Why Is Congress In Session So Often? Congress and the Constitution-Foundations Of Freedom Thursday:  It’s Foundations of Freedom Thursday, a special day of the week where we get to answer questions from you, the listeners! Always answering your questions from constitutional principles! Tune in today as we answer your questions on why Congress is in session so often and whether or not legislators were intended to be full time, right here on WallBuilders Live!

Air Date: 01/04/2018

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton

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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast.  However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Intro:

Thomas Jefferson said, “€œThe Constitution of most of our states, and of the United States, assert that all power is inherent in the people that they may exercise it by themselves. That it is their right and duty to be at all times armed. That they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, and freedom of press.”€

Rick:

Those are the freedoms we enjoy and we talk about them on Foundations of Freedom Thursday. Welcome to WallBuilders Live with David Barton and Rick Green. Thank you for joining us today. Visit us online at WallBuildersLive.com and WallBuilders.com.

It Starts With Getting Educated

Rick:

If you’ve been interested in learning about our foundational freedoms, maybe you’ve been a little bit inspired to do something about them, actually take some actions on how to preserve those freedoms for future generations. It starts with getting educated about those freedoms.

David, I look forward to Thursdays with you, bro. I love learning about areas of the Constitution, or the Declaration, or something from the Founding Fathers about our principles that maybe we’ve strayed a little bit from here in America. So, it’s a fun day to get back to those principles.

David:

I think people really like it too because we get a lot of questions of people asking this or that about the Constitution and this or that about history. So, it’s a fun day also to talk about things from the perspective of what people are wanting to know. I love doing that. I love answering questions.

Why is Congress in Session So Often?

Rick:

Well, we”€™ve gotten one from Jeff Jasko. He’s asking about, “€œWhy is Congress in session so often? I learned from your Constitution class that the minimum requirement is once a year. Was the original intent for our representatives to only be part-time politicians with another job in the private sector? Perhaps you could touch on this in an upcoming show.”€

Yes, Jeff, we’re going to touch on it today from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Appreciate you emailing in, bro, and asking that question. And thanks for doing the Constitution class as well.

So, David, great question. It seems like we have a constant legislative session in Washington now. And as long as our members of Congress are there, there’s potential for bad legislation to be passed.

Is that the way it was intended?

David:

Well, to understand what was intended you actually have to go back to the Declaration of Independence. And this is one of the things that we emphasize for folks, that if you want to understand the Constitution, master the Declaration.

In previous years the court said you cannot separate the two. But in recent years — and I remember Jack Brooks when he was chairman of Judiciary Committee in the House years ago had been chair, he was in Congress like 52 years if I recall.  Right. He said, “€œOh, the Declaration doesn”€™t have anything to do with the Constitution.”€

And that was judiciary’s position. So, that is a dead wrong philosophy, but to understand this you have to go back to the Declaration. And the Declaration has some very good points to make on this. Let me just read some of the wording out of the Declaration that deals with this particular issue. There are actually three clauses.

Now, remember, in the Declaration, you start out with 155 words that set forth the philosophy of American government. There are six principles there. Then you follow it up with 27 grievances showing the violation of those principles.

So, I’m just going to read those three clauses out of the Declaration that deals with why Congress gets together, and how often it gets together, and where it gets together. So, we’re talking about King George III  now and what he’s done to the American colonies.

The Grievances in the Declaration of Independence

David:

And this is the grievances of the Founding Fathers in the Declaration of Independence saying, he, King George III, has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public records for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures. So, what happens is, as King George III, as all the tyranny was going, our legislative assemblies here in the United States, or in the colonies at that time, were pushing back against them.

They were passing measures and resolutions and he just got tired of these guys passing measures and saying, “€œHey, you can’t do this.”€ So, he started saying, “€œYou know”€– as if it were Washington, D.C. — “€œhere’s the deal, you guys in Washington, D.C., instead of meeting in Congress in D.C. I want you to meet in Congress in Fargo, North Dakota next Monday. So, your assembly will start meeting in Fargo, North Dakota.”€

Well, you meet there, you don’t have staff, you don’t have personnel, you don’t have the records. And that’s where it talks about the depository of their public records. And he did that for, as they say, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures. Making it really, really, really, really, tough for the legislature to get together and to oppose him in any measure. Here’s another one that he says, “€œHe has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly for opposing with manly firmness his invasion of the rights of the people.”€

That was particularly in New England and he also did so in Virginia. But Virginia, and Massachusetts, and other things is they would pass a resolution saying, “€œThis is wrong. You’re violating the rights of — our rights as English citizens, the rights we have as British citizens.”€ He would just flat dissolve the legislatures.

And then here’s that third clause, “€œHe has refused for a long time after such dissolutions to cause others to be elected.”€ So, not only has he dissolve the legislatures, he won”€™t let you elect a new member of the legislature.

It says, “€œHe has refused for a long time after such dissolutions to cause others to be elected whereby the legislative powers, incapable of annihilation, have turned to the people at large for their exercise. The state remaining in the meantime exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without and convulsions from within.”€ So, he’s wiped out government.

The Background to Understanding the Constitution

David:

We don’t even have ability to defend ourselves with the problems we have in our own state much less dealing with Great Britain. So, those are the three clauses. Let’s talk about what King George III, what British authorities, did in wiping out their legislatures, and causing them to meet in really strange places, and not letting others be elected, etc. If you get that background then you move forward to the Constitution. Because this is what they said at the start, “€œThis is why we’re separating to become our own nation. These are bad policies.”€

So, after they do separate and become an independent nation, and they finished the war, and they move forward into creating their new national government. These things that they complained about as being wrong in the Declaration they start solving in the Constitution. And that’s what leads us to the background for how often Congress meets, where it meets, and what it does when it meets, and the whole question that Jeff has asked will be answered–

Rick:

They really had a chance in the Constitution to fix the problems basically.

David:

That’s right.

Rick:

You know, listening to there are 27 grievances saying, “€œHey, now we have a chance to set this thing up from scratch. We can we can prevent these problems from happening again.”€

What Every Citizen Ought to Do

David:

You know, what every citizen ought to do, and we”€™ve passed the Fourth of July, but this one would be a great exercise on the Fourth of July. But every citizen, of course, needs to read the Declaration and the Constitution. It doesn’t take that long. You can probably read the Declaration in six or seven minutes, probably read the Constitution in 15 to 20 minutes.

But, what you ought to do as an exercise is take those 27 grievances, and take them one at a time, and say, “€œOkay, here’s the grievance in the Declaration.  Where did they solve this in the Constitution?”€

Because you will find a corollary for Declaration grievances in the Constitution and that helps you know both documents. It also helps you learn the history behind what they did with the Constitution.

That’s why those who try to interpret the Constitution without the Declaration, they reject the historical basis, historical background. And that’s all your precedent, and that’s all your intent and your interpretation of that clause. So, that’s a good thing to do and perhaps at some point, people will do that this year.

You don’t have to wait till the next Fourth of July to do that and read the Declaration. But that’s a great exercise, it’s a great homeschool exercise, it’s a great tea party or * exercise. It’s a great exercise for you and your family to just sit down and do. It’s a great way to learn our documents.

And as John Jay said, “€œEvery citizen should diligently study the Constitution of his country. By knowing their rights, they”€™ll sooner perceive when they are violated and be the more ready to assert them.”€ So, you know it, you understand it, and you assert it.

Rick:

And you recognize when it’s–

David:

That’s right.

Rick:

–when it’s being violated. So, that sort of background from the Declaration lays the groundwork for what they came back and did in the Constitution. Let’s take a quick break. And when we come back, we’ll hit that clause in the Constitution and how it should work. And even maybe talk a little bit about how some of the states do this.

I remember Governor Perry, when he was running for president, talking about how the Texas model worked. And he’d like to see that at the federal level so they weren’t in Washington, D.C. quite so often. We’ll have all that when we come back. Stay with us, folks. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Outro:

Abraham Lincoln said, “€œWe the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts. Not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.”€

Bring A Speaker To Your Area

Tim:

Hey, this is Tim Barton with WallBuilders.  And as you’ve had the opportunity to listen to WallBuilders Live, you’ve probably heard a wealth of information about our nation, about our spiritual heritage, about the religious liberties, and about all the things that make America exceptional.

And you might be thinking, “€œAs incredible as this information is, I wish there was a way that I could get one of the WallBuilders guys to come to my area and share with my group.”€

Whether it be a church, whether it be a Christian school, or public school, or some political event, or activity, if you’re interested in having a WallBuilders speaker come to your area, you can get on our website at www.WallBuilders.com and there’s a tab for scheduling. If you”€™ll click on that tab, you’ll notice there’s a list of information from speakers bio’s, to events that are already going on. And there’s a section where you can request an event, to bring this information about who we are, where we came from, our religious liberties, and freedoms. Go to the WallBuilders website and Bring a speaker to your area.

Intro:

Thomas Jefferson said, “€œIn questions of power then let no more be heard of confidence in the man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.”€

Rick:

Man, Justin picks out the greatest quotes. That is exactly what we needed to hear, David,  because that’s what we’re talking about here is binding them down with some good procedures and parameters to keep them from creating mischief by being in Washington, D.C. too long.

We Got the “€œWhy”€, Now the Solutions

David:

What we’ve got is, we’ve looked at some of the historical background of why they did what they did. Now let”€™s move to the solutions in the Constitution. Article I deals with legislative powers deals with the House and the Senate and gives the policies whereby they conduct themselves. They allow them to make their own rules, but there are general policies. And so Article 1, Section 4, paragraph 2, this is what the Constitution originally said.

It said, “€œThe Congress shall assemble at least once in every year and such meetings shall be on the first Monday in December unless they shall by law appoint a different date.”€ So, Congress is now told, “€œHere’s the Constitutional thing, you will meet once every year and you will do it on this specific day and you will do it in Washington, D.C..”€

Now, that particular clause was changed in 1933 by the 20th Amendment to the Constitution which set up a line of secession and how the President or Vice President will secede. So, here’s when Congress assembles every year for the last two years now with the Republicans taking control, they actually start Congress with reading the entire Constitution and all the amendments.

So, here’s the 20th Amendment, this is read by Representative Fleischmann who is out of the Chattanooga area in Tennessee.  And so you’ll hear the current language that now exists in the Constitution.

“€œI yield to the gentleman from Tennessee, Mr. Fleischmann, “€˜Section 2, The Congress shall assemble at least once in every year and such meeting shall begin at noon on the third day of January unless they shall by law appoint a different day.”€™”€

David:

So, the only change you should have heard there is it moved from the first Monday in December, which the Founders did, to the third day of January at noon. And so that’s a change, but other than that, Congress still is required to get together once every year in D.C.

Now, when they get together, how long do they stay? If you go all the way back to the beginning of the Constitutional Republic, how long were legislative sessions back then? Any idea, Rick?

Rick:

Yeah, it seems like, I think just a few months because they didn’t want to be there for a long time. Washington wasn’t the place they wanted to hang out.

Not Really Designed to be Part Time Legislators

David:

Yeah, it generally ran about six months. So, you look at that six-month time frame and that kind of tells you they”€™re not really designed to be just part-time legislators. It’s pretty tough to run a business for six months and be in session for six months.

Rick:

Yeah.

David:

Your businesses will suffer over that period of time. So, the notion that they were to be part-time legislators, yeah, maybe you can say six months is a part-time job. You know, maybe. And given the nature of businesses back then, yeah, maybe you can keep your business running for six months. But if you’re someone like, for example, Roger Sherman who was also a judge, what do you do – leave the court for six months when you’re in Congress?

Or Roger Sherman was also a cobbler, a shoemaker – what do you do – quit making shoes for six months? So, the notion that all these guys were simply part-time legislators is not necessarily accurate. It might have been possible being six months a year. But what is certain is they were all citizen legislators. So, the idea of the Founding Fathers was not to have permanent legislators, it was to limit the legislators, bind them down, but to change the Constitution.

And so when they get together at that time 0n the first part of December, then they were only going to deal with 18 issues that were enumerated in the Constitution itself. It’s not how long it takes you to do that, it”€™s that you only get to deal with these 18 issues.

And so if it took them six months to deal with those 18 issues, then that’s what they did. But it’s not necessarily that they were to be part-time legislators, it”€™s that they were to be limited legislators. And that was part of the reason of you had them getting together once a year and the Constitution didn’t specify how long this session is.

But generally, for them to do their Constitutional work at the beginning took them about six months.

It”€™s Not As Much the Time as it is the Lack of Holding to Boundaries

Rick:

I like that “€œlimited legislators.”€ And just like the quote said, “€œBound down by those chains of the Constitution.”€ So even, whether they’re there for six weeks, or six months, or all year, if they’re not getting outside the boundaries of those 18 things listed–

David:

That’s right.

Rick:

–in Article 1 Section 8. And that’s okay–

David:

That”€™s right.

Rick:

–because it took you that long to deal with those particular issues. Our problem now is they”€™re there almost 12 months out of the year.  They come home for August and that”€™s pretty much it. And there’s a lot of mischief to get into because the boundaries have been taken away. Not in terms of time, but in terms of those 18 enumerated powers.

David:

Yeah, and you’re right, if they had stayed there literally 365 days a year, 24 hours a day, but they only confined themselves to those 18 enumerated powers, Founding Fathers didn’t have any trouble with that. And obviously, they didn’t have any trouble because they’re the ones who wrote it who were in the first Congresses.

So, if it took them six months out of the year to deal with the 18 issues they had talked about, then that’s fine. So, it’s not necessarily the length of the– although it has become now because they are no longer confined themselves to those 18 areas, the length of the legislative session is a problem now. If you’re going to get involved in every single area that’s out there, let’s make your legislative session about 10 days and then go home after that and the country”€™s safer.

But if you have the discipline and the Constitutional wherewithal to limit yourself to those 18 measures and nothing else, stay there 365, we don’t care. That’s fine, Just make sure it’s a limited government.

Rick:

Alright, folks, more on this when we come back. Stay with us, it”€™s Foundations of Freedom Thursday right here on WallBuilders Live.

Outro:

Samuel Adams said, “€œThe liberties of our Country and the freedom of our civil Constitution are worth defending against hazards. And it is our duty to defend them against all attacks.”€

Pastors Only Briefing Trip

Tim:

Hi, this is Tim Barton with WallBuilders and I want to encourage all the pastors out there with a unique opportunity that we’re presenting it WallBuilders. We’re doing a special tour just for pastors that you can come and learn more about the spiritual heritage of our nation. Not just seeing the sights but understanding the significance of what they are and what they represent.

We get to go to the Capitol at night.  And we get to see the spiritual heritage of our Founding Fathers, of who we are as a nation, where we came from. We bring in congressman that will tell you about current legislation, about our religious liberties and freedom, and what’s going on in Washington, D.C.

If you’re a pastor or if you want to recommend your pastor for this trip, you can go to our website at www.WallBuilders.com. And there’s a link that’s for scheduling.  If you click on that link there’s a section for pastor”€™s briefing. There’s more information about the dates, when it’s going, and how it’s going to happen. If you want to know more about our nation, our religious liberties, our freedom, our spiritual heritage, this is a trip you want to be a part of.

Intro:

John Adams said, “€œOur Constitution is made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”€

Limit Government

Rick:

Well, we need that moral and religious people to be holding their government accountable. That’s what Foundations of Freedom Thursday are all about. Today we’re talking about the length of time that Congress was intended to meet according to the Constitution, and the Declaration, and in view of the Founding Fathers.

David, we were talking about the time itself and what they should be doing. Obviously limited to, as you said, limited legislators, limited in those 18 enumerated powers in the Constitution.

And to too often now because they have no limits and they can– they feel like there are no bounds of the Constitution. John Locke’s words in his two treatises on government, it’s really perfect for today he said, “€œThere is no need that the legislatives should be always in being–“€ In other words, meeting endlessly. “€œNot having always business to do–“€ In other words, unlimited opportunities to meddle in people’s lives.

“€œToo Great a Temptation…to Grasp at Power”€

Rick:

And here’s why, he said, “€œAnd because it may be too great a temptation to human frailty apt to grasp at power.”€ So, talking about that moral religious people, even if you have good people in Congress, it’s a great temptation to human frailty to want to grab power. And so if we take off those chains of the Constitution, those 18 enumerated powers, and if we have them in Washington 24/7 365 days a week without those boundaries, man, they’re going to be apt to grasp that power and that’s what they’ve been doing.

David:

And you mentioned Governor Perry and how he said, “€œI’d like to see it more like the Texas model Texas model.”€ And this is a state that is the second most populous state in the United States, Texas conducts its business every other year for 140 days. So, here we are not limited to 18 issues. We can deal with thousands of issues if we choose to, but we do so in 140 days every other year.

A Look at the Legislative Sessions of States

David:

You look at other large states, for example, Florida, that’s one of the large states as well, one of the top four states. They have a 60-day legislative session every year. Georgia, Atlanta, there you go, there’s another big state – they have a 40-day legislature session every year. You take Alabama, it’s got a 30-day legislative session. You take Kentucky, that’s 3o one year, 60 another year, Louisiana’s 45 one year 60 the next year.

Maryland is a 90-day session. You have Montana with a 90-day session. You just go down the list of states and most of them can get it done in one or two months. And they’re not having to deal with simply 18 issues.  They’re dealing with dozens, and dozens, and dozens, and dozens of issues. And so that’s where Locke”€™s premises right is that you don’t want them in session all the time.

Now, if they would be disciplined as the early Founding Fathers were who put restraints on themselves, then that’s fine. And again, it’s not the length of session the Founders were concerned with, it’s what you covered and what you were allowed to intrude into in those sessions. And if you stay within the 18 enumerated powers that’s fine. That’s not a problem.

Rick:

Well, and then that human nature starts causing you to grab that power in all those other areas. So we’ll see what kind of limits could be placed on them in terms of time if we could just get them limited in terms of the territory of what they’re able to do.

Got to take a quick break. When we come back, we’ll finish up for today’s Foundations of Freedom Thursday. Stay with us on WallBuilders Live.

Outro:

Thomas Jefferson said, “€œ In questions of power then, let no more be heard of confidence in man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.”€

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Intro:

Abraham Lincoln said, “€œWe the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts. Not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.”€

Rick:

Welcome back to Foundations of freedom Thursday here on WallBuilders Live. How do we do that in this particular instance of getting them back inside the boundaries of the 18 enumerated powers in the time that they spend in Washington? What do we do?

Elect People Who Understand Limited Government

David:

Well, part of it is we elect people to office who understand limited government. We elect people to office who actually have read the Constitution or who go so far as to, imagine this, carry one in their pocket. And that is a growing number of congressmen who do that.

A number of years ago when I was very close to a number of congressmen, I think there were three that I knew of who did that. Now, there are dozens who do that, so that is a help, it’s going in the right direction.

Back in 1970, the average length of Congress was 350 days. We”€™re at least down to about 278 days now, so we’ve had a reduction over the last 30 years in the length of time Congress is in session.

Rick:

That’s a big change.

David:

That is.

Rick:

That’s far less than what I thought it was.

David:

Yes.

Rick:

So that’s 70 days less.

Germaneness Issues

David:

Yeah, it’s a drop and that helps for sure. What will help, another thing that would help is to get rid of omnibus bills. Because what they do right now, rather than dealing with the bill, issue a time — and a lot of states require what they called “€œgermaneness issues.”€Â  You can’t attach a farm bill to an education issue, an education issue to a farm bill, etc. It has to be germane, but that’s not the way it does in Congress.

Congress will just stick a Christmas tree out there and hang ornaments all over it. That’s why conservatives objected to adding hate crimes, national hate crimes, into the defense appropriation bill.

What are hate crimes? Well, the liberals knew that conservatives are not going to vote against the military and if we stick the hate crimes in there, they”€™d have to vote against the military bill and then we can run ads at them in their states saying, “€œHey, so-and-so representative doesn’t support our troops, doesn’t support our veterans, voted against the military appropriation bill.”€

So, if you could eliminate omnibus bills and get back to single issue type bills that would help things immensely. Because politics, being as it is, they load these things up with sometimes what we call poison pills or on the other hand things that you don’t want to vote for, but you have to because the bill.

The other thing, that would help significantly is if you had a line item veto. If you’re going to have omnibus bills, at least allow the president, or the governor, or whoever, to go in and veto the stuff that just really jacks the bill up and is inappropriate for what that bill deals with. Now, if that were the case we could have stopped the hate crimes bill with the previous president.

With this president, he would go in and he would veto the conscience protection for chaplains that we put in the military appropriations bill. So, it works both ways, but it does help you have a more limited approach to what you do with government.

The Best Solution

David:

You just have to make sure you”€™ve got good people in office to do it. That’s a couple of solutions that would help get Congress limited, but the best solution is for people to elect people to office who actually read the Constitution, who will limit themselves, who will reduce the powers of Congress, who will get back within the 18 enumerated powers.

Rick:

Well, then that quote we just heard from Abraham Lincoln is exactly right, “€œDon’t overthrow the Constitution, overthrow the men that perverts the Constitution.”€ Which is what we do in elections. We get out the ones that aren’t paying attention to it. We get those guys you’re talking about and gals you’re talking about that carry that pocket Constitution with them and study it.

Congress And The Constitution

David:

That’s exactly the solution. And by the way, that also goes back to citizens knowing the Constitution because you won”€™t elect people with your values if you don’t know what your own values are. So, go back and read the Declaration on one hand, the Constitution the other, find that correlation between the clauses, start understanding their intents. And then you can better elect more informed representatives to represent your intents.

Rick:

This has been Foundations of Freedom Thursday here on WallBuilders Live with David Barton and Rick Green. Thanks for joining us today.

Outro:

Calvin Coolidge said, “€œThe more I study the Constitution, the more I realize that no other document devised by the hand of man has brought so much progress and happiness to humanity. To live under the American Constitution is the greatest political privilege that was ever accorded to the human race.”€