon house office building which was over a quarter mile away from where this was happening, and nobody breached a cannon house office building and they were police officers, and they were there to keep them safe and then they did escort them to an even safer location, she certainly was not endangered the same level as the people who were actually in the actual Capitol building. But this is where even what she said might have been misleading. But she did not say she was in the Capitol building, at least not in this long Instagram video she posted. And that’s what people are criticizing.

But here’s the point. As the media has a lot of power to establish perception, and perception is not always reality. And that’s what I think happened a lot with Roger Williams, that there was a perception that he did something that arguably he really didn’t do. But because perception often determines people’s reality of what they believe did or didn’t happen, it’s why you see in TCU, for example, where you had so many faculty coming out and saying that this guy should be kicked off of everything related to TCU. He doesn’t reflect us. It became a very political game.

And all of a sudden, he was on the wrong side of the political aisle, even though all he did was point out something very practical, that it looks like in some of these states there were some questions surrounding what happened. Maybe there were some fraud, things that would seem very logical and very practical, but because of the way media can pay perception, because of the political divide we currently are in, if you’re on the wrong side, then you need to be canceled. This is where not only is canceled culture dangerous, but the ability of social media and media to craft a narrative that is not always honest, makes cancel culture even more dangerous. Because a picture can be painted a view that causes you to be canceled, that none of that is reality and shouldn’t have happened.

David:

But just think about the culture that you would have if you were not allowed to question anything, if you’re not allowed to question the popular drive or the narrative this going on, if you’re not allowed to question it. And by the way, Roger Williams, probably had a really good background for raising some questions, which he did.

He was the Secretary of State in Texas for a number of years, which meant he was in charge of running elections in Texas. So unlike most congressmen that are in Washington, DC, he actually has on the ground experience of working with elections and election procedures and voting machines and irregularities and what can happen and what can’t happen. And he probably saw stuff that just kind of made him scratch his head a bit and saying, oh, wait a minute, let’s look into this a little bit because this doesn’t make sense. I mean, he has an experience base, and now we’re saying, well, we’re canceling you and your experience base, we don’t care what experience you’ve had, or what questions you want to raise. You can’t question the narrative that we’re driving.

I mean, you can just use your imagination to see where that would lead in so many areas. You want to be able to raise questions and to object things along the way and make people think about it. And that’s what Jesus often did with his questions as he made you think, questions make you think. And so to not even be able to question something, takes out the possibility that that the narrative you’re hearing might not be true. But if you question it, and come back and prove it true, great, you know it’s true. It stands on its own. But when you have to support a narrative by removing opposition, that’s a real problem. And that’s part of what’s going on with trying to cancel Roger Williams for having raised questions.

And he was known at the extreme ends that we saw some people claiming there was absolutely 100% fraud everywhere. What he was saying, he was saying, let’s look at this. And Tim, as you said, it’s like Ted Cruz, let’s just investigate. Let’s see if we can get to the bottom of this. Let’s see what we can find and then we can all be content with what the results are once we know what truth is. But Roger Williams has been attacked in a way that we really haven’t seen in a good while with congressman for simply standing in the way that he stood.

Rick:

But we’ll get it straight from the congressman. Stay with us, folks, Roger Williams with us when we return on WallBuilders Live.

BREAK

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. Alexia de Tocqueville, a political official from France traveled to the United States in 1831 and penned his observations in the now famous book, Democracy in America. Being from France, what he found in America was completely unexpected to him.

He reported, “Upon my arrival in the United States, the religious aspect of the country was the first thing that struck my attention. And the longer I stayed there, the more I perceived the great political consequences resulting from this. In France, I’d almost always seen the spirit of religion and the spirit of freedom, marching in opposite directions. But in America, I found that they were intimately united and that they reigned in common over the same country.” de Tocqueville recognized that it was biblical Christianity and the morals it produced that made America great.

For more information about Alexia Tocqueville and the positive influence of Christianity in early America, go to wallbuilders.com

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. Thrilled to have congressman Roger Williams with us. Congressman, always good to have you, sir. Thanks for coming on the program today.

Roger:

Well, thank you, Rick. And we sure appreciate what you guys are doing for us. Thank you.

Rick:

Well, I just want to tell you how proud I was just watching you over the last couple of months and just thrilled to have you as my congressman, and I appreciate all that you do. I know you’ve been putting some tough spots, and you’ve taken a principled stand and for just being willing to ask questions, basically, which is really what was happening with the whole vote on the electoral college and say, I want to know more about what happened in the States. Looks like your alma mater, or at least the faculty at your alma mater, is at least threatening to ask that you be removed on the Board of Regents there. So tell us a little bit more about what’s happening there, and has that quieted down yet?

Roger:

Well, first of all, on the vote, we voted not to impeach the president, which is the right vote, of course. And then I voted to take another look see at the Arizona and Pennsylvania counts. I looked at it not from a standpoint of trying to overturn an election. But as you know, I was former Secretary of State, and it would be a natural for me to want to see where there were some problems. And that’s why I made that vote, which is the right vote.

But it was surprising, because the next day, the faculty, not the Board of Trustees in which I’m a member, not the chancellor, which is the best we got in the country, the faculty decided that because I didn’t necessarily carry their political persuasions, that I should not be on the board. Well, that’s really different thing. While we’ve got to think our freedom of speech we’re supposed to be teaching that in our colleges across the country, so they challenged me, wanted me to be removed from the board. And kind of the rest is history, has been news for about the last two weeks. And we’ve talked a lot about it. It’s not about me, but it is about a freedom of speech issue.

And faculties across the country, Rick, across the country, as you know, are teaching from the left side of the book. And a lot of the faculty has tenure. I think that it was 10 years, not something we have in real life for our Main Street, America. And that makes them not responsible to anybody. And the idea that you can’t agree to disagree, it bothers me because you wonder, what are the colleges teaching in our schools, right?

Rick:

Yeah. Yeah.

Roger:

What are they teaching our kids if you can’t agree to disagree? We need to be given everybody the option, let these young men and women choose what direction they want to go, and not make up history, but talk about history and real history. So that’s been the issue. So we’ll see what happens. I mean, got a ton of support from my fellow trustees, and thousands and thousands of communications in support of what we’re doing. And what we’re doing is nothing, right. It’s freedom of speech…

Rick:

That’s exactly right.

Roger:

That’s what our country is built on. So it’s going to be interesting to see, I think the faculty was meeting the night and they offered an amendment that no elected political officials can serve on the board at TCU, which would never pass our Board of Trustees. I’m convinced to that. And it’s just another way of trying to get back at me and the way I think. And I’ve been on the board 20 years, and 20 years ago, I was not an elected official. But everybody know, for 20 years, I’m strong conservative. So why now, right? Well, I think we know why is that the educational world has never been Trump friendly, or conservative friendly, and they tied me up in that. So here we’re going.

Rick:

Yeah. And that’s part of why we wanted to have you on because it is the bigger picture issue of restoring civil discourse, being able to discuss things, being able to listen when somebody doesn’t agree with you, and give them a chance to speak. And it’s that silencing of the opposition and punishment for simply speaking up and saying, hey, I got questions, and how did you come to that conclusion and those kind of things, that’s the big concern, I think, for everybody is that this starts being carried out and people losing their jobs for having opinions and all of that. So what do we do to get back to a place of civil discourse and not have this just complete silence, you know, of anybody that disagrees with you?

Roger:

Well, it’s cancel culture, as you know, we’re right in the middle of it. We’ve got to get back there quick. And you know, both sides, I mean, have to get a hold of ourselves and like you say simply agree to disagree. Of course, personally, I’d love to see more business people running for congress running for local office or whatever. But you know, business people for the nature of this sport, if you want to look at it that way, and you guys are involved in it, why the heck would you do it, right? I mean, your family gets attacked, your home gets attacked. In my case, I’ve been wounded in a baseball game with shrapnel. I’ve been in a train wreck. I’ve been robbed on the streets of Washington. And it goes on and on. So, why would anybody do this, right?

Rick:

Right.

Roger:

But you know, we have to understand that, that this is a country that has proven through the years that the last government is best government. We’re Christian-Judeo principled. We agree to disagree. But at the end of the day, we have the Constitution we support. And we’ve got to get back to that. You know, like right now I’m watching, I’ll be on the floor tonight where congresswoman Greene from Georgia has made some statements that many of us may not agree with.

But at the same time, the Democrats are trying to get her off for committees, which is not the right thing to do. She was elected by almost a million people in Georgia, they need to decide what’s right and what’s wrong. They’ve totally gone around over ethics. The ethics committee we have they just run over them and that’s a bipartisan committee. They’ve chosen not to let anybody have their due process. So it’s a runaway freight train right now. And Joe Biden want to talk about unity, well, he gave that speech, and two hours later, he was dividing our country, did away with the pipeline, and on and on and on. So what do we need to do?

I think we just need to get more and more people engaged in the process, and understand what the process is, and get involved. If we don’t have people that want to be engaged that understand conservative values, understand center left, center right, etc, we could have a problem.

Rick:

Let me ask you this before I let you go. How’s the temperature, the tone, the attitude of the group of guys and gals like yourself that are conservatives, with obviously big hit here with Biden taking over the presidency and the Democrats maintaining the majority in the House and getting a tie in the Senate that that gives them a essentially the majority? A few days have passed, or a week or two into this, are we starting to get our legs under says, the opposition here and are conservatives? I guess I’m asking you for some behind the scenes on how you guys are feeling. And are you starting to find some cohesiveness there with conservatives?

Roger:

Well, we are. We’re coming together. But let me take you back to back November and a lot of your listeners will, and many of us have already forgotten this, but we got to go back. You know, November 3rd was a really good day for conservatives.

Rick:

That’s right. That’s right.

Roger:

If you slide the presidential race over a minute, and we just talked about that, it was a great day for conservatives. I mean, we lost nobody. No income that lost are bigger. Okay? And we gained seats and Pelosi is sitting on a very, very thin margin here in the House. To get anything passed, she’s going to have to have Republicans and more than likely she’s not going to get that. So we had a very, very good day. And I think that result was a statement to deliver Left wing, that this is not where our country is going.

Rick:

And unexpected, right, Roger, I mean, you we were supposed to lose 20 something seats, I mean, a lot of the good folks, I mean, it was the exact opposite of what everybody said was going to happen?

Roger:

All the pollsters were wrong. I mean, they didn’t get it. And it just shows you a lot of people don’t want to, in many cases, they’re afraid to say they’re conservative. And so pollsters got it wrong. You’re exactly right, we’re going to lose 30 seats, it was going to be a bloodbath. And it was not. Okay. So now we fast forward to 2022, we got the right message. I mean, look at the message, lower taxes, less government, cut spending, defend borders, listen to your generals, understand the 10th Amendment, stand with Israel, of stand with police. That’s the message and it’s a winning message. So that hadn’t changed. We just have to make sure that we get out in two years, and that we get that message out. We do it in a cohesive way. We do it with a smile on our face. We pick up two or three extra seats in Texas, hopefully, Republican seats, which I think they will be, and we get the House of Representatives back. And if we don’t get the Senate, and of course, they’ll have the White House, we stop the nonsense. That’s how close we are.

Rick:

I love it. I love it. Well, man, we’re with you, and certainly looking forward to that happening, but also in the meantime, cheering you guys on and helping in any way we can to give you what you need to help stop some of that nonsense even as the minority party. So thanks for what you’re doing, man. And I know, I mean, you listed some of the things. I know it’s worse than that. I know, it’s a tough spot to be in and so we’re thankful for you. We need more patriots like you. So we appreciate you, sir. Thank you for coming on the program today.

Roger:

Thank you, Rick. God bless.

Rick:

Stay with us, folks, we’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

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Rick:

We’re back here on WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. Thanks to congressman Roger Williams, for joining us today as well. I got to tell you guys, I honestly did, I was watching as though the whole voting was taking place and objections were taking place. And when Roger got up and gave his speech about why he thought this needed to be looked into more, I was proud that that was my congressman. I was like, thank you for taking the stance. Same way I felt when Ted Cruz stood up with regard to this.

So I think, Tim, what you said at the top of the program about how the media distorts these things and makes it look like something happened that didn’t even happen is absolutely right. And then it has real world effect. I mean, on Roger, it’s a position that he doesn’t depend on that position at all for his livelihood. But think of all the people that are now losing their jobs, losing all kinds of positions and different things over lies about what they did or did not do?

David:

Well, I thought Roger made some really powerful points. And one is if you know this way you’re going to be treated, tell me who’s going to run for office? Who wants to step up and face this kind of stuff for expressing your opinions, expressing your beliefs, expressing what you were elected to do and that was bring your viewpoint into the debate? So he made a great point that this is a real chilling effect in trying to get good average normal people run for office.

But the thing that stood out to me as he was going through this is he’s got support from the administration, he’s got support from the other trustees, he’s got support from the alumni; he’s got support, except from the faculty, the faculty. Now, think about that, that these are the radical guys driving the debate, which probably explains why right now we know in polling, 53% of college students oppose free speech, 19% of college students think that violence is an acceptable response to free speech they disagree with. Where would they get those crazy ideas? Faculty. So look at how radical the faculty is compared to where the rest of the administration is.

Tim:

And he pointed out that faculty can receive tenure, which is not a real world thing. Only in academia, can you be put in a position where well, you’ve been here long enough, you can’t be fired no matter what you do, or how incompetent you are. I had this experience when I was in college, where there was a professor who literally was crazy. And I went to the head of the program. It was a grad school program, went to the head of the grad program and I said, hey, this is what I’m dealing with. And they said, man, I’m so sorry. We know, the guy’s crazy, but we can’t do anything. He’s tenured.

And this was the first encounter for me with this notion of tenure. And I thought, wait a second, you just acknowledged to me he’s crazy. Like, you know, he’s crazy, but you can’t do anything because he’s tenured! This is where we could look at a lot of the academic system. And it’s a reason we’ve talked about on this program before, there’s a lot of things in academia that we criticize, because there’s a lot of things in the system that don’t make sense. There’s a lot of things in the public school system that don’t make sense. There’s a lot of things in universities that don’t make sense. This is not being the least of them that you now I have professors who know that they don’t have to be accountable for what they say, and therefore they can say whatever they want. So they can promote ideas that are absolutely terrible and destructive, and nonsensical, but they don’t have to worry about any level of accountability because they’re not going to lose their job over it. And this is what our kids are getting every day when they go to college.

David:

You know, it’s interesting because the university recognizes it’s accountable. After this happened, Roger Williams, one of the state representatives here in Texas, called the Chancellor of the University and told the Chancellor hey, you know, I just want to remind you about state equalization grants, and Roger Williams.

Now, that doesn’t mean a lot to a lot of people, but that’s a shot over the bow. State equalization grant, TCU gets hundreds of millions of dollars a year from the state of Texas in grants for students. And this legislative says, hey, we’re just reminding you, you get a lot of money from us and you’re going to throw a guy potentially off the trustees because of what he believes? You just need to know there could be consequences to that. Well, Tim, as you just went through, there’s no consequences to faculty, so they can be crazy. But administration has to live in a real world where there are consequences. And we really do need to get public schools and universities, everything else back to accountability, which is way the rest of the world works. And I think Roger comes out of this okay. I think he’s going to be fine. But just the fact that he’s having to go through this drama is pretty unbelievable.

Rick:

Yeah, and this stuff doesn’t stop until we stop it. And that requires people like Roger being willing to stand up and say no, not to cower down, not to back off, but to continue speaking truth, continue fighting for truth. That’s what we do here at WallBuilders. We hope that you’ll help us do that. Go to wallbuilderslive.com today, make that one-time or monthly contribution. And just as important, grab those programs and share them with your friends and family. Use that website as a place where you can get this information and then be a force multiplier by getting it into the hands of as many people as possible. Check it out today at wallbuilderslive.com.

Thanks so much for listening. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live.