Conservatives and Liberals: The Hostility of Higher Education Towards American Values-We are on part two of our Higher Education series! We discuss some polls of conservatives versus liberals throughout the country and learn the shocking evidence of how the numbers are drastically reversed on college campuses. David also talks about anti-Israel propaganda, college debt, speech codes, paying a lot of attention to where you send your kids to college, understanding the philosophy on most universities, and how to make sure we stand for our conservative American values even on liberal campuses.

Air Date: 12/27/2017

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Tim Barton, and Rick Green.


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast.  However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture


You”€™ve found your way to the intersection of faith and the culture.  Thanks for joining us here on WallBuilders Live! We”€™re in the middle of a five-part series on universities. It’s a really great presentation David shared at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference.

We’re here in studio with David Barton, he”€™s America’s premier historian. And, Tim Barton, he”€™s a national speaker and pastor. And my name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas state legislator.

One of the things we love doing on WallBuilders Live is just talking about the day’s hottest topics. But doing it from a Biblical, historical, and Constitutional perspective. If you’d like to learn more about us and the program you can visit our websites at – that’s our radio site. List of our stations there and a lot of other great information. And then is our main website.

And, in fact, I encourage you, when you go to, to check out Four Centuries of American Education where David dives even further into the history of our universities and really a great history of our universities. It’s a shame what they’ve become today. But David shared some of that yesterday in the presentation that he gave at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference.

A Major Influence on the Culture


We’re here in the studio with David and Tim right now. And guys, we’re going to pick up where David left off in the presentation from yesterday. But, David, you laid out some of the negative results of what we’re getting out of universities today and it”€™s a major influence on the culture. So, this is important not only to the legislators that were listening to you in the live audience there but to all of our listeners on the program today. And, Tim, you pointed out yesterday how important it is for parents to make good decisions about where you send your money and your kids to these university campuses around the country.


Yeah, Rick, it is so important to think about education for the next generation knowing that this is really shaping so much of who they will become for the rest of their life. Not to discredit or to take away from all that parents have invested to this point. But it’s why it’s so silly if parents have invested so much time, effort, energy, money, blood, sweat, tears, whatever, if you’ve invested that much into your kids, into your grandkids, then why would you send them to a place that would directly counter everything you’ve been trying to put in them their whole life? It just doesn’t make sense some of the things we do. We talked about debt yesterday and how they’re coming out with debt and then they can’t find a job.

Why Would You go into Debt When You Don’t Even Know What You Want to do With Your Life?


They’re trying to pay the debt and they don’t have a job to pay the debt. And it just doesn’t seem like we really think through some of these things. It’s almost just a tradition or a habit that, hey, now we go to college because this is what we do. Which, one of the things I  tell young people quite often is, until you know what you want to do with your life, college doesn’t make sense. Why would you go into debt when you don’t even know what you want to do with your life?

You go to college to help gain more understanding of what it is you want to do. But if you have no idea what you want to do, spending 30,000 dollars a year to find out what you want to do is probably not the smartest decision. I’ll joke with kids and tell them, actually, you can just give me 20,000 dollars a year and I’ll help you figure out what you want to do with your life. Right?




I’ll save you ten thousand dollars a year.

Gap Year Programs


Actually, Tim, I’m so glad you brought that up though because as people listen to this throughout this week, they’re going to be thinking about this and go, “€œWait a minute, maybe I don’t want my kid to go at 18 if they don’t know what they want to do.”€ So some of the cool things they can do are these gap year type programs. Take that year after high school and go spend it at High Point. Go to the Leaders Academy in Hot Springs and have an opportunity to learn some skills, and to have great fellowship, and to build your foundation, and help figure out what you want to do before you go get that degree.


Which, by the way, this is something that parents ought to be having these conversations with their kids when they’re 14, and 15, and 16, and 17, and when they’re 6, and 7, and 8, and 9. I can’t tell you how many seniors I talked to and say, “€œHey, what do you want to do with your life?”€

“€œI really don’t know.”€

Well, it’s probably time that you have figured that out, that you need to start thinking. “€œWell, you know, I just I don’t really know.”€

And so what skills do you have? What are you good at? “€œWell, I don’t really know.”€ These are things that we ought to be having these conversations before they have left high school. Because if you finish high school, and you have no idea, or no vision for where you want to go and what you want to do in life, well, probably as parents and grandparents we’re missing some of our job in helping them find the vision that God has called them, of whatever He wants them to do and be. We need help will lead them to that place.




And so this is something that we really want to be thinking about before we send our kids to college. They need to have a vision for that.

Entitlement Generation


And you don’t even want to make the assumption that, “€œWell, my kids know what they want to do, and they’re okay, and I can send them.”€ No, if you look around right now, so much of what the older generation thinks the culture is really becoming goofy. That there’s an entitlement generation, everything is due to us, the government should give me free education, free everything. And by the way, when I get out of college, I’m moving back in with mom and dad and all that. We say, “€œWell, my kids will never do that.”€

Well, how many other parents have said exactly the same thing and now their facing– and where did all this nonsense come from? It’s what happens once you leave college. Because you’ve had four years of being indoctrinated and not educated. That’s specifically what we’re going to talk about today is you’re not getting an education – you’re getting an indoctrination. And if you think you’re sending your kids off for an education, and they’re sound when you send them, that doesn’t mean they won’t be indoctrinated.


We’re going to pick right back up where we left off yesterday. David, you gave a great presentation at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference. We’re going to now share that with our audience. Yesterday was the first part in this five-part series. So folks, if you missed that, be sure go to the archives section of our website and then share this with your friends and family, folks.

Everybody in America Needs to Hear This Presentation

Everybody in America needs to hear this presentation. And not only discover what the problem is on the university campuses, and the negative impact this is having on the country, but, what are the solutions and what you can do about it and your family.

Quick break. When we come back we’ll pick up where David left off yesterday at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference.

America”€™s History

This is David Barton with another moment from America’s history. Since the Ten Commandments have formed the basis of civil law in the western world for over 2,000 years and an individual is more likely to find a copy of them in a government building rather than a religious one. Yet, amazingly, numerous rulings over recent years now make it unconstitutional to display the commandments in many public arenas.

Consider what Founding Father John Adams said about this, he declared, “€œThe moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, anarchy and tyranny commence. If “€˜thou shall not covet”€™ and “€˜thou shall not steal”€™ were not commandments of heaven, they must be made inviolable precepts in every society before it can be civilized or made free.”€

John Adams believed that no society could remain civilized if separated from the Ten Commandments. For more information on God’s hand in American history contact WallBuilders at 1 800 8 REBUILD.  

Let”€™s Go For Some More Academic Expectations


Academic expectations is the number one purpose — presidents say — is the number one purpose is to create productive members of the workforce. Now let’s go for some more academic expectations. We’ve already looked at the first one – productive members of the workforce, and that’s not working out very well. What’s the second thing that college presidents say is the reason that higher education exists? They say number two is to prepare young people to be responsible citizens.

So, according to them, a responsible citizen. Citizen is someone who’s a member of their country, a citizen is someone who engages in the politics of their country, engages in preserving the form of government of their country, is engaged in the civic aspects of their country. Alright, so if we go back to 1966, 58 percent of students stayed informed of political affairs. You move ahead to 2002, 33 percent of students stayed informed of political affairs and it has gone down since 2002. So, the second most important purpose of college is to make responsible citizens and we ain”€™t anywhere close to that.

Young Adults Are Least Likely to Vote of Any Age Group in the U.S.


Maybe one out of four students come out of college with any desire at all to be involved as a citizen. So, we’re creating three out of four students who don’t want anything to do with citizenship in their country and civic involvement. Go further – 18 to 24-year-olds, voting rates fell from 51 percent in 1964 to 38 percent in 2012. And currently, young adults are the least likely to vote of any age group in the United States. So, what we do in universities – we take out of any desire to be involved in the civic affairs of your nation.

We’re not preparing good citizens, we’re preparing you not to be involved. Whatever we do to you at that university-level makes you not want to be involved at a rate higher than any other group out there. So, that’s not what we’re supposed — this doesn’t help perpetuate the Republic. We’re supposed to be doing things, that’s what education was all about so you can have informed citizens, so you can perpetuate the Republic, keep the republican form of government, and I don’t say that with a big “€œR,”€ I say that with a small “€œr.”€ That’s our form of government, Republican form of government.

We want to perpetuate that we’re not doing that. So, again we’re putting a lot of money into turning out kids who are doing exactly the opposite of what education’s supposed to be doing. So, when you look at those two aspects and you say, “€œAlright, we’ve looked at some parental expectation.”€ Remember the number one parental expectation of parents was that our kids should be able to get jobs – 70 percent. Let me just go through the others real quick, not going to talk about all of them.

Parental Expectations


“€œWe want our kids to be able to get into a good graduate or professional school and we want a good quality of career placement support services from the University. We want the kids graduated with no debt for him or herself and we want a good job placement rate. Also, we want a first-rate academic experience.”€

These are all things that parents expect from universities from higher education. Look what’s important is look at the right-hand side. Look at how far universities underperform expectations that the public has of them. So, the public has all these expectations of what higher universities, higher education is supposed to do. Look how far it underperformed.

The Expectation of Education and What it Actually Delivers are Two Different Things


Once their kids graduate and they look at the academic experience their kids have had, it’s a dismal failure. You would not survive in the free market if you had that kind of negative numbers on what you — any restaurant would be out of business with that kind of numbers. Any service oriented kind of business would be gone. You can’t survive with those numbers. So, what we have is what people expect of education and what education actually delivers are two totally different things.

And yet, right now, we still have a belief or an expectation that the higher education is going to do certain things and it’s just not doing it. Let me give you some more parental expectations. You look further into what parents expect from colleges. They say, “€œI want my child to attend a college that has and enforces an explicit sexual assault code.”€ 82 percent.

Makes sense – you don’t want your daughter getting raped at college or other sexual — So, that makes sense that you want a university that has an explicit sexual assault code. Number two on the list – “€œI want my child to attend a college that really understands the financial pressures on middle-class families.”€ 76 percent. Now we saw that earlier – parents want a debt-free education, they want the college to feel the pain that they feel in economics.

Student Loan Debt


Now, if we take this for a minute and just look at what we now consider student loan debt. If you know the numbers on student loan debt, you’re aware of that, right now, 66 percent of all graduates graduate with debt. Now we’re talking state universities. State universities largely funded by state dollars, also get federal grants that go with it, so much public money goes into state universities, private universities different deal. But 66 percent of all graduates have debt.

The debt last year was 1.4 trillion in student debt. Which works out, for those students that have debt, it works out to 37,172 dollars per student with debt. And the students have to pay that back. So, the students average a payment of 351 dollars a month once they graduate and three or four of them can’t get a job in the degree field they had.  How do you generate the income to pay off a debt when you can’t get a job with where you just spent your money?   It’s a real problem.

And, by the way, just to show you what’s happened with debt – now, remember we’re talking largely with public universities so much of it funded with tax dollars, what we’re talking is that 1.4 trillion in 2017. Do you know what the debt was in 2004? It was 260 billion. Now that’s six-fold increase since 2004. In 13 years we’ve have had a sixfold — in the last 13 years, what has happened is college debt has increased at the rate of 41 percent per year, which is unbelievable numbers.

When you’re sinking in the hole, you”€™re a kid going to college, and you get a degree you think’s going to work and nobody tells you the free market doesn’t need that degree. And, by the way, we just love cranking out kids here the McDonaldization of education. And you’re going to be in debt for 351 bucks a month once you graduate. Nobody tells them that going in. And so what happens, as a result, we now find there are three — and, by the way, the Bible’s very clear that when you go into debt, you lose your freedom.

You Don”€™t Have Freedom if You”€™re in Debt


And if you doubt that just get a bunch of loans and see what happens when you get a paycheck. Your paycheck is split up where you owe and you don’t have the freedom to– If I have no debt at all, when I get a paycheck, I’ve got a million things I can do with my money. If I’m in debt, my paycheck that I get goes to paying the house mortgage, the car mortgage, the student loan mortgage – I don’t have freedom if I’m in debt. Real simple stuff.

So, what happens with all these kids that are in debt. It has a direct impact on three things that we’re able to document at this point time. When kids come out with that, number one is they can’t get a house, so they move back in with mom and dad. Because they’ve already got a mortgage they are paying every month, they can’t afford two mortgages every month, so they got a mortgage going, essentially a mortgage going on their college education.

The second thing it affects is the marriage rate. “€œI can’t, I don’t have money available to be able to start a family and get married, so let”€™s just shack up and live together.”€ So, cohabitation is through the roof, marriage suffers, I forget the stat, I think Tim told me that 55 percent of millennials have been born out of wedlock. Currently, 55 percent millennials born out of wedlock because you can’t afford to get married.

Debt Kills the Creative Side of Things


And the third thing is although 70 percent of college students want to get into small business, want to start their own business, they can’t because they don’t have any startup money available. They’re in debt, they can’t start up a business, they can’t go out in entrepreneurship because of debt. So, what it does is it kills the creative side of things because they can’t go into the businesses they want. So, debt, college debt, and this is college debt with, again, largely funded by taxpayers that are getting kids who are not productive with jobs because they can’t get a job in a major field. And also, they don’t want to be involved with their country after they get out of college and they’re going into debt to do.

What we’re turning out right now it’s not a good product for the future of the country. Now, go past that. So, that’s the second thing. The third thing parents said was, “€œI want my child to go to a college that enforces strict speech codes like bans on offensive language that uses trigger warnings and that doesn’t permit outside speakers who might offend students.”€ Only 15 percent of parents want that.

Now, what percentage of colleges have that policy? Most, well, a lot. I can’t say, “€œmost”€ because there are not statistics available on how many actually do it. After lunch, you’ll hear from Joe *. They’ve got stats on the speech codes, but, as far as Trigger warnings and all the other stuff, we want we don’t want offensive speakers. Stanley Kurtz is here also and Stanley’s a national columnist who documents all the shout-downs that are now going on universities what’s happening.

Speech Zones


So, there are some stats, but I’ve seen nothing comprehensive in all universities. Nonetheless, you take you take that and what happens as a result of this is you get these speech zones, free speech codes that go. And this is more of what Joe will speak out after lunch. But, just to help you understand what that is. This is speech that the First Amendment will allow you to say anywhere else in the United States.

But, universities won”€™t allow you to say it on campus which is a weird thing. You’ve got a Constitutional right to say the speech anywhere in the United States except on campuses. Now why would we have a bubble zone on campus where you cannot practice Constitutional freedoms? And what happens on campus is this is a pictorial example they give you designated free speech area. You”€™ve got five feet in this area and it’s on the backside of campus under a big oak tree.

Nobody ever goes over there, it’s back to the sewer disposal plants, back there, and you can stand there. And this is a sign that goes with it, notice the sign, “€œThis area has been set aside for individuals or groups exercising their Constitutional First Amendment rights.”€ Your First Amendment right can be practiced within five feet square right there, but don’t get out of the square. And this is real common with universities across the United States. You see here this is the Los Angeles Community College, this is a trend that goes on everywhere.

And what you find right now is 40 percent of universities still have speech zones. Why would we fund a university that will not let you practice your Constitutional rights? That makes no sense at all. We ought to be saying, “€œUniversities, if you will not let kids practice their Constitutional rights, you’re not going to use our tax dollars. Find funding elsewhere. You either get in line with the Constitution or you don’t get funding.”€

Real simple stuff. Put some strings attached on speech codes. Speech codes are absolutely unconstitutional. See, Joe and these guys take them to court all the time. It used to be much higher, just a few years ago, the percentage of universities who had speech codes was way over 40 percent.

Why Are We Wasting Money on Attorneys?


It’s come down because * takes them to court and wins, they don’t lose these cases. So, now, wait a minute, we’re using taxpayer dollars to take the — university attorneys to defend something 100 percent time you lose in court. Why are we wasting money on attorneys when we know we’re going to lose this in court? None of this makes sense. And this is not what parents want.

Only 15 percent of parents want their kids to go to one of these top universities. And yet we have many, many, higher percentage more than that at these universities.

Number four thing is, parents say, “€œI want my child to attend a college that enforces an anti-Israel boycott.”€ Only 7 percent of parents want that. And yet, when you look at the BDS movement, and Phil King mentioned the BDS movement earlier, and a lot of you’ve been involved in anti-BDS legislation.

How Effective is the Propaganda?


We had, on campuses in a recent year, had 1,600 anti-Israel events on campus. Now how effective are — and by the way, we”€™ll look at a verse later, Proverbs 18:17, the Bible says, “€œOne side sounds good until you hear the other side.”€ And so on campus when you”€™re getting all the anti-Israel stuff, how effective is that propaganda? Well, let me just show you. Jewish students — you see up top here U.S. Jewish college students — do they support Israel?

In 2010 84 percent of Jewish students supported Israel. Six years later only 57 percent of Jewish students supported Israel. The anti-Israel propaganda on campus is so high that even Jewish students don’t support Israel anymore. Really? Well, think about kids who don’t have a heart, a cultural, a religious, connection to Israel, they’re just American kids – how do they come out?

These are the kids that have a heart connection to Israel. And you’re down to only 57 percent in only 6 years. That’s a lot of hostility on campus. Parents aren’t wanting that on campus and yet we’re funding this. We’re paying for kids to be indoctrinated against the only free nation in the Middle East.

And we’re saying that it’s the worst nation in the Middle East – really? So, we have that going on. Now, in addition to all that, let’s go to the biggest problem that I think we face in education and it is educational philosophy. And that’s not just my opinion, I’m going to show you documentation on that. And you need to know educational philosophies are important.

“€œThe Philosophy of the Schoolroom in One Generation”€¦”€


If you remember Abraham Lincoln, in a famous quote that was attributed to Abraham Lincoln, Abraham Lincoln said, “€œThe philosophy of the schoolroom in one generation will be the philosophy of government in the next.”€ In other words, what you’re teaching this generation of higher education kids right now is the policies you’ll be living under two decades from now. So, what’s going on right now with, again, higher education largely does not like America, it certainly doesn’t like Israel, doesn’t like free speech, it doesn’t — Guess what your policies look like 20 years from now? It”€™s not the Constitutional freedoms that we’ve grown up with and we’re growing up in an age that’s very hostile to those freedoms. They just won’t exist in future generations with the current trend that goes.

Now, so, by the way, Jesus said the same thing. If you remember what Jesus said in Luke 6:40, He said, “€œEvery student when he’s fully trained will be like his teacher.”€ In other words, the students will pick up the philosophy of those who train them. So, let’s look at what the philosophy of those professors is. What’s the worldview of professors right now?

Liberals, Moderates, and Conservatives


There are ways to measure worldview of professors. One is by their orientation of whether they’re conservative, moderate, or liberal. Now, take the professors, take the people the United States, let’s contrast them and see if professors look like the general public. The general public, when you look at liberals, moderates, and conservatives, the numbers are 24 percent, 35 percent, and 37 percent. So, moderates and conservatives tend to be fairly close to each other.

In this particular poll, 37 percent, conservatives are slightly higher. This is that poll. So by far, liberals are way at the bottom. They’re not even close to the other two groups. Conservatives and moderates, they’re just kind of right there together, but liberals way down here.

And here’s a separate poll, same general results, this is liberals at the bottom here. Conservatives are the red ones in the middle. They have moderates a little bit higher than conservatives, but those two groups are close together. But, let me show you what professors look like. As a matter of fact, let me put the two charts side by side so you can tell.

Professors are Diametrically Opposed to What the General Public Is


The blue down here, this is liberals, there are liberals among professors. The red here is conservative, here are conservatives among professors. Exactly the opposite. They’re just diametrically opposed to what the general public is. And so if you take those numbers and look at them specifically, in 1989, so we’re talking since 28 years ago, professors were at 40 percent, 40 percent, and 20 percent.

Now, where they were 25 years later was at 60 percent, 30 percent, and 10 percent. So, notice conservatives are cut in half, liberals have increased by 50 percent and moderates are down by 25 percent. So, all the growth is on the liberal end and all the real serious attrition is on the conservative end of university professors. They’re nowhere close to where the general public is on their beliefs. Not at all.

And again, when you put kids in that environment, they will pick up the philosophy of those that instruct them. So, that’s part of the worldview. When you look at profs in political science, government, English Lit, philosophy, and religious studies, what you have right now among liberals and conservatives is 80 percent liberals and 5 percent conservatives. Which means that, if you’re in one of those major fields, you’re outnumbered by liberals on a margin of 16 to one. Every conservative professor that teaches in Poli-sci there are 16 liberal professors that teach in Poli-sci.

Institutional Neutrality Just Doesn”€™t Exist at This Point


Every conservative professor that teaches in English lit, there are sixteen liberals. That’s not even anywhere close to equality or parity of ideas. We don’t have institutional neutrality. It just does not exist at this point.

So, this is the philosophy let’s take it different from just philosophy. Let’s go to the partisan divide among professors because this is another thing we can measure. When you look at where the American people are with Republican, Democrat, and Independent, as of right now, the most recent poll, 28 percent of Americans identify as Democrats, 28 percent as Republicans, 41 percent as Independents. So, that’s where American people identify themselves right now. Now what that means is, Republican and Democrat, from the people”€™s standpoint, you have a 1 to 1 margin.

For every one Republican, there’s one Democrat and the rest is that middle group of independents. And Republicans have chased a lot of Republicans into the independent column and you guys know that you’re often stuck with what Washington, D.C. doesn’t get done.  When Republicans in Washington, D.C. get it all goofed up, you guys get blamed for it and so people don’t want to identify as Republican anymore, so they’re now Independents. So, it’s a one to one. So, that’s where we are right now.

With that one to one kind of a thing that goes, how are we with professors? Well, when you take professors and take something like history profs, that”€™s something that interests me.


Well, we’re gonna interrupt David’s presentation there with the legislators. We’ll pick up right there tomorrow. We’re back with David and Tim in studio now. And, David, you were talking about history professors are something you’re interested in and tomorrow I think people are going to be shocked at the number of liberal history professors versus conservative or Democrat versus Republican. And we’ll be doing this throughout the week laying out how bad it is on college campuses. But, then you also talk about the solutions and how we can turn this around.

It”€™s Really Philosophy We”€™re Talking About


Yeah, and it really is bad. We talked today kind of philosophically in that even though there are a lot more conservatives in the nation than there are liberals, at the University level, there are 16 to 1 the opposite direction. But, when you start getting into areas like history, government, and journalism, and other things it is unbelievable how far the bias is in that direction.


And, guys, using conservative and liberal is philosophy. But, the easiest way to identify that philosophy is when you look at, are you Republican? Are you Democrat? And so it’s really not about, well, we need more Republicans or less Democrats, or we need more of this party or that. Well, no, it’s really philosophy we’re talking about.

And when you have so many liberal in philosophy professors, and you have so few conservative, well this is why kids come out thinking that socialism, or communism, or fascism, is better than capitalism in the free market. This is why you have kids thinking that there can be, however, 80 whatever many, gender identities, whatever you feel, and well, truth is up to the individual. Well, all these things that are nonsensical, that don’t work in reality, well, it’s based on a life philosophy. And so this is where when we talk about even the breakdown of how many Democrat professors versus Republican professors, really, what’s more important is the philosophy. Which is the conservative or liberal, but oftentimes it’s easier to find or easiest to identify that philosophy based on that political affiliation and where they’re from.


And you may have a kid that when you sent them to college they’re really conservative. But you know what, when they get ganged up on 16 to one by Ph.D.”€™s, it”€™s going to be tough for any kid to survive that environment. And that’s why there has to be a change in the way we handle universities, do universities. That’s why we gave this presentation to state legislators was to get them looking into that focus and trying to bring some balance back with state universities. But, right now that’s a very dangerous place for kids to be if you don’t know what they’re walking into.

Education:  You”€™ll Be Shocked by the Answer


Going to pick up right there tomorrow when you come back here on WallBuilders Live. And overnight, I just want you to just wonder about this — So, if we’re one to one as David was saying in the presentation on Republicans or Democrats in the country, what’s that ratio on college campuses? Do you think maybe it’s, is it 2 to 1 Democrat professors, 3 to 1? Maybe 5 to 1? Could it even be more than that?

You’re going to be shocked when you find out tomorrow. So, don’t miss tomorrow and throughout the rest of this week. And then next Monday, we”€™ll have the conclusion on this special presentation from David Barden to the legislators that we’re sharing with you our listeners. Thanks for listening today to WallBuilders Live.