Restoring Higher Education’s Purpose, What Is The Solution? Today is part five of diving into this presentation from David Barton at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference. It has to do with what’s happening on our university campuses and just how bad we’ve indoctrinated multiple generations now. It’s why we see a lot of the negative results in the culture. And while we dig a little deeper into the lack of good education being taught today, we also discuss the solutions and how we can all help turn this thing around.  Tune in now to learn the solutions for our higher education problems!  

Air Date: 01/01/2018

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast.  However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture


Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live where we talk about today’s hottest topics on policy, faith, and the culture. Always from a Biblical, historical, and Constitutional perspective.

We’ve definitely got a hot topic today. We spent most of last week diving into this from a presentation that David Barton shared at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference. It has to do with what’s happening on our university campuses. Just how bad we’ve indoctrinated multiple generations now. It’s why we see a lot of the negative results in the culture.

And we’re now going to talk about how to turn it around. So, if you want to identify that problem, if you want to see just how bad it is, you’ve got to listen to some of those programs from last week. So, the first four parts of this series are all from last week here on WallBuilders Live. It’s all available at our website right now – Wall And today we’re going to dive into the solutions.

We’re here with David Barton right now. He’s America’s premier historian and our founder here at WallBuilders. Also, Tim Barton is with us today. He’s the president of WallBuilders and a national speaker and pastor. My name is Rick Green I’m a former Texas state legislator.

Again, the first four parts on our website Also, visit – our main website. And that’s where you can also get Four Centuries of American Education. That’s a DVD where David goes into the history of our universities, what they used to be like, what we’d like to return them to. In terms of actually turning out a good educated, well rounded, and equipped to meet the workforce needs in the country.

We want to do that on our university campuses, but it’s going to take some solutions. David, Tim, today is the program where we start diving into how to turn this thing around.

Educational Bureaucrats


Yeah, one of the things we did for the last four days was show legislators the problems in their own states. And this is usually not what they hear because they deal with educrats and I use that term very specifically – they”€™re educational bureaucrats, they”€™re not necessarily educators. They love the educational system and they defend the system. They don’t really like results which is why states have now gotten away from what would be called standardized testing. We used to be able to compare all 50 states, you can no longer compare them, you can only compare within a state.

So, you can’t compare Texas to Ohio, to Florida, to Oregon, etc., because, well, my goodness, that creates winners and losers. And that’s pressure, so we don’t want that. So, they’ve gotten away from holding the system accountable because they want to preserve the system. And so, in showing legislators what this system is producing, now you’ve got to have ways to fix it. You have to be able to go in and say, “€œYou know what, we’re putting tens, of hundreds, of millions, of dollars into our educational system, particularly higher education.

So many states have land funds that fund education as they became states. The lands of the states were taxed and that goes to fund education. So, there’s tons that go which means you can withhold those funds and say, “€œYou know what, if you don’t clean up your act in this area, and if you don’t start fixing this area, and if you don’t stop doing this, we’re not going to give you state funds. Because what you’re doing, ninety-nine percent of the people in the state, or whatever percentage it is, don’t like that.”€ And most people would agree objectively that money is being spent on things now that are not good for the state, or for the students, or for the country.

And that’s where legislators can have some solutions. And what we can do is go to our legislators and say, “€œHey, you may not have been at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference, but you need to know about this and you really need to fix this issue.”€ So, this is where citizens can really weigh in and start fixing things for hundreds of thousands of students in their state.


And you know, Tim, you talked about when we started this whole series for parents to be aware of what’s happening on the campuses and just make better decisions. This is going to have, as you said, not to discount what we’re doing with that investment for the first 18 years but we don’t want to reverse that. And that’s what generally happens in these four years on college campuses.


Yeah, it does. And it’s something that, as devastating as that must be for parents, you’ve invested so much time, effort, energy, money, blood, sweat, tears, whatever it is, to see it go the wrong direction. It’s something we really have to think through, of, where do want to send our kids? What do we want them to learn? What do we want them to know? But if we know universities are doing something, what can we do to say, “€œHey, stop doing what’s wrong and let’s start doing the right thing.”€

And so that’s really today’s program. We’re going to do a lot of those solutions. And this was specifically for the legislators to say, “€œHey, in your state, here’s what you can do.”€ But if parents, if grandparents, know answers and solutions, not only can they work to do things in their own life for their own kids and grandkids, but they can even contact their state legislator and say, “€œHey, we need to do this. We can’t let the universities in our state get away with this.”€

And so that’s really what today’s program is about.


Stay with us, folks. We”€™re going to take a quick break. And we come back, we’ll be picking up with David in that live presentation at the Pro-Family Legislators Conference. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Pastors Only Briefing Trip


Hi, this is Tim Barton with WallBuilders and I want to encourage all the pastors out there with a unique opportunity that we’re presenting it WallBuilders. We’re doing a special tour just for pastors that you can come and learn more about the spiritual heritage of our nation. Not just seeing the sights but understanding the significance of what they are and what they represent.

We get to go to the Capitol at night.  And we get to see the spiritual heritage of our Founding Fathers, of who we are as a nation, where we came from. We bring in congressman that will tell you about current legislation, about our religious liberties and freedom, and what’s going on in Washington, D.C.

If you’re a pastor or if you want to recommend your pastor for this trip, you can go to our website at And there’s a link that’s for scheduling.  If you click on that link there’s a section for pastor”€™s briefing. There’s more information about the dates, when it’s going, and how it’s going to happen. If you want to know more about our nation, our religious liberties, our freedom, our spiritual heritage, this is a trip you want to be a part of.

Make Sure Universities Become Constitutional


So, problem number one is these free speech codes and bias reporting incidents. That’s the problem we’ve got – what’s the solution for it? Real simple solution is make sure that universities become constitutional. What a radical notion. We’re putting state funds into something that should be constitutional.

Make sure that that they become constitutional. So, what you do is you say, “€œOkay if you have a speech code, if you have a speech zone, or if you have a– if you prohibit due process, we will not fund you.”€ Real simple stuff – you get constitutional or you just lose funding. Real easy stuff. That’s a simple solution.

Now, will you get your brains beaten over that? Absolutely, but not from the public. Again, and I hope you guys understand that so much of the noise is often generated — if you keep up with Twitter by the way, you know that so much the political noise on Twitter is generated by a handful of people. They now have the ability for 10 people, 10 professors, to sit in a room and create what looks like 150,000 tweets that they’ll become trending. It’s amazing to me that news headlines are now created off of what tweets are.

And you’re able to generate tweets by using the mathematical logarithms that they have with tweeting to be able to create a whole bunch of different accounts. And you can — you’ll hear lots of noise. That doesn’t mean that’s where the — you saw where the public was on public opinion polls. Public is nowhere close to where the noise will be on this stuff. And so you”€™ve just got to remember that, yeah, these guys make a lot of noise, but they”€™re a handful and sometimes they”€™re more than a handful.

I”€™m not suggesting they’re insignificant, or irrelevant, or you disregard them, but just remember they’re not the only ones out there. They’re the ones who make the noise. We used to say in the country, “€œYou throw a rock into a pack of dogs and the one that gets hit the hardest will bark the loudest.”€ It’s the ones that don’t get hit that don’t bark – you”€™ve got to remember they’re out there. And so there’s a lot of people who hold a different position from those who bark. So, that’s problem number one.

Missing the Basics


Problem number two is the issue of missing the basics. Let me give you an example. Let me take you through history real quick. If you look at where we are in history right now, if you know what ACTA is – the American Council of Trustees and Alumni – every year they look at US News and World Reports elite universities in America. And every year ACTA at will take and look at one aspect of what’s being taught in the elite universities of America.

And so what they did here a couple of years ago was they looked at history majors and they said, “€œAlright, when you look at the top 76 universities — and that was what was on the list that year, 76 universities — look at the top elite universities in America, what did they do with their history majors? And their report was called “€œAmerica’s Past Passed Over”€ which tells you something about what they found. And they called it a crisis in civic education.

Here’s the deal, out of the top 76 universities in America, if you are a history major, and by the way, what do you do if you get a history major? You go back to school and teach history or you go back and become a curriculum director at a school somewhere.

If you’ve got a history major, not many things you can do with it, but you teach history. If you’re a history major, 65 of the 76 top universities in America they no longer require any course in American history to become a history major. You’ll be teaching our schools and you’ve never had a course in American history at all. Here’s an example. George Washington University just removed US history from required courses for history majors.

This is what’s going on all over the United States, but that’s alright kids get history in high school. Not so much that you would think. As a matter of fact, when you look not just at the elite university, but you look at kids coming out of high school going into college. And you look at kids who are seniors in college, they”€™ve come through high school, they’ve gone through four years of college, here’s what we find right now. Of the top 50 colleges and universities absolutely none require students to take any course in American history before they graduate.

That used to be a standard in all universities.

We Don”€™t Give Any of the Kids History At All


You had to get a course in American history, American economics, a course in civics, government, you had to get that at university level before you could get out of there because you can’t be good citizens if you don”€™t. None of the top 50 requires students to take– So, we’re not only talking, not only are we not giving history majors history, we don’t give any of the kids history at all.

Continues it says, “€œCollege seniors could not identify Valley Forge, words from the Gettysburg Address, or even the basic principles of the U.S. Constitution.”€ They found that given high school level questions, 81 percent of college seniors given high school level questions would receive a D or an F. They don’t even know high school stuff. Now, why won’t they know high school stuff? Because right now, and by the way, I love this, University of Wisconsin, Madison they had a protest over an Abraham Lincoln statue because Lincoln owned slaves.

The Great Emancipator who ended slavery, who never owned a slave, we”€™re protesting a statue– See that’s what happens when you have no clue of American history. You can say Francis Scott Key is a racist and that the third verse of the national anthem is racist. Yeah, we can only say that in the last three years because we used to know history before the last three years. We didn’t hear that claim five years ago, ten years ago, 15 years ago, a century ago, a century and a half ago, because we knew history.

We used to know that Francis Scott Key went into court to defend hundreds of blacks in court, to defend their rights. That he worked with an anti-slavery society. We used to know what the third verse of the national anthem meant when it said slavery – that it was political slavery. It was Great Britain impressing Americans on the British ships to fight against Americans. It wasn’t racial at all, but we don’t know that anymore.

So now we tear down Francis Scott Key”€™s statue and deface it in Baltimore Maryland because he’s a racist. See, that’s where history is.

70 Percent Did Not Know the Constitution Was the Supreme Law of the Land


So, to go with that, again, here’s where we are in government. 70 percent of students did not know the Constitution was the supreme law of the land. 74 percent could not identify the three branches of government. 60 percent could not name even one of the 19 cabinet level departments. And only one in a thousand could name the freedoms in the First Amendment.

They know nothing. So, how are you a good citizen if you don’t know that? Every kid who comes through high school and college ought to be able to answer that. Otherwise, there’s no future for the republic if you can’t handle something that simple. So when you look at it, only seventeen point eight percent of American colleges require students to take a course in U.S. history or government.

Only one out of five, four out of five, will ever– and the one out of five is probably the percent that actually votes in elections. We looked at voting statistics earlier, and I’m saying that facetiously, it’s not. Only nine states require a social studies history test for graduation. Remember, teachers will teach to the test. And if you don’t have a test on it, they’re not going to teach to it. And if you don’t require any knowledge of history in social studies they’re not going to teach it.

It’s just real simple stuff. Everything is high stakes testing now. Your money is based on how you perform on tests. And so if you don’t do well on tests– so, they teach to the test. So, if we don’t get history back in the high school level as a required course, and by the way, only two states require civics government for graduation.

That ought to be required in every state. You ought to come out of school at least knowing what the government is. It’s a Republican form of government, you ought to know something about the seven articles in the Constitution, you ought to know the 27 grievances in the Declaration, you ought to know the 10 rights in the Bill of Rights. We don’t know that.

So, you’ve got all this problem.

Millennials: Only Age Group in America That Holds Socialism Favorably


Economics is the same thing. We’ve already talked about Bernie Sanders, what happens with him, open socialist. And the problem being an open socialist, look at the Washington Post, “€œMillennials are the only age group in America in which a majority holds socialism favorably. A Harvard University survey found that 51 percent do not support capitalism. Millennials have a higher opinion of socialism than of capitalism.”€

I showed you why earlier. So, that’s where millennials are, the ones who have gone through college recently. Moreover, Gallup has found that an astounding 69 percent of Millennials said they’d be willing to vote for a socialist candidate for president. Among their parents’ generation, only a third would do so. 52 percent of millennials favor big government compared with 38 percent of the nation overall.

University has an impact on the way that students think. And if you come out with those kinds of students, you will not maintain a constitutional republic. Because socialism is incompatible with a constitutional republic. The two can’t coexist. So, when you look at economics, only 3.2 percent of American colleges require students to take a course in economics.

You need to know the free market if this country is going to exist. Only 3.2 percent of universities actually have students take that course. Used to be when all of us went to college, we all had that course. Not anymore. University of Connecticut has a study called “€œThe Coming Crisis In Leadership”€ here’s what they pointed out, “€œAt many of the most prestigious colleges in the United States seniors no less than freshmen about America’s history, government, foreign affairs, and the economy. A phenomenon known as negative learning.”€

You actually lose knowledge when you’re in college now. You come in as a freshman knowing more than when you go out as a senior. That’s not the right direction. So, that’s the problem – what’s the solution? Solution”€™s real simple – we need to require core essentials.

We Need to go Back to What We Did for Decades and Centuries


We need to go back to what we did for decades and centuries. We need to say, “€œYou’re going to teach American history, you’re gonna teach American government, you”€™re going to teach economics, or you’re not going to get funded.”€ Real simple stuff. If you can’t generate students who know something about their form of government and be good citizens, that’s what– College presidents, you say that’s why you exist is to have kids prepared for jobs, and to have them become good members of society, productive members of– citizens.

So, we’re not doing that. Two more real quick – the third problem that comes up, that we’ve talked about, deals with what I’m going to call judicial independence. If you know what judicial independence is, this is what judges claim any time you try to put accountability on them. They say, “€œAre you kidding me?!”€ And that’s why they love the Missouri system, they love the Tennessee system where they get a point and they don’t have to ever face the people in contested elections.

They get retention – retention’s like a lifetime appointment. If there’s not somebody out there saying, “€œYou know how stupid his decision was?”€ If there’s not somebody to point out the fallacy of the guy’s positions, the voters don’t know. And so when you go to the Missouri system, or the Missouri Plan, or the Tennessee plan, you lose accountability, judges love that. They love not being accountable for their decisions.

Now the founding fathers didn’t love that. Thomas Jefferson said very simply, he said, “€œIt should be remembered as an axiom of eternal truth in politics that whatever power in any government is independent is absolute also.”€ If you’re not accountable, you will be in absolute power. Which is why, what’s the recourse for turning over a stupid Supreme Court decision that says marriage is not between a man and woman – it”€™s between any combination you want? What’s the recourse?

Independent Judges = Lost Liberty


They’re there for life, we can”€™t do– See, we used to not believe that. We used to know judges definitely can’t be unaccountable because they’re the one branch we don’t elect. He continued, I”€™ll back up, he said, “€œIndependence can be trusted nowhere but with the people in mass.”€ Then you have John Dickinson, signer of the Constitution, he said very pointedly, “€œWhat innumerable acts of injustice may be committed and how fatally may the principles of liberty be sapped by a succession of judges utterly independent of the people.”€ If you make judges independent where they don’t stand for elections, you’ll lose your liberty.

Now that was 200 years ago. Pretty accurate for what’s gone on. But that’s protecting judicial independence. What they want is they don’t want to be held accountable. They want accountability gone, we can do what we want to do.

Now, the equivalent of that on the university level is protected academic freedom. Don’t tell us what we can and can’t teach. Don’t tell us what our positions will and won”€™t be. Don’t tell us we have to teach the Constitution when we think it’s a stinking document. Academic freedom-  it”€™s the same as judicial independence.

What they’re saying is don’t make us accountable for what we say or what we do. Now part of the way that professors become unaccountable is through tenure. And it’s interesting that if you ask college presidents, “€œWhat do you think about tenured profession?”€ If you give college presidents four choices of hiring their faculty, it’s interesting that those that want full-time annual contracts for professors is the biggest group among professors, I mean, among presidents. Most presidents support having annual contracts for professors, not tenure, for professors.

They Don”€™t Want Tenured Faculty


That’s interesting from within the system. Now, you look on the other side, the number of university presidents who want tenured professors is only one out of four. Only one out of four university presidents wants a tenured faculty. Tenured faculty is an unaccountable faculty – it’s like lifetime appointments. Once they get tenure they can say and do anything they want and you can’t get rid of them.

And they’ll keep drawing taxpayer dollars for doing stupid stuff. Where”€™s the public on tenure? Well, if you look at the public on tenure, the public, those that support tenure, it’s those who support ending tenure is 66 percent. Those that oppose ending tenure was only 28 percent. So the public”€™s real clear – we don’t like tenure.

Professors, the presidents don’t like tenure. Let’s give them a hand, let’s get rid of some tenure. That’s one way of solving that. That’s getting accountability back in. So, that’s the problem. The solution is real simple.

What you want for a solution is reduce or weaken tenure, increase faculty accountability. Matter of fact, just increase accountability in general. If they won”€™t increase accountability, don’t fund them. If they’re going to be unaccountable, we don’t need unaccountable *. That’s why sunset was the idea that I started with.

How to Define Indoctrination


The fourth and final problem that we”€™ll point out, and the solution, is real simple – universities have become places of indoctrination. Now let me define indoctrination so nobody gets bent out of shape. Indoctrination is the process of teaching a person or group to accept a set of beliefs uncritically. It is the effort to make the student”€™s opinions reflect the professor’s opinions, for the student to believe and advocate for the personal positions held by the professor. Instead of teaching them to think, you teach them what to think – that’s indoctrination.

Continues, indoctrination occurs when the pursuit of truth is not the objective. Those who indoctrinate others often, number one, don’t like what the truth is or they don’t care what the truth is.

Here’s the great example –  socialism. Professors teach us it”€™s a great way. Okay, you like socialism, show me one example in 5,500 years of human history where socialism has created more freedom and more prosperity for any nation.

“€œWell, there’s no example, but they’ve never done it right. We can do it, right.”€ No, the truth is it has never worked in the history of mankind for 5,500 years. “€œBut I don’t care what the truth is, I think it’s a fairer system.”€ That’s indoctrination.

When you don’t care what the truth is and you don’t care what facts are, and that’s what we’re getting out of universities right now is indoctrination. The thing that every one of these football players has in common is they’ve all recently come from a university. And so having recently come from a University where professors don’t like America, and they write books about how America is not special, why are we surprised at what we see going on in the NFL sidelines? So that’s indoctrination.

The More Education You Have the More Liberal You Become


Now notice this chart. Adults with postgraduate experience most likely to have consistently liberal views. Notice at the bottom they say if you only have a high school education or less, if you have some college, if you have a college degree, or if you have postgraduate, this is how liberal you are. Notice the trend – the more education you have the more liberal you become. And these are all consistently liberal.

So consistently liberal, these are hardcore liberals. And if you say, well, those that are left of center — look at what it looks like for left of center. The more education you get, the more left of center you move. That’s not the way education was designed to work in America. So, this is why I say it’s indoctrination rather than education.

We’re coming out with a specific political viewpoint that moves you way over here to this side where most adults are not at this point. So, that’s the problem. The solution is real simple – you want to alter the hiring practices. You’ve got to break up that thing of professors hiring their own kind, and doing their own thing, and punishing those, and firing those who disagree with them. So, you allow regents to hire or some other thing to break up the system, whatever it is, you’ve got do something to break up that hiring system.

Require Institutional Neutrality


And you require institutional neutrality. If you are not neutral, we’re not going to fund you. We’re not going to fund a propagation machine that only gives one perspective. And so those are all things to consider, all things to look at. That’s why we need to look at attaching some strings to state funding because the condition of higher education right now is not where it should be.

We can get it back. I have great confidence we can get it back. Little things like that, man, they”€™ll respond. You start pulling money away from folks and they’ll start responding. You”€™ll get a lot of fight, but you will get an eventual change.

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Biographical Sketches

Hi friends! This is Tim Barton of WallBuilders.This is a time when most Americans don’t know much about American history or even heroes of the faith. I know, oftentimes as parents, we”€™re trying to find good content for our kids to read.

If you remember back in the Bible, the Book of Hebrews it has the Faith Hall of Fame, where they outlined the leaders of faith that had gone before them. Well, this is something that as Americans we really want to go back and outline some of these heroes not just of American history, but heroes of Christianity and our faith as well.

I wanted to let you know about some biographical sketches we have available on our website. One is called, “€œThe Courageous Leaders Collection“€ and this collection includes people like Abigail Adams, Abraham Lincoln, Francis Scott Key, George Washington Carver, Susanna Wesley, even the Wright brothers.

There’s a second collection called, “€œHeroes of History“€ in this collection you read about people like Benjamin Franklin, Christopher Columbus, Daniel Boone, George Washington, Harriet Tubman, the list goes on and on.

This is a great collection for your young person to have and read. And it’s a providential view of American and Christian history. This is available at


Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. And that was the conclusion, going into the break, of that great presentation David shared with our legislators. Five-part series, so folks, if you’re just tuning in today, if you were checked out last week for the Christmas week, go to the website – today and you can get the full five-part series – not just the conclusion that we share today. Of course, David, Tim, might be fun to listen to the solutions first and then go back and listen to the problems for those that might have just tuned in just today.

Knowing the Issues Helps Us Follow Through With the Solution


Well, it certainly can be hopeful and optimistic to know that there are solutions to issues. But one of the things that is significant, when you go to the doctor’s office, he doesn”€™t just come out and give you a pill packet and say, “€œHere take these.”€ And you’re like, “€œWell, what am I — Okay, no, I’m not taking these, that’s dumb.”€ But if he came out and said, “€œHey, you have cancer and it’s going to kill you unless you take one of these every single morning.”€ Well, then I would be faithful to take those pills every single morning.




So, sometimes knowing the issue will really help me want to follow through on the solution. And so as wonderful as it is to know there are solutions, we’re not in a hopeless situation, it is important that we know exactly what it is we’re dealing with looking at universities. And so you’re right, if listeners didn’t hear what we said the last four days of last week, really — and then of course Christmas season it’s hard to take that time and dedicate and do things — it’s worth going back, getting the podcast, go to the website get the download.

You need to hear what is happening at universities because our kids, our grandkids, are worth the effort and the fight. But if you don’t even know what the battle is about, it’s hard to know what the solution is to solve these problems.


David, I’m guessing this is a long-term solution, right? This is not something we’re going to change overnight. We need to have vision for literally a 10, 15, 20, year turnaround in something like this.

Working for the Solution is Worth It


Well, it is a long-term solution. But guess what, it’s a solution. And just because it’s long-term we don’t say, “€œOh my gosh, I don’t want to get involved in this. It”€™s going to take two, three, five, seven years.”€ It’s like Tim said with the medical diagnosis – if the long-term solution is I’ve got to lose X number of pounds. It may take me a year to do that, but I’m going to do it because of my health.

Whatever that is, we get focused on the solution and say, “€œYou know what, the product is worth it. The fact that we can literally save the minds of millions of young Americans and therefore save the next generation, and therefore save our morality, our faith, our culture, our Constitution, etc.”€ That’s worth it.


That”€™s right.


And so these are things that, legislation moves slowly, that’s fine, but it has to start somewhere. And one place it can start is with us as citizens saying, “€œHey guys, we want you to get rid of the speech codes, and the free speech zones, and the biased reporting teams off our universities. Get that gone – they’re unconstitutional.”€ Simple things like that, but that makes a huge difference.

Tune In To Learn The Solution To The Problems In The Education System


Well, folks, it’s all available on our website today so make sure that you get all five programs. Listen to them, share them with your friends and family. This is a huge issue. The universities have a tremendous impact and influence on the culture and certainly the next generation. It’s been a negative influence for the last couple of decades or more.

And we’ve got to turn this thing around and you can be a part of that solution. So, be sure check out that five-part series. We sure appreciate you listening. You’ve been listening to WallBuildersLive.