Betsy DeVos’ Positive Impact On School Choice, Closure of Abortion Clinics, Ozone Hole Is Getting Smaller, And More – Good News Friday: Join us as David and Tim Barton give us a snapshot of the good things that are happening in our nation and around the world.   Stay tuned to find out more!

Air Date: 01/10/2020

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton

Listen:

Download: Click Here

Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Rick:

Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live where we’re talking about today’s hottest topics on policy, faith, the culture, all these different topics that impact your life, impact my life it impacts our backyards, our churches, our families, all of those things when we look at these issues from a biblical, historical and constitutional perspective. That’s the right way to do it.

My name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas Legislature and America’s Constitution coach. I’m here with America’s premier historian, that’s David Barton and Tim Barton is with us, national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. Most importantly, we want to thank you for joining us. Thanks for listening today. Thanks for being willing to dive in, to educate yourself, for all of us to sharpen each other’s countenance, to become better citizens, to do our part to preserve this incredible constitutional republic that we have, make sure that we’re passing it intact to the next generation.

Become A Constitution Coach

You can be a part of the solution. There’s a lot of ways we want to encourage you to do that. Obviously, in 2020, one of the most important things we ask you to do is become a Constitution coach, actually hosts a Constitution class in your home or there at your church or wherever you can get a handful of people together. We have people that have a class with just three or four people. We have others that have classes of hundreds of people coming out every night or once a week on Sunday afternoon to study the Constitution from a biblical perspective and learn how to be good biblical citizens in this culture. You can learn more about how to do that at www.constitutioncoach.com. That’s www.constitutioncoach.com.

Make a Contribution Towards WallBuilders

The other website, most important one today is www.wallbuilderslive.com. That’s our main website for the radio program and that’s where you can listen to archives of the program and also where you can contribute to the program. Now that means you’re financially coming alongside us like the founding fathers lives, fortunes and sacred honor. That means getting involved in financially supporting what we do here at WallBuilders, it goes a long way to spread the good news and to train up citizens to save this nation. Click on that contribute button and make that one time or monthly contribution.

Hi fellows, we got a whole program of good news to get to the good folks out there that are listening to us today. I know they could use a pick-me-up just to know that all these great things are happening out there. I love zeroing in on the good stuff. Focus on some good stuff for a little while, you know the system work so if we’re willing to work the system. So share some good stories with us, guys. What’s been good in the news lately, David?

Betsy DeVos, Secretary of Education

David:

Well, I’m going to start with a question for you guys. President Trump has week cabinet meetings. And a cabinet-level meeting usually involves about 24-25 heads of departments from EPA through Department of Defense or whatever. So in any administration, you can have a lot of turnovers, those folks, some will last a year, two, someone will last longer. Who are some of the longest-lasting folks in the Trump administration just past the thousand-day mark as the head of a department under Trump?

Tim:

Well, Ben Carson is the first one that comes to mind.

David:

Ben Carson is one. Yeah.

Tim:

Rick Perry, Betsy DeVos.

David:

Governor Perry, Betsy DeVos.

Tim:

Now, Governor Perry actually resigned.

David:

Yeah, he’s resigned.

Tim:

But he did make it a thousand.

David:

That’s right”€¦ So the two that are there are DeVos and Carson. And Betsy DeVos, so nobody really talks about much. She’s just kind of gone under the radar, but what she has been able to do in those thousand days has been absolutely amazing.

Tim:

And by the way, let me point out, it’s always good when they’re under the radar. Because and this is one of things we’ve talked about many times with Trump, that even though we’re so at times annoyed or right the [inaudible 03:14], the frustration with some of the tweets and the things he says and right, you’re going, okay, if you would just leave this alone, right, you don’t have to get involved in every culture war out there. But in the midst of what he’s doing, he is diverting the media’s attention from all of his people who are doing great things.

So the fact that she’s been able to find in the radar, first of all, is really good news because part of her agenda that we’ve already heard, we’ve talked about some of the things she’s on the show, she’s had a pretty good agenda. So I’m very curious what piece of good news you have now for what is the next thing that she is doing and promoting.

David:

Well, the good news is looking back over the last thousand days so to speak back since when she went in. And by the way, she’s one who went in with a lot of controversy. She actually, it took Vice-President Mike Pence to vote to confirm her because there was a 50/50 tie in the Senate and so his vote is what caused her to become the Secretary of Education. Do you remember why she was so opposed?

She Championed School Choice And Children Learning

Rick:

School choice definitely.

David:

Yeah, she actually thought you could learn to read by having something other than a public school teacher. She actually thought that Christian schools and charter schools and that perhaps school”€¦

Rick:

She actually championed the kids instead of the buildings. She was actually for the kids actually learning, imagine that.

David:

Imagine that.

Tim:

Now I notice you did not mention homeschooling.

David:

I was headed that way”€¦

Tim:

Which I was just thinking of all the things you mentioned”€¦

David:

I was headed that way.

Tim:

Is that a slide on homeschoolers because I”€™m smart too and”€¦

 David:

I taught myself. I graduated myself.

Tim:

Come on.

She Believed You Should Compete With Education

David:

That’s right. So her controversy was that she actually thought you should compete with education and see who could produce the best results and use those results.

Tim:

Now when does competition ever helped improve products?

David:

It hasn’t helped the Dallas Cowboys improve products.

Education Has Got Expensive Because The Government Got Involved

Tim:

Well, they’re not competing right now, that’s different. Right? That’s not really the free market. That’s the jury dictatorship world they live in. But in the free market, right and this is one of the ironies, is people think competition is destructive for the people that are having to compete instead of recognizing, no, wait a second, either you get better or you are replaced and that is the way largely it should be. We want the best product out there. We don’t want to be stuck with a failing product.

I would rather there be competition which is going to make better products and it’s going to drive down the price of the product, because of competition always does. When the government gets involved, there’s no competition and it gets more expensive. Why would we ever want that? But that’s what’s happened with a lot of education.

She’s Been Real Innovative And She Rewards Innovation

David:

And so she as a school choice person who actually cared about results rather than institutions and procedures so much, that’s what caused her to be almost defeated. Democrats almost kept her out because she was just not enough Pro-public school, she”€™s just pro-education, is what she is.

So while she has been there, the things that have happened have been absolutely amazing and you know, again Tim, you mentioned it. But I really do believe that a lot of what President Trump does to create controversy is intentional because it keeps the press off of people like Betsy DeVos and Ben Carson and Rick Perry and so many others that were there.

But you look at what she’s done. She has rolled back federal involvement in all sorts of areas. The last Obama administration that came in and said, here’s money and here’s how you have to spend it. Well, she’s gotten rid of that, said no, I want state innovation I want people to find innovative ways to do things. So she’s been big and encouraging school choice. She’s rolled back lots of regulations.

She’s been real innovative and she rewards innovation. Texas is one of the States, they took the federal money and she put it in competitive grants where you have to actually compete to get the money and see which idea works best and then if idea works best, then you can get the money. And so she’s really done that which has led to the rise of charter schools. She’s given States more flexibility than they have had in years and years and years.

She Lifted The Prohibition Against Religious Organizations From Assessing Those Funds

She actually lifted the prohibition against her religious organizations from assessing those funds. She doesn’t care for your religious or not. If you can get the results and do the job, go for it. Well, under the previous administration, if you were religious, that meant you couldn’t get the results even those testing shows that religious schools and religious home education gets higher academic scores. They excluded those folks. So she’s rolled back that aspect of discrimination against religion. She allows them to compete in the marketplace.

So all this stuff that she’s done including discipline policies, amazingly out of the Obama administration, they actually instituted discipline policies. Here’s how you have to handle the discipline in your schools. No, no, that doesn’t work in every school district the same. It should be determined by parents and by local communities. And so she has done such a good job of taking a federal agency that has a lot of money and doing it as an agency to encourage innovation, encourage states do things, encourage local communities.

So it’s really good news that she was voted in first of all, but what she’s been there has been so under the radar, but it has been so positive and so productive for students and for education in general across the nation for her, encouraged so many other areas of competition.

She’s Been A Champion Within The Adminstration

Rick:

You know, she’s been a champion within the administration. And just to point out, I mean one of the reasons Trump is been so effective and so good is because of his choices and who he’s put in places and she’s a lady that her whole life, the Prince family and the DeVos family have given to wonderful organizations, like Family Research Council and Focus on the Family and others.

They’ve been a big part of the movement in our country to restore those foundational principles. So she really knows what she’s doing and why she believes what she believes and just great news that she’s been so effective in these first three years and hopefully be there a while longer and continue to push for effective reform.

Quick, right guys, I know we got a lot more good news to get to. So Tim Barton is next with some good news, stay with us, folks, you’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Host A Constitution Class

Hey, friends, this is Rick Green, America’s Constitution coach and co-host of WallBuilders Live. 2020 is upon us and every one of us has a responsibility to preserve freedom for future generations. We want to equip you to be the catalyst in your community.

Bring people together and get them excited about being a biblical citizen. You host our Constitution-class, our biblical citizenship class right there in your home, in your church, at your community center, we’ll give you the tools, we’ll train you. David Barton, myself and others will be the ones on the videos doing the teaching. You pass out the workbooks put on the video and then have a great time of fellowship, engaging and equipping and inspiring each other to make the difference in your community.

www.constitutioncoach.com is the place to sign up. We’re going to do a free webinar about how to do this. On January 16th, you can sign up right there at www.constitutioncoach.com, we look forward to visiting with you and equipping you to be the catalyst in your community to preserve freedom for future generations. Got to do your part. It’s 2020, let’s all go out and make a difference.

Rick:

We’re back on WallBuilders Live. It’s Good News Friday today, thanks for staying with us after our first segment of good news. Next piece of good news is going to come from Tim Barton. Tim.

The Closure Of Abortion Clinics

Tim:

Alright, guys, this is related to abortion clinics and the number of closures at abortion clinics. Back in 1991 and I’ve got a very thick little article and I’m saying, thick because we printed it out and there are multiple pages in this and there’s a lot of charts in this article which is kind of fascinating the way they’re showing where the breakdown happens. But in 1991, there were 2,176 open abortion clinics that did surgical abortions. Today, there are 467 surgical clinics that perform an abortion.

David:

How many were at the start?

78% Of Abortion Clinics Have Closed Since 1991

Tim:

It was 2,176, now there’s 467. So 22% is what the chart is showing me. So 78% of abortion clinics have closed just since 1991. Now that is for surgical, they do point out that there are 231 abortion facilities that will give you a pill and this certainly is a different kind of abortion than what the surgical abortions are. Nonetheless, they’re tracking how much abortion has changed and been shut down.

Well, in the midst of a lot of these really interesting charts that are in this, at the very back of this little packet I have, there is a map per States of all of the abortion facilities in the State. Now, it probably would not be really shocking if we looked at the States that have the highest or the greatest number of abortion facilities. What would you guys instantly think what States are leading the way?

David:

New York and California, except California, don’t report as I recall. So New York will be.

Tim:

Well, there are 145 abortion facilities that are identified in California and so there could be more that are not reporting as you’re identifying, but there’s 145 New York, there are 87 and those are by far the biggest numbers. There’s only one more that has more than 50 abortion facilities…

Rick:

Illinois.

Tim: It is not actually. Illinois has 29.

David:

Wow! But then must all be in Chicago.

The State With The Third Most Is Florida, With 57 Abortion Facilities 

Tim:

With that’s probably not a bad guess, probably the vast majority are in Chicago. No, the state with the third most is Florida, with 57 abortion facilities in Florida. Washington State, actually, fourth is New Jersey, then Washington State, then Illinois, then Maryland and on down, the list goes. Nonetheless, it’s kind of a fascinating map just seeing where some of this is. But as it points out, so much has changed. And even looking this change, the next article I have on the list, this is the title, “€œMissouri defunds Planned Parenthood abortion business for a second year.”€ And this is something now as we’re talking about 78% of abortion facilities have closed.

Missouri Has Said, No Medicaid Funds Can Go To Abortion

The largest abortion provider out there is Planned Parenthood and some people would contend now, wait a second, right, they don’t just do abortions, they do other women’s health and services which is really not accurate, because most of the women’s quota, health and services they do are related to prepping the woman for an abortion. But even the founders or rather not founders, but the leaders of Planned Parenthood have said their core mission is to perform abortions. So there’s no confusion than that.

But Missouri is one of the States who’ve come out and said, well, we’re not going to let our health care dollars be spent for abortions. And so Medicaid is something they’ve restricted and said, no Medicaid funds can go to abortion. So more than a million dollars have been cut that it will not fund Planned Parenthood with those dollars anymore in Missouri.

Now Missouri is one of the states doing this, but it’s just another example where we’re seeing some really positive traction from states recognizing the value of the unborn and what state legislators are doing to make a difference, guys.

Every fall, every November, we have a State legislators conference. And we have legislators from dozens of different states that come and they’re  pro-family bunch of legislators they come and many of them are the ones who are sponsoring these very pieces of legislation in their States, which is really cool that we actually personally know some of the guys that are doing this.

Abortion is Declining Rapidly In America

But this is something that as we’re talking about how abortion is declining rapidly in America and how drastically different it is from even a couple decades ago, one of the ways we’re still making progress is making sure that we don’t spend healthcare dollars funding the facilities that do the majority of abortions, in this case Planned Parenthood. So good job for Missouri defunding. Now a second year, they voted in the legislators to not allow any kind of Medicaid healthcare funding to go to Planned Parenthood.

Rick:

Now, Tim, if you could just back up and repeat that number in the reduction, 70 something per cent, I mean let’s just highlight that as we’re going to break because that is”€¦

Tim:

78% of abortion facilities have closed since 1991.

That’s Three-Fourths Of Them Gone

Rick:

Wow! Man, that’s I mean let’s just stop and enjoy this for a moment. What a great, so we’ve been at this. Let’s see WallBuilders started what five years before that, something like that.

David:

We started last part at 87, so is 14 years after Roe v. Wade, but it would be four years before this massive reduction started.

Rick:

And so 20, let’s see was that 27, 28 since 91 and that big, I mean that’s three-fourths of them gone. That, I mean, come on everybody, pinch yourself. This is an incredible, folks at home realize all of this work that people do, the pro-life movement, all the work you do in elections to get good people elected, all the work you do to change hearts and speak good things in social media, it’s working, it’s headed the right direction on this issue. So just great, great news.

Quick break, guys. Sorry, about that, we’ll be right back. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Courageous Leaders Collection

Hi friends, this is Tim Barton of WallBuilders. This is a time when most Americans don’t know much about American history or even Hebrews of the faith. And I know oftentimes for parents, we’re trying to find good content for our kids to read. And if you remember back to the Bible, to the book of Hebrews and has the faith Hall of Fame, where they outlined the leaders of faith that had gone before them. Well, this is something that as Americans, we really want to go back and outline some of these heroes, not just of American history but heroes of Christianity and our faith as well.

I want to let you know about some biographical sketches we have available on our website. The one is called the Courageous Leaders Collection. In this collection, includes people like Abigail Adams, Abraham Lincoln, Francis Scott Key, George Washington Carver, Susanna Wesley, even the Wright brothers. And there’s a second collection called Heroes of History.

In this collection, you’ll read about people like Benjamin Franklin or Christopher Columbus, Daniel Boone, George Washington, Harriet Tubman, friends, the list goes on and on. This is a great collection for your young person to have and read and it’s a providential view of American and Christian history. This is available at www.wallbuilders.com. That’s www.wallbuilders.com.

Rick:

Welcome back to WallBuilders Live, Good News Friday. Today, we’ve got two segments left of good news and this one is headed to David Barton. David, what’s our next piece of good news?

This Year’s Ozone Hole Is The Smallest That’s Ever Been Recorded

David:

Well, we’re going to talk about climate change global warming or something in this sort. It relates to the ozone hole. And the way this is connected is we’ve been hearing for the last several decades that the greater the ozone hole over the atmosphere, the more it allows heat to come in and the more it burns up the planet and the more it’s just really bad. And so this is why 40 years ago, they banned aerosol sprays. That’s one of the chlorofluorocarbons and they say this is the real problem for it.

Well, with all the stuff and we’ve seen what’s happening with the Paris Accord and all the emphasis has been put on climate change. We saw even last year is the young girl is before the UN was crying and saying, you’re killing me in my generation, you got to stop climate change. All that going on just to point out that they report that this year’s ozone hole is the smallest that’s ever been recorded.

They’ve never recorded as small this year and they can’t figure it out because climate change, global warming is going up and the ozone hole is getting smaller and so it’s limiting ozone depletion which really helps the planet, but they can’t figure out why that it’s getting warmer on the one hand and the ozone hole is shrinking on the other. And so they can’t figure out climate change which is what we’ve been saying all along that this is not man that creates this kind of stuff. There are cycles as it goes through. And we haven’t had a temperature increase now in what, 23 years I think, climate increase, a major increase of any kind in 23 years.

President Trump Announced That America Is Withdrawing From The Paris Climate Accords

So that’s one thing. But not separate from that, President Trump back in November announced that America is withdrawing from the Paris Climate Accords that these Climate Accords cost America a ton of money. And we’re not the major problem in the world, China is and we’re self-regulating at a higher level than other nations are and why should we allow other nations to come in and dictate to us what we did it as President Trump said.

I love the way he said this. He said, “€œI was elected to represent the citizens of Pittsburgh, not Paris. I promised I would exit or renegotiate any deal which fails to serve American interests.”€ And that’s exactly what he did. So the deal that was negotiated in 2015 with President Obama, President Trump has just announced we’re getting out of and he actually had to wait until November this year because that was the first legal point in the agreement at which he could exit.

So he’s now announced his intention to exit. It takes one year to get out, which means it will be after the election before America can officially exit. So the next election will have a huge impact on whether America gets out from under this onerous treaty, but so much and this is a discussion for a different time. But so much of what they’re advocating and claiming about climate change and global warming is not statistically accurate and this shrinking to the ozone hole to the smallest ever recorded is a great indication that their science is not matching up with what they’re claiming that it is.

Rick:

One more break, guys, we got one more segment of good news when we return. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

America’s Hidden Heroes

Hi, this is David Barton and this is Tim Barton. We want to let you know about a series that’s happening right now on TBN on Thursday nights. Now TBN is a Trinity Broadcasting Network. Every Thursday night there’s a series that we’ve filmed called America’s Hidden History. In this season, it’s called America’s Hidden Heroes. The reason is we highlight heroes from American history for years. We’ve been focusing on the forgotten history heroes of the nation and now we have a TV show just highlighting some of those heroes.

These are inspiring stories about some of the greatest people maybe you’ve never heard about. We go on location, we go to the site, we show you where the events happen and it’s a story of folks like Bronco Charlie and Stagecoach Mary and Jedediah Smith and Robert Smalls and so many inspiring folks.

Now, this happens every Thursday night and the time is going to be different based on where you live, either way. We think this is something that will so encourage and inspire you and learning some of these great stories from America’s Hidden History.

Rick:

We”€™re back on WallBuilders Live, the final segment of good news for the day. Tim, where are we going with our final piece of good news?

Majority Of Americans Say Abortion Is Morally Wrong

Tim:

Alright, guys, the last article I have says, majority of Americans say abortion is morally wrong, in fact, it’s the highest number they’ve had opposing abortion or at least saying it’s morally wrong in the last many years that they’ve been doing this the study. In fact, the article highlights that since 2000, they have been measuring several different behaviors. Among them are abortion, birth control, embryonic stem cell research, physician-assisted suicide and human cloning. What they found overall and this is a quote from the article. “€œAll five of these behaviors have been measured since early 2000s and Americans have increasingly taken a more liberal view on many of them since then. Abortion is the only exception.”€

So what’s interesting in looking at, first of all, the headline of the article caught me when it says majority of Americans say abortion is morally wrong. We live in a culture who has a really hard time saying what is morally wrong or right. We know just statistics in polling where most Americans, they”€™re not even sure that morals exist anymore, that absolute moral truth exists anymore.

We know certainly for Millennials, there was a poll that showed 80% of Millennials didn’t believe that moral truth existed or that moral absolutes existed. And so the fact that people are recognizing that something is morally wrong is significant in and of itself, but then to see that the number of Americans who believe that abortion is morally wrong has grown to where now it’s a majority of Americans, that is a very interesting thing. And when you start looking at what is here and that was a Gallup poll by the way. So Gallup is the one that did that one.

55% Of Voters Think It’s Totally Fine To Say No Abortion After Six Weeks

But there are other polls that have found very similar things. There was a Hill Harris X survey that found that 55% of voters said they do not think laws banning abortion after six weeks is when you can detect the unborn baby’s heartbeat. They said that abortions after six week or laws that banned abortions after six weeks are not too restrictive. Meaning that they think it’s totally fine to say no abortion after six weeks. That’s the majority of Americans saying that. Well, it gets even more interesting to me because”€¦

David:

And by the way, Tim, let me add to that that you talked about the majority of Americans, so 55%. And folks need to understand that just because is majority doesn’t mean it”€™s 51-49 or that is 55-45. Generally, there’s about 15% of the people who don’t have an opinion, one way or the other. So you’re really talking about 51 versus 34, 35, 36 or you’re talking about 55 versus 30″€¦

Tim:

There’s a margin the middle who doesn’t take a position.

David:

That’s right. So it really is a much bigger margin than what it sounds like when we just say majority.

Harvard University Poll Found Only 8% Of Americans Think Abortion In The Third Trimester Should Be Permitted

Tim:

So there was a Harvard University poll that came out and Harvard University is generally recognized for doing good work when it comes to some of their research. But this poll came out and found that just 6% of Americans said abortion should be allowed up to the end of the birth of the child and only 8% of Americans said it should be permitted at all in the third trimester. Now, this is huge. Because you’re talking about and we’ve talked about on the show with Virginia and New York and place that said”€¦

David:

Well, can you name a current Democrat presidential candidate that does not support abortion all the way up to the point of birth?

Tim:

Ooh and that’s still in the field right now, no. I think all of them support abortion.

David:

They’re all at 6%…

Reconsider Roe Versus Wade

Tim:

In the third trimester and maybe even all the way up to birth. Which yeah, that puts him in such a small percentage of Americans and now this is to me the part that’s most interesting at the end. It also found that a majority of Americans want the US Supreme Court to revisit Roe versus Wade.

So what Harvard found in this poll is that most Americans think that Roe versus Wade which happened 1973 made abortion legal on the nation, that the Supreme Court should go back and consider that because they don’t think that’s exactly right. Guys, that’s really good news that we’re seeing at least on this issue, the majority of Americans are recognizing that abortion is morally wrong and we maybe should change Roe vs. Wade.

Rick:

Well, it was a great way to finish out our Good News Friday for the day because is a general across the whole nation. That kind of polling data tells you, we’re moving in the right direction. You gave us specific examples of where that was happening across the country earlier in the program, I mean, that’s just a big, big, big change from where we were 25-30 years ago as we were talking about earlier.

Lots of great news, thank you guys for so much good news today. Well, friends, we are out of time for today. That’s all the good news we can share with you today, but we’ll have more next Friday and the Friday after. So be sure and listen to those Good News Friday programs. Or go to the website today at www.wallbuilderslive.com, click on the archive section and you can grab some of the Good News Friday programs from the past few months. We challenge you to be engaged.

Check Out The Great Resources And Training At WallBuilders Today

Hit our website today, www.wallbuilderslive.com, click on the contribute button. That’s your chance to come alongside us, to financially support what we’re doing. That’s absolutely necessary for us to do this program, to reach so many people, to train legislators and pastors and young leaders, all of the things we’re doing to preserve America’s constitutional republic, you get to be a part of it when you make that contribution there at www.wallbuilderslive.com.

And by the way, we want to encourage you to join us this spring. We’ve got several dates where we’re doing our constitutional defense course out at Front Sight. And that’s your chance to come and train side-by-side with us, to be on the ranges with us, so I’ll teach the Constitution in the evenings and you will learn how to defend your family during the day right there on those ranges from the expert instruction of the folks out at Front Sight. So check out, joining us at one of those. You can do that at www.patriotacademy.com. Click on the constitutional defense courses. Pick a date and come join us. We’d love to have you there where there”€™s a great time of fellowship, but most importantly, you’re going to learn how to defend yourself and your family.

Thanks so much for listening. You’ve been listening to WallBuillders. Live.