Faucian Bargain, Unfounded Covid Fears – With Steve Deace, Part 2: Should “experts” be able to be questioned? How many times has Dr. Fauci been wrong? How many times has he flip-flopped? What changed on from February 28 – March 11, 2020? How is Anthony Fauci tied to China? How did Fauci affect the elections? Tune in for an important broadcast you need to hear!

Air Date: 04/21/2021

Guest: Steve Deace

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith and the Culture


You find your way to the intersection of faith and the culture. Thanks so much for joining us today on WallBuilders Live, where we’re talking about today’s hottest topics on policy, and faith and the culture, always from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

My name is Rick Green. I’m a former Texas legislator and America’s constitution coach. David Barton is our founder here at WallBuilders. He’s America’s premier historian. He’s not going to be with us today, because we’re going to have the second part of our interview with Steve Deace. 

Tim Barton, also not going to be with us today. He’s a national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. Both those guys get to enjoy the day off from radio while they’re out solving all kinds of other problems and influencing the culture in other ways.  

But we’re going to jump back into our interview with Steve Deace. He was with us yesterday to talk about his new book “Faucian Bargain”, which you need to get it. It’s an amazing read. You can get it on Audible, if you’d rather listen to it than read it. I bought 10 copies myself, I encourage you to do the same thing and hand it out to your friends and family. 

It’s part of how we’re going to shake our nation out of these COVID crackdowns. It’s more than just the data and the science. It also gives the history on these things, how we ended up here and how we get out of this mess.

So if you missed yesterday, the first part of this interview, be sure and check it out today at wallbuilderslive.com. It’s there in the archive section. Also, want to encourage you to check out biblicalcitizens.com, get signed up to host a biblical citizenship class today, soon as possible, like have a class going tomorrow. Don’t hesitate. 

You can do so quickly. It’s free. You can sign up to be a coach. It’s free. You can host the class for free. Your students get to attend the class for free, and it will get great information in their hands.

This is a new class that has Kirk Cameron and Mat Staver, Rabbi Daniel Lapin, Jack Hibbs, Rob McCoy, the list goes on and on and on. And it’s an excellent, excellent way to learn, not only about the Constitution, but what the Bible says about how government should work and what our role as citizens should be in our culture if we truly want to be salt and light. So check that out of biblicalcitizens.com and get your class started as soon as possible.

We’re going to take a quick break. When we come back, we will jump back into our interview with Steve Deace. Again, the book is called “Faucian Bargain”. Stay with us, you’re listening to WallBuilders Live.


This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. American patriot Paul Revere wrote to alert Americans of the impending arrival of the British. But he also sought patriot leader Samuel Adams and John Hancock to warn them that the British were seeking their execution. Adams and Hancock were staying with the Reverend Jonas Clark in Lexington.

When they asked Pastor Clark if his church was ready for the approaching British, he replied, “I’ve trained them for this very hour, they will fight and if need be die under the shadow of the house of God.” Later that morning, 70 men from his church, a several 100 British in the first battle of the war for independence. 

As Pastor Clark affirmed, “The militias that morning were the same who filled the pews of the church meeting house on the Sunday morning before.” The American church was regularly at the forefront of the fight for liberty.

For more information on this pastor and other colonial patriots, go to wallbuilders.com.


Welcome back to WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. We’re going to jump back into our interview with Steve Deace. Yesterday, we talked about the main questions of how deadly is COVID-19? Can we trust any of the numbers on the number of deaths? What’s the difference between dying from COVID and dying of COVID? 

What about all the cures, all the people that have had the virus either didn’t even know they had it or maybe they did get sick, but there were cures that worked for them? The fact that those were kept secret, literally, people banned from social media, doctors losing their jobs for simply talking about these things that have worked and continue to work, just criminal.

Faucian Bargain

Anyway, we covered all of that yesterday, and we were just about to get into Anthony Fauci himself. That’s of course, the title of the book Faucian Bargain and talk about Anthony Fauci’s history and why he was put in such a position of power. This is a guy that for some, he’s the most trusted man in America, especially for the Democrats and for the Biden administration. But for a large percentage of us, this is a guy that, look, narcissist, a fraud. Which view is right? Obviously, we know based on your book, but which view is right and what can you tell people that really was the linchpin for you to finally say this guy is not speaking truth to the American people?


The minute I was told day one last year, he’s unassailable, I don’t care who it is. Alright. I’m a total depravity kind of guy. 

You come at me with anybody, man and tell I don’t care who they are, I don’t care what they’ve done, I just don’t buy it. There’s a man that doesn’t have a red light district somewhere in his brain, doesn’t have some red in the ledger, period. Alright. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.

So all of a sudden, there’s immense pressure and stress, the worst pandemic, maybe since the Spanish flu, or at least, the Hong Kong flu, a half century ago, out of the shadow steps somebody who’s unassailable, who’s just unquestioned? Nah. Not buying it. 

So for me, it just began with a biblical understanding of human nature. I was just like, yeah, I’m going to need to see proof of that, the receipts of that, somebody’s got some weaknesses somewhere, okay. And then it was just a matter of, then at that point, you just follow it as analysis and the outcome of it.

You know, there’s this notion right now, and we talked about it in the introduction of “Faucian Bargain, Eisenhower warned about the rise of an expert class in his farewell address. And at the dawn of the scientific advancement of the microchip is when he was leaving the White House and he said, hey, we’re going to get great advancements in these years to come, but be careful, you don’t essentially create an oligarchy of experts, right? 

Rise of the “Expert” Class

We have done that. But this particular episode, Rick, is worse. It would be one thing if we just like Lemmings handed over our freedom and liberty to smart people that were smart and good at this. That would be terrible enough. But we actually handed it off to somebody who has been anywhere from inaccurate to malevolently wrong this entire time.

 And one of the key questions we ask in our book, and we have a just an entire chapter that documents all his flip flops, everything he’s been wrong about the entire time, but he wasn’t originally wrong. In January, he told the American people asymptomatic spread is not what drives respiratory viruses. He’s right about that. 

He said, on March 8th, on 60 Minutes, you don’t need mask, mask don’t work. He’s right about that. Okay. And on February 28th, he wrote and accurately predicted what the ultimate fatality ratio for COVID was going to be.

And so what I would like to know, and I think what we have to know, because we can’t have the other half of the country that you and I represent, they’ve now been conditioned not to believe the next plague is real, or is a real existential event because they’re, they’ve been gaslighted so much on this one. We need to establish a plumb line. And so here’s what we need to know. 

What Changed March 11?

What changed on March 11th? Everything, the whole world changed as far as we know it on March 11th. That is the day Anthony Fauci went to Congress and testified, this is going to be Captain trips, he went full dinosaur, run for your lives. And that night is when the NBA college basketball shut down, concerts around the country did, the country was entirely shut down within the next week.

What changed from February 28th? He didn’t write, this wasn’t a Facebook post, folks. This is the most preeminent medical journal in the country. And so he did a Linda Blair like about face here on March 11th, and he’s been on the panic porn and denied any positive news whatsoever ever since. 

Why? Why? what? What changed? What new data did he get in those days? What information did he glean? Somebody needs to ask that question of him.

Now, your follow up, because I’ve done this in other interviews, and you guys always follow up with me, what I would follow up with too, if I were in your shoes. But what do you think it is? If I had to guess, if we put the wonder woman lasso of truth around, now this would just be an educated guess, that’s all it is. 

But if I had to guess, somewhere during that time period, he got word from the intelligence community that we can’t trust anything China is telling us about this, that we can’t use any of their baseline assumptions at all, and so we’re flying blind kid, we’re in the dark. We’re going to have to figure this out in real time on our own, okay.

And at that point, he’s got a problem. Because he has a lot of ties to China. He has direct ties to the Wuhan Institute of Virology. His department has directly funded it. Under his leadership, the Obama administration ordered him to stop doing gain of function research with them the last couple of years of the administration. That’s the dangerous research that Steve Hilton has been talking about on Fox News. 

That’s basically dropping an atom bomb in your backyard, because you want to see what it does to the lawn. Okay. That’s essentially what gain function such as. You let the bad thing out in order to test how to push back against it.

To Cover His Own…


So you’re saying you think he essentially overcorrected to cover his own rear? I mean, he went…


Yeah. There’s enough various tie there. Because if this thing did escape a lab, whether it was originated there, or let’s just say they were trying to isolate it and worked on it, and it escaped, whatever the case may be, eventually, that tie is going to come back to him. And so let’s just deal with very basic human nature. 

This is the way, the duplicitousness, the defensiveness that he has exercised many times this past year. This is the way men act, whether there are depts or heads of companies or pastors when they know there’s compromise going on that hasn’t come to light yet and they’re trying to keep beach balls balanced at the exact same time.

That is my theory is that he found out that everything, all the initial assumptions from the WHO in China were bunk, that they couldn’t be trusted, that the Chinese probably were either engineering or trying to alter the natural virus in some way, shape or form, maybe beneficially, they were trying to figure out how to cure it, maybe malevolently, we don’t know. 

But that ultimately would lead back to him because of how often and closely he has worked with them. And that has led to sort of this. This is why a kid who graduated from Community College like me has been able to expose a guy that is brilliant as him, because he’s talking out of both sides of his we’re in.


Steve Deace, our special guest today, the book “Faucian Bargain”, get not a copy, get many copies and hand them out to every friend, family, church member, anyone that is as caught up in the fear of all of this, get them this truth and help to set them free. Stay with us, folks, we’ll be right back on WallBuilders Live.


Have you ever wanted to learn more about the United States Constitution, but just felt like man, the classes are boring, or it’s just that old language from 200 years ago, or I don’t know where to start? People want to know, but it gets frustrating because you don’t know where to look for truth about the constitution either.

Well, we’ve got a special program for you available now called Constitution Alive! With David Barton and Rick Green. And it’s actually a teaching done on the Constitution at Independence Hall in the very room where the constitution was framed. We take you both to Philadelphia, the cradle of liberty and Independence Hall and to the WallBuilders’s library, where David Barton brings the history to life to teach the original intent of our Founding Fathers.

We call it the Quickstart Guide to the Constitution, because in just a few hours through these videos, you will learn the citizen’s guide to America’s constitution, you’ll learn what you need to do to help save our constitutional republic. It’s fun, it’s entertaining, and it’s going to inspire you to do your part to preserve freedom for future generations. It’s called Constitution Alive! With David Barton and Rick Green. You can find out more information on our website now at wallbuilders.com.

The Elections


We’re back here on WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us, Steve Deace, our special guest today, the book is called “Faucian Bargain”, get you many copies of it, and get them out to anybody that you really care about, if you want them to have some truth about what has been, by far the worst public policy decisions, certainly in my lifetime, maybe in all of history, in terms of how much it’s cost us in lives, in the economy, in just our trust in each other, I mean, just totally destructive.

So Steven, before the break, we were starting to talk about Fauci himself, how he ended up in this this position of power, why we don’t trust what he says anymore. And you made the point, I can’t recall exactly how early it was. I know it was somewhere around mid-summer, maybe even before that last year, that if Trump ended up losing reelection, that it would come back to this decision not firing Anthony Fauci and allowing him to have center stage as long as he did. Do you think that’s actually what happened?


Absolutely. I mean, the tentacles, the subplots, the scene is a hydra now, alright, and we have fought the Democratic Party for decades on mail-in voting. Right? That’s the holy grail, man, that they have wanted to uproot the election process. 

This gave them the rationale to impose it. And that system, I would argue, as someone who’s ran the election number of times, I think, is ultimately he’s undoing, that’s why I lost. And so yes, is the answer.

I think that what happens is that the White House felt pressure to put somebody who was a friendlier face in front of the country than a lightning rod president. And so I think, this came from the socialite in New York circles. And, frankly, before running for President, Donald Trump spent a lot more time at places like Eight Benefits than hanging out with people like us, if we’re going to be honest.

A Mythological Figure

And so I think that Anthony Fauci was the softer side of Sears and lo and behold, he ends up getting built into a mythological figure. And so we start getting our own real time data in the spring. But what people in the White House start figuring out wait a minute here, man, we’ve been hacked to some extent. Alright. 

But the polls are still showing people are still panic so now they’re in that classic conundrum despite Trump’s unique personality, he’s in that classic republican conundrum of well, the poll say I need to moderate, but moderate is also at alienates my base at the exact same time. So you split your own coalition how many times we played that movie out, we know that one ends, right? Okay.

Alright, and so they did the COVID-19 version of read my lips, no new taxes, o, wait, here’s the largest tax increase effort. And so they kind of tried to ride this fence, and you know, Confucius said, a man who rides fence for too long eventually gets nether regions caught in it. I mean, I’ll never forget when he came out with the presser at the task force on how to reopen the country. I mean, that was so well done, so well presented. 

I sent a note to my old Cruz campaign cohort, Kellyanne Conway, I was like, wow, you guys really pulled that thing off, welldone, and she was very, very gracious. The next two days, Trump went there and complained in my own about Brian Kemp reopening Georgia to fast, just undermined his own message.

And so in the midst of this, Fauci is gaining more and more mainstream media invulnerability. And by the time the White House figured out that they had to let this guy go, I think they were trapped, meaning that they got the blowback of getting rid of them, as much as he had to go, the blowback could be even worse. They needed to bring Dr. Scott Atlas in June instead of August, so they could have more aggressively pushed the reopening schools issue, that would have more instantly expose the teacher unions. You should see how much damage that’s done to the Left here this year. I

magine if the American people had seen teachers say, well, I won’t even go back with a vaccine in September or October, it really wasn’t until Trump got COVID himself, went to the hospital, got Regeneron and got some treatments, got out that that’s really when he was on the messaging that he probably needed to be on much earlier. But by then, sort of the die was cast and especially with the mail-in voting scheme.

The Great Reset


So in reality, out of what they thought they needed in pushing him out front, they created their own Frankenstein, I mean, they literally built this machine?


Yes. In a way, to use a theological analogy, this isn’t the only end times theory, but it’s the most prevalent and popular one in western circles today: the idea of the rise of Antichrist, the rapture, the tribulation, right. Alright. So it’s a little bit like how the enemy in that eschatological tradition, the enemy does not know when Christ will rapture his church, but he is ready and prepared to accelerate his events for when the church goes away. 

He’s just waiting for the moment. And that’s a little bit like what our global elites did with this. They had no idea when the moment was going to present themselves that they could push for their “Great Reset”. But the minute COVID-19 appeared, they realized that this was it. They didn’t engineer COVID-19 or anything of that nature, but they were ready to take advantage of it.


Yeah, no doubt about it. Okay, we’ve got to end with some solutions before I let you go. People are, I mean, absolutely gripped by fear right now the logic side of their brain is shut down. Data means nothing to them at this point, because they just can’t process it when they’re in that state of fear. How do we get them to snap out of it and snap back to reality?


Number one, you’ve got to really pressure your local leadership. This book will help you with the data that you need, the footnotes that you need in order to go to your county. Forget your department of health. 

Go to the places of people who have to get your votes, your local government, your city councils, your school boards. I have gotten emails, even from people in school boards on California, who ended up using the data we have shared to open their schools up and get their communities reopened again.

So go to the pressure point of scratch where it itches, practice the Christian tradition of subsidiarity, that the government that is closest to the people is the most accountable. Alright, so start there…

Start Local


Local, local, local, that’s the place you can use this the most. Yeah.


Yes, start there. Number two, move to Florida, or Iowa where I live, if you can. Alright? Like…


We were just bragging on Iowa: number one in freedom right now on some of these lists. Yeah.


Yeah. And then, number three, and this is a phrase that we’ve kind of lost, because Christians had hegemony in American in Western culture for a long, long time. That’s changing now. We need to recover the lost art of civil disobedience. 

I don’t want to see any more… I get emails and stuff or videos all the time, Rick, I see one brave woman walk into a drugstore without a mask. Where are the men? Enough of that….


That’s right. That’s right.


Your men act like, walk in with the authority God has created you with and granted you, walk in there. You’re not taking it, they can’t arrest you all. Alright. The Montgomery bus boycott, the Birmingham bus boycott wasn’t just one or two people didn’t shut down the bus MTA in Birmingham, Alabama. Alright, it took a large group of them, a triple braided cord is tougher to break.

No Longer Consent

The mask is the talisman of the COVID branch comedian, spirit of the age. It’s the idol of this era. It is the pan idol accessory of Philippi. It’s the Baal, the Asherah pole. We need to smash this Shibboleth. Alright? You need to punch this thing face down in the dirt the way that Samson did to the pagan goddess, the pagan fish demon, Dagon. 

Alright. And that is we’re going in and we’re not wearing them and you can’t arrest us all. So we need more and more men taking leadership and saying, you know, government by the consent of the governed. What’s that mean? I no longer consent. Thank you. That’s what we need.


Amen. And do we need to use the Polish pastor’s accent when we say get out, out? You’re not welcome here. No Gestapo here. No Nazis here. Do we need to do the accent thing or does it matter?


I think it would maybe add a little theatrical for sure. But joking, but that gentleman isn’t too far removed from… Where they used to show up at his door there and then…


And it was so powerful, it was needed what he did. I’ve watched that video, I don’t know how many times; played it for people, I don’t know how many times, because that is what has been needed. And I couldn’t agree with you more. I’m so tired of walking through airports as the only person without a mask. I smile as big as I can. 

I mean, one time, there was another guy big old biker dude, big beard, the whole nine yards. I was like, yes, my people I love it. But there’s just not enough of it. And people have got to do civil disobedience. You’re so right about that.


At least if you don’t want to go full bore on a mask, you can do something. You know what? Wear a mask that has a sheep on it. Write “useless” on your mask. Write “placebo” on your mask. 

Mocking Masks

Write “control” on your mask. Alright. You can at least desecrate the Shibboleth that you’re not… You know, jumping to the smashing. That’s a big step. I get it. Okay. But how about taking up the initial step? 

Let me mock and desecrate, let me turn this mask into what Elijah did at Mount Carmel? I don’t know maybe, your gods on the toilet, maybe that’s why he’s not answering while you cut yourself…

We could at least mock it. There’s an old Catholic tradition that says what the devil hates the most is to be mocked. So at the very least, if we’re not ready to completely smash these things yet and go rogue at the very least, a little mockery and scorn might go a long way.


Oh, you just gave me a brilliant idea. I’m going do this. So when I’m getting off the plane from now on, I’m going to have at least three copies of “Faucian Bargain” to hand off to the stewardesses and stewards, as a parting gift to them as I leave with my, the only mask I wear is the one I have to wear on the plane and it simply says Romans 1:22 “Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.”

Steve, you are amazing, man. I am so thankful for you. God is using you in a mighty way right now. This book has got to get in the hands of as many people as possible. Faucian Bargain: The Most Powerful and Dangerous Bureaucrat in American History. 

Don’t get one, folks, get 10 copies, give at least and give them to your friends and family or do what I’m going to do now and hand them to the folks at the airlines when you’re walking out.

Steve Deace’s New Book

Steve, keep up the great work. Best way for people to listen to your podcast, to get on your email list, all of those things, tell us where folks can find you.


Go to iTunes and just search for Steve Deace, D-E-A-C-E or Stitcher any of those places for now, because you know, we’re all day to day on social media these days. On Twitter @SteveDeaceShow or look for my name Steve Deace on Facebook. Or blazetv.com/deace, which again is D-E-A-C-E, blazetv.com/deace.


Steve, appreciate you so much, man. Let’s get you back again soon.


Anytime, brother. God bless you.


Stay with us, folks, we’ll be right back on WallBuilders Live.


Hey, guys, we want to let you know about our new resource we have here at WallBuilders called The American Story. For years, people have been asking us to do a history book and we finally done it. We start with Christopher Columbus and go roughly through Abraham Lincoln. 

And one of the things that so often we hear today are about the imperfections of America, or how so many people in America that used to be celebrated or honored really aren’t good or honorable people.

One of the things we acknowledge quickly in the book is that the entire world is full of people who are sinful and need a savior, because the Bible even tells us that all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. And yet what we see through history and certainly is evident in America is how a perfect God uses imperfect people and does great things through them.

The story of America is not the story of perfect people. But you see time and time again how God got involved in the process and use these imperfect people to do great things and impacted the entire world from America. To find out more, go to wallbuilders.com and check out The American Story.


We’re back here on WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us today. I really want to thank Steve Deace for today and yesterday, and for the book “Faucian Bargain”, but just so much truth rapid fire in his typically hilarious way that he does it. If you’re paying close attention, you can’t help but laugh as he’s hitting you with truth bombs. They can be painful. And I’m just thankful for him.

Anyway, I’m glad he was on today really, when I encourage you to get the book “Faucian Bargain”, and do what I did: buy at least 10 copies, give them out to folks. This is how we’re going to shake people out of this, just this trance that the fear has created and each of us have a role to play. 

I agree with Steve 100%, it’s going to take civil disobedience, little things here and there, being willing to take off the mask, being willing to open up your business or your church or whatever, it might be. And it’s just time to take our nation back, take our freedom back and actually start living those things out. I’m so thankful that Steve has done what he’s done.

You know, earlier this week, we had Pastor Rob McCoy, he has been fighting this battle from the beginning there in Ventura County, California, and just been an example to pastors across the country. So very thankful for these leaders like Rob and Steve.

Faucian Bargain, Unfounded Covid Fears – With Steve Deace, Part 2

I want to thank you as well, not only for listening today, I know many of you out there share the program on your social media outlets. That’s a way of expanding this truth, reaching more people out there. A lot of people never heard of WallBuilderss Live, and then you send them a program and they get hit with all these truth bombs. 

They get hungry for truth, they start hosting Constitution classes or biblical citizenship classes because you planted the seed. So please continue to do that. You can do all of that on our website, wallbuilders.com.

You can also plant a seed, a financial seed by making a contribution, it can be one-time, it can be monthly, it can be $5, it can be $5,000. Whatever you can do, when you donate to WallBuilders Live, you are helping us reach more people. It allows us to train more pastors in our pastors briefings, to do more with our legislators in the legislators conference that we do, all the young people that we train through Patriot Academy and a leadership training program, all of those things happen, because people like you donate to fund those things. That’s the fuel that it takes to reach people.

So thank you to all of you that have been doing that already. And if you haven’t before, and you enjoy the program, and you’re blessed by it, if you’re equipped and you’re inspired, then please consider paying a little bit of that forward so that more people can get the same experience. You know, the more of us that learn these truths and actually apply them, better chance we have of saving our constitutional republic.

Thanks so much for tuning in today. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live!