International Issues Are Just As Important As Ever – With Randy Forbes – International issues and foreign policy matter, and America does have enemies. Former Congressman Randy Forbes joins us today to discuss this very important issue. Tune in now!

Air Date: 03/22/2021

Guest: Randy Forbes

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton

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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

 

Rick:

Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. It’s WallBuilders Live, where we talk about today’s hottest topics on policy and faith and the culture. A lot of great programs coming up this week, you’re going to enjoy all of them.

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WallBuilders comes out of that scripture in Nehemiah, arise and rebuild the walls that we may no longer be a reproach. We all know that America is in many ways a reproach right now. We can turn it around, God has given us the tools that we need, but we got to engage in the process. So thank you for being a listener, and a part of the solution.

My name is Rick Green. I’m a former Texas legislator and America’s Constitution coach. It is my honor to work with David Barton. He’s America’s premier historian and our founder here at WallBuilders, also with Tim Barton, national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. And we just want to all three, thank you for tuning in today. Really excited about the programs we’ve got for you this week.

Alright, David, Tim, later in the program, our friend, Randy Forbes, former congressman from Virginia will be with us. You know, normally, we’re talking domestic issues on WallBuilders Live, they just seems to dominate most of our conversations. But international issues, very important, especially our relationship with Israel, something we do spend a lot of time on the program here. But also, now China has become a major issue for us here in the US. And the policy of the president is what really dictates the relationship with another nation. And probably not much difference between Trump and Biden on China, right, guys? I mean, very little.

David:

Yeah, just like there’s no difference between Trump and Biden on Israel. You know, what a reversal we’ve got with Israel policy, and the same kind of thing with China. But the problem with China is I think if you asked most people on the streets, who are the American enemies? They say, well, we really don’t have any, you know, everybody kind of leaves America alone…

Tim:

Trump supporters.

David:

Yeah, the insurrection guys, is it. So, most people would not identify enemies. And you said, what about Russia? Well, yeah, maybe 30 years ago, the Soviet Union, but not now. And so people don’t see China as a real threat.

Tim:

No. And they do see, I mean, you know, Biden administration just announced they’re going to have some sanctions on Russia. And so there might be some people who are maybe a little more politically attuned, who might recognize some of this, but they don’t see where the Trump administration saw Iran. There are some challenges with Iran, that you don’t see the same level of concern from maybe some of the political individuals in the Biden ministration.

But you know, even as we talk about China, certainly China’s not a nation that culturally Americans think is a problem. And one of the great examples is because the NBA supports China, they support a lot of the behavior happening with China. And I’m talking to the last year or two. When the NBA was very anti-Trump, they were very in favor of BLM. And you can go down the list of where they’ve been politically involved. But then when China comes in, and they take over Hong Kong, right, they start arresting people or you find out about these Uighur Muslims who are 3 million of them living in concentration camps. And the NBA is like no, it’s no big deal. Well, China’s not a problem. We’re good friends with China. Disney, right, Disney Plus is now one of the streaming apps and a lot of people have Disney Plus and actually, a lot of people are leaving Disney Plus because of the Jena Khurana incident from the Mandalorian among other things. But…

Rick:

And Joe Biden even said the other day he wouldn’t even bring it up with the Prime Minister. I mean not even going to say anything about it.

Tim:

Right. And this is where when Disney Plus just a year ago came out with the movie Mulan which some listeners might remember there was an old cartoon Mulan and it was a Disney movie. And so they made this live action film and they filmed much of it in China. And they filmed it in the nation of China, where these literal concentration camps are still in place. And Disney Plus at the end said we’re so grateful to China for them partnering with us in this work.

Well, Disney is also the same company that when Georgia came out being pro-life, Hollywood, Disney said we’re not sure that we can still work in Georgia because they’re pro-life. You are seeing not only the hypocrisy from some of these groups like the NBA or like Disney, but what you’re seeing is they are painting China in a very positive light. So most Americans would think well, if you’re concerned with China, it’s because you’re weird, you’re an extremist, your problem. At least that is the perception that is being painted.

So dad, to your point, when you ask people who do you think are some of maybe the big challenge nations or enemy nations that we’re dealing with, China’s not going to be a nation that you’re going to hear very often from most commonplace normal Americans. Now, again, if you’re politically attuned and you’re paying attention, you’re listening, you might think no, China, certainly, we know some of the bad things they’re doing. But generally speaking, most Americans don’t know the really bad positions China has taken. And I just named a couple of the obvious ones with Hong Kong, and then with the literal concentration camps, those are two very obvious ones.

But there’s way more even that are challenges with China that people don’t know. And China certainly is one of those nations, that they are definitely anti-American, anti-Christian, anti-religion, etc. They’re a major problem for America.

David:

Yeah, one of the things with China that people don’t recognize is China has evil intentions toward America. They want America destroyed and subdued. China wants to be the number one power in the world with nobody even a distant second behind them. And so they work aggressively with spy, with undermining military connections, with undermining business connections, trying to destroy the economy of a nation. What China does to us on a regular, almost daily basis, with cyber-attacks and cyber-attacks against the military as well, not only business institutions, but the military, China has dead serious intentions to wipe out America. And this is stuff that’s not being talked about.

Tim:

And let’s point out also, this is not some random computer hacker in China who is committing these cyber-attacks. These are literal people who work for the government of China who are paid and employed to cause interference in America. This is their actual job by the Chinese government. China has made it very clear that they don’t like America, they have problems in America. And certainly, when America is one of the greatest producers and has so much wealth and so much power, and China wants to have that position that you have to, right in this essence, you have to dethrone the king before you can take the throne. This is what you are seeing China targeting America, trying to dethrone America from some of those positions.

David:

And what you saw in the Trump administration, the last I knew toward the end of Trump administration, they had identified and deported nearly 1,000 Chinese spies working in America. So that we’re doing all sorts of…

Tim:

There’s not Chinese spies in America. Eric Swalwell told us there weren’t.

David:

That’s right. And there wasn’t the Chinese spy sleeping with him in his bed either?

Tim:

No. He wouldn’t do that kind of stuff.

David:

No.

Tim:

And it’s good that actually after he was discovered having an affair with a Chinese spy that he’s still on the Intelligence Committee, so that’s the good news, is that he still has a very powerful position in Congress on his…

David:

How are you defining good news? I thought I missed that.

Tim:

No, okay, that’s a mistake. That’s actually utterly ridiculous. And there were calls when it was found out that this Democrat congressman was having an affair and I’m saying affair, I don’t think he was married and she wasn’t married, but he was living with a Chinese spy. They were hooking up, shacking up, right, they’re living together. And it’s evident, she’s a Chinese spy. He’s on the Intelligence Committee. She was using his cell phone, I mean, things that were compromising our literal national intelligence, the nation’s security were compromised, and he’s not penalized. He doesn’t lose his committee. He doesn’t lose his privilege, because Nancy Pelosi and the Democrats have determine no, he needs to stay there.

But this is where China was actively involved in targeting people on the Intelligence Committee to get information from America to use for their benefit against America. This is actively happening right now.

David:

So there were about 1,000 spies that Trump deported. And a lot of them came on what’s called the Confucius Institute, and there’s about 90 of those across the nation. They tend to set up at research universities and outside of research universities, and they have the propaganda. They get with the professors and how great China is and they get their kids to work in the computer labs and in the scientific research, etc. And I say kids, they’re not kids, they’re adults, 20, 30, 40, 50 year old working in these things. And they were funneling all this scientific research, information, all this technological information funneling it back to China.

And so particularly, through what were called the Confucius Institutes, there were about 1,000 of these folks that were deported totally across the nation, including a number of, I guess, you can say, little older students, college students that were in school, not necessarily to get a degree but to get information and ship back to China.

So I say this to say there is actually a serious threat against America. It’s not like they want to live and let live, they want to crush and destroy, do everything they can to tear up our economy, our military, our technology, the cyberattacks, everything else. They want to be number one in the world and America, they want them in such a far number two position, we will never again threaten them.

Now, one guy who probably knows more about this than anybody in the country is Congressman Randy Forbes. When he was in Congress, he’s on the Armed Services Committee. He was in charge of so much of what happened with the naval powers and naval stuff in America. After he left Congress, he’s actually part of the Naval War College up in the New England area and they use him as the expert on China. This is how China thinks. This is what they’re going to try to do. If we’re going to defend ourselves from China and the Chinese, this is how we have to be prepared.

And so Randy is probably the top national expert on this when it comes to what’s happening with China. And seeing what Biden and the Biden ministration is doing with cozying up to China and treating China the way republicans treated Israel, seeing that close connection is really kind of scary. So we thought we’d ask Randy and get a better perspective of what’s happening and what we need to be doing.

Rick:

Quick break, we’ll be right back with Randy Forbes here on WallBuilders Live.

BREAK

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—

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. Founding Fathers, John Adams and Thomas Jefferson originally worked closely together but later became ardent opponents. This troubled Dr. Benjamin Rush, a signer of the Declaration, who knew both of them very well.

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Rick:

Welcome back WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. Former congressman Randy Forbes back, always good to have you. Randy, good to have you today, sir. Thank you.

Randy:

Well, thank you, Rick. It’s always great to be with you. Thanks for the wonderful job you guys do.

Rick:

Well, we cover a lot of topics with you. One of the topics we haven’t talked about in quite a while is just the whole China situation. And certainly, the Biden administration’s approach towards China, very, very different from President Trump seems to be a victory for China in terms of a much softer policy, and so many different areas. What do you see happening over the next few years in terms of our approach towards China?

Randy:

Rick, we’re very concerned. As you remember, I started founded and chaired the China Caucus in Congress, it was the first caucus that was really designed to kind of do oversight on China. And we have watched them for a decade and a half now, is what they have been doing. And it’s very concerning that the way they are spreading out throughout the world, both economically and militarily.

And one of the things that we were very concerned about is what we saw into the Obama administration, Rick. Because as you probably remember, under the Obama administration, they literally sent out a written memo that prohibited the military and other people in the administration from even calling China a competitor, much less doing anything about it. You couldn’t even talk about it. They would charge people in the military who would even ask if we should view them as a competitor.

The big thing that we see right now with the Biden administration is that they have already started reversing some of President Trump’s policies. One of the policies that he had was to protect the electric and power grids that we have in vital facilities around the country to make sure that they were not being supplied with parts and things from China that they might have control of, be able to access later on. The Biden administration has now rolled that back.

And of course, everybody’s familiar with what they’ve done to this Keystone pipeline, which we have a lot of oil coming from Canada into the United States, first of all, is going to tremendously impact our economy in terms of the people they lost, they off the price of oil and those kinds of things. But in addition to that, this oil would now be freed up to be sold to China, which is exactly what China wants.

Rick, one of the things that we’re really frightened about is what we’re going to see in national defense. Under the Obama administration, we just saw national fence gutted across the board. And when you look at what President Biden’s administration is looking to do with national defense, and where they’re spending their money in other places and taking it away from national defense, that’s going to really be good news if you are sitting on a China board right now or someplace in China when you look at what that’s going to vote for them down the road.

Rick:

You said something that I did not remember, and that is just the same type of censorship that we’re seeing in a big way right now. We saw hints of that, it sounds like with the Obama administration, even with regards to China, certainly within the military, they were already playing that game of literally not letting people even debate an issue or speak about an issue in order to get only one side. So we saw a hint of that.

Randy:

You’re right, Rick, we actually had articles that were published international that I’ve wrote that just, you know, pointed out the fact that it’s one thing if you ultimately decide you’re not going to do something. But to not even be able to have the discussion, to not even have our military people be able to raise the fact should we be concerned about these things, that’s just horrifying.

And of course, we’ve been watching now, as the Chinese have been increasing the military on geometrical basis to where they’re going to outnumber our subs across the globe in just a few years, and there’s going to be a huge deficit between the number of subs they have and the number of subs we have. On so many different fronts now, they are just increasing dramatically their military capabilities.

And President Trump began to try to turn that around. It was heading in good directions, but now we’re very, very concerned, and so were most military planners that we’re going to see that reversed.

Rick:

Randy, we’re in a situation like this, I guess, similar to the Obama administration, where you do have a presidential administration that is just making a bad foreign policy decisions. How do we battle that? Does it have to come from the outside with think tanks and papers and talk radio like we’re doing now to just educate people? Is there enough of a caucus in Congress to push back on that? Doesn’t mean 2022 election is even that much more important in order to get one of the two chambers back so that you can fight back against these things?

Randy:

But Rick, I think all of the above. People don’t realize sometimes that when you lose control of the House and the Senate, you also lose control of the hearings. So you will not even have hearings brought up to point out some of these things that are going to be happening to national defense and some of the things that are going to be happening globally that are going to put the United States at risk.

So taking one or both of those chambers back is crucial, not just for the votes that are cast, and ultimate bills and funding of national defense, but just in the discussions and being able to have the debates and to uncover some of these things. But barring that, Rick, I think you make great point. We’re going to have to do these kinds of radio programs and talks around the country so that people can understand exactly what’s going on.

My big fear is we live in a world where so many people and even so much of the media is running off on things that I really don’t think is that important when they’re talking about, but they get people’s focus off of the really big issues. And one of the most enormous issues you and I will face in our lifetime is whether we have a flip in power between China and the United States.

You know, in the South Pacific area, Rick, a lot of people think, well, that’s a way away from our country. What impact does it have? Well, here’s the impact. Probably two-thirds of the trade in the world is going to go through that area. In addition, the largest armies in the world are going to camp there, the largest navies in the world are going to be there. If you have a World War III, it’s likely to start in that region. Every bad thing and every good thing, it’s like a highway that comes directly from there into the West Coast of the United States.

If we surrender that, and we surrender that rule of the sea to China, it’s a whole new world order, because they do not believe in law the way that we do. In fact, they’ve stated it before: their philosophy is we’re big, we’re strong, get used to it, you know. And that’s a terrible way for countries to have a world order that is what you and I are used to having.

So it’s going to impact us, not just militarily, but economically in huge way as well.

Rick:

Well, you read my mind on what my final question was going to be, is how to get people to realize this impacts them? Because sometimes we only think about domestic policy and not foreign policy and this one is huge in so many different ways. Randy, thanks for keep an eye on this. Thanks for being willing to come and share with us on it. How can we keep up with you, man, I guess through the Congressional Prayer Caucus best place for folks to follow you?

Randy:

That’s the best place to go. They can go to our website there. And actually, we were launching a new report that we’re going to be reporting on these things on a weekly basis where people can really tag in and be able to see what’s really going on, both on a national defense basis and also a lot of other things that’s going on in Congress so they can check with us there as well.

Rick:

Excellent. Randy, God bless you, brother. Thanks for your time today.

Randy:

Thanks, Rick. Have a good day.

Rick:

You too. Stay with us, folks. We’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

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Rick:

We’re back here on WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. And thanks to Randy Forbes for joining us today. You know, guys, as I was listening to Randy, and even to what you guys were saying at the beginning of the program, I mean, this feels a little bit like when Ronald Reagan finally just came out and said, the Soviet Union is an evil empire. And of course, the State Department and everybody went nuts. No, you can’t say that and you can’t call evil what it actually is. I mean, are we having that moment? Is Trump basically, he did that during his four years and now are we going to have to be the ones speaking up since our president is cozying up to these guys? We’ve got to sound the alarm just like we’re doing in this program. Look, this is not a nice nation trying to just have free trade with us.

David:

Look, when you look at China, and recognize there are at least a million known slaves in China, we know there’s more than that, because they don’t keep stats and don’t release them. But we know of at least a million. And when we know that they have concentration camps, and they’re doing executions. And we see all the torture and persecution, the underground church, what’s happened to it, we see that. These are not nice guys. And they do want to take down our way of life.

And it’s interesting, even watching a Biden interview and talking about China, he talks about how he’s been with the Premier of China more than any other person in America, probably any American leader. And he says that the Premier of China does not have a Democrat small d bone in his body. There is nothing in him that thinks about the people, that thinks about the good of the nation, only thinks about himself in power.

And so when Randy says, look, the Chinese are soon going to have more nuclear submarines than America does, we’re reticent to use nuclear stuff. I mean, just like with Japan, we dropped leaflets in Japan in World War II saying, hey, we’re about to drop an atomic bomb, we don’t want to do this. China’s not going to do that. They’re going to use it and they’re willing to use it, because for them force and power is everything. They don’t have the same morality. That’s why they have slaves. And that’s why they do the murders and brutal executions, etc.

And so to even hear things like that, that should be scary for every American. But we’re so used to being Americans, we just assume good about everybody. And that’s just not the right position.

Tim:

Well, and we have such a dishonest media that cares more about promoting an agenda than about actually releasing news. This would be news that every American should know or want to know, because it should shape the way that we care about policy and the way that we care about national security. Again, national security is a big deal that China is against the American national security, deliberately attacking it on a frequent basis, sending in literal spies, having computer hackers and cyber warfare and all the things going on.

China is not a friendly ally, regardless of what Hunter Biden’s relationship was with China, or who they knew in China, right, regardless of the Biden administration. And I understand when there is corrupting dirty politics, and there’s family and there’s friends involved, like I understand that there’s a level of coverage happening.

But we’re talking now about something way more significant, the longevity and future of the American nation. And this is where it’s also sad to recognize that the media is so dishonest, that they’re offering coverage for China, that you’re the NBA offering coverage for China, that Disney Plus is offering coverage for China. I do know that a lot of Americans and this is probably where there’s some positive in the midst of all of the challenges that we’re seeing with China, there is positive that a lot of Americans are waking up and recognizing that they’ve been lied to on a lot of levels and a lot of fronts.

And this is where also we would say now’s the time we got to start looking at that midterm election, because we need some different leaders in Congress, in the Senate, who are actually going to have the courage and backbone to stand up and say, no, we’re not going to let China rollover America. We’re not going to let this thing happen. We’re not going to let America get weaker, while China gets stronger, recognizing the existential threat that could be to America. So right now, it’s time to roll up our sleeves and start looking forward to the next election knowing that this is an issue that we need to pay attention to in this next election.

Rick:

Well, that’s it for today, folks, we are at a time. We want to send you to our websites wallbuilders.com and wallbuilderslive.com, where you can get more resources, more tools. Also, one more website just to confuse you with a lot of websites, biblicalcitizens.com, biblicalcitizens.com that is the place to get the free course that you can host in your home, in your living room right there, bring people in and have good fellowship or host it at your church. But what a great way to study the foundations that will make a nation free.

We have a lot of great folks in the new series. It’s got Kirk Cameron and Rabbi Daniel Lapin and Mat Staver and Ken Ivory and all kinds of folks. So be sure to check out biblicalcitizens.com and get your class started, get people signed up. You can join us on Monday nights for our live national class, but we encourage you to host your own class and create that opportunity for fellowship. The people are so hungry for it right now. Biblicalcitizens.com, that’s the website to find out more.

Be sure to tune in the rest of the week. Here at WallBuilders Live, we’ve got a lot of great guests coming up this week, a lot of good information for you, and of course, as always on Friday, we’ll have our Good News Friday.

Thanks so much for listening today. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live.