Planned Parenthood under congressional investigation for selling baby body parts. In this episode find out the results of the investigation. Tune in now to hear the victories and the process of what is going on now with the Planned Parenthood Investigation.

Air Date: 03/27/2017

Guests: Vicky Hartzler, David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton

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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast.  However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers.  Additionally, names may be misspelled because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.



Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture.  This is WallBuilders Live! Where we”€™re talking about these hottest topics on policy and faith. Always looking at it from Biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

We’re here with David Barton, America’s premiere historian, and our founder. Also, Tim Barton, national speaker, pastor, and president of WallBuilders. And my name’s Rick Green.  I’m a former Texas state legislator.

Find out more about us and the organization at and Two great websites, both of them relatively new and a lot of great information that you can find there on the websites.

Ashamed That This Is Happening In America


Every show we’re trying to apply those things and look at some particular area of the culture. David, Tim, one of the areas of the culture we’ve been embarrassed to look at, frankly, ashamed, is this idea of people actually selling baby parts in America.  Planned Parenthood was busted on that about a year and a half ago and Congress has been investigating them.


Yeah, it is a shameful thing. The whole scenario has been really shameful, Rick. The videos came out.  There was shock and there was outrage, and then the Democrats lined up with denial. And then the Democrats lined up and said, “€œHey, that’s illegal to tape stuff without letting people know.”€ Undercover video to expose crimes?  It’s illegal to expose a crime? Ok, got it. That’s the way the Dems think on this thing.

Then it was referred to various places where these Planned Parenthood clinics were who had broken federal law, the D.A.’s in those areas were looking at it. In one of the Planned Parenthood clinics, they had video on was in Texas, south Texas.  And so we referred it to the local D.A. the Harris County D.A. in Houston. And what does she do?

She indites the guy who made the video. She didn’t go after Planned Parenthood.  She went after the guy who made the video. You go, “€œWhat? What’s happening?”€ And I mean, it just kept going from farcical, to unbelievable, to stupid, to just kind of speechless on it. But what happened amidst all that, was Congress took some action on it.

This Issue Lost Hillary Clinton A Lot of Votes


And by the way David, I’m sorry, before you go to the congressional deal also, I think it was a factor in the presidential election. Because Hillary Clinton chose to defend Planned Parenthood and what they were doing.

You remember in that second or third debate Trump hit on on this whole thing, and for me, it was one of the first times I actually said, “€œOk, this is a guy I can not just go vote for, but actually support because of his visceral reaction on the whole partial birth abortion thing and baby parts being sold.”€

But it was a stark contrast. This is one of those things we talked about recently, where the left has pushed so far they don’t realize how many people in America they’ve turned off.  I think for Hillary to defend this idea of selling baby parts, it lost her a lot of votes.


Rick, I think you’re right. As I was watching with a couple of people, that was a huge thing for me to see Trump defend life, defend the unborn. Hillary was going so far the other direction.

As we’ve talked about many times in the show, at that point, Trump was not someone that we are excited about at all. We were still going, “€œOh dear God.”€ Literally, “€œDear God in Heaven, what is going on?”€


“€œMercy please!”€


“€œWhat’s going to happen here? Jesus come quickly.”€ That kind of thing. But when Trump was put in that position and took the opposite side from Hillary, it gave such a clear contrast that I think that really won him a lot of Christian at that point.

Apart from the fact that we already knew a lot about Hillary, and what we knew was not good. It was the first time you saw some of these positive moral things from Trump which almost sounds ironic saying, “€œpositive moral things from Trump”€ based on what we had known about him to that point.

But it was such a clear contrast where the Democrats have gone so far that direction. Hillary really helped bring that to the forefront of the presidential election during that debate.

The Similar Mindset To Hitler


One of the other things that I have thought a lot about with this thing is after those videos came out and you saw the jocular manner in which they laughed and kidded about the baby parts and what they’re doing with them. There was just this cavalier, callous attitude.

I”€™ve thought back to something, and I’m going to use it, and this will send the left through the roof, but that’s alright, they lived through the roof anyway.

If you remember we just recently had World War II veteran on, Hilton Lytle. And he was talking about how he was one of the guys who helped liberate that concentration camp where there had been fifty-five thousand folks killed at that camp.

As they went through and all the bodies were there, they were getting ready to bulldoze them into the pits and etc.  He said, “€œAll the mouths were open because they had gone through and pulled out all the gold fillings anywhere they could find it.”€

And if you look at the Holocaust museum anywhere in DC or if you go to Yad Vashem over in Israel, whatever, you see all the hair that they cut off and they use that hair to make clothing and rugs, and etc. They’re just using these human body parts for their own pleasure, their own use, their own whatever.

And they were doing all these experiments without any anesthesia. They were cutting into people. It’s kind of like the pain-capable Abortion Act.  You shouldn’t be aborting babies without taking the feeling away. You shouldn’t be aborting them at all.

There are so many parallels to the disdain for innocent life that exists between what happened with the medical experiments and the slaughter with Hitler in Germany and what’s happened with this cavalier attitude of Planned Parenthood.

“€œWe don’t mind chopping babies up.  And by the way, if they happen to be born alive we are going to try to kill them anyway so there is no use trying to preserve them.”€  The whole attitude.

Then to see them act the way they did and selling the baby parts and talking about the brains and talking about, “€œYeah, they”€™ve got to keep it alive long enough so that it won’t spoil on the way.”€ It’s just, really? You can talk that cavalier about killing? And so because of that, it just repulsed so many folks.

The House Has Acted

I think you’re right.  It was a factor in the election. The U.S. House acted on that and said, “€œOk, there are laws on the books where any federal laws broken it’s time to start enforcing the law. We’ve had an administration under Obama that picks and chooses which laws it wants to enforce and if it’s not part of their agenda then they won’t enforce it.”€ So the House actually looked at that.


Thankfully, we have a separation of powers where we can do that. So meanwhile he was president, we had Marsha Blackburn, in fact, she came on the program a couple times.


And so that’s what we’re going to see, are the results. They have now come back with results. They’ve now made some decisions about what they found. So we’ve got one of those committee members that will be with us very shortly to talk about what they found and what they’re going to do and maybe what the outcome will be of all these hearings that they’ve had.


Going to take a quick break.  We’ll be right back. Vicky Hartzler will be with us later in the program. She is a congresswoman who”€™s actually been on our program before, even way back when she was a state rep. Wrote a great book called, “€œRunning God’s Way”€ and we talked about that before. So stay with us.  We’ll be right back on WallBuilders Live!

A Moment From American History

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. Too often today history education excludes great, black heroes from the American founding, such as Lemuel Haynes.

Haynes, though abandoned as a baby, pioneered churches across upper New England. He became the first black American to pastor a white congregation, to receive an honorary master’s degree, and to be ordained by a mainstream Christian denomination, The Congregationalist.

He was a soldier during the American Revolution and in his churches on George Washington’s birthday, he regularly preached sermons honoring George Washington. Even late in his life, he expressed his willingness to go back to battle if necessary to protect America, which he called, “€œa sacred ark.”€

American history is filled with numerous examples of black heroes who are largely ignored by mainstream education today. For more information about Pastor Lemuel Haynes and other colonial Patriots go to

The Rule Of Law


We”€™re back. Thanks for staying with us on WallBuilders Live! David, as we were going to the break we were talking about Vicky Hartzler, a congresswoman who will be with us a little later in the program.

She’s on that committee and Marsha Blackburn chaired the committee and came on our program a couple of times. It”€™s been a year and a half, I guess, that they’ve been investigating.

But like you said, they said, “€œOk, we know from the video some of the things they did. We’re going to take that since obviously some of these DA”€™s are not doing their job, and the president certainly didn’t want to do anything about it. And we’re going to find out which laws they broke. And then at least recommend-“€ since the House can’t prosecute but they can recommend and refer to basically criminal recommendations to these DA”€™s, attorney generals, and others.


It”€™s like, alright, if you broke federal law, now you’re looking at a federal prosecution.  And so the House can look to see if they broke federal law, and as it turns out they did. And so the House has made recommendations, 15 different entities have been recommended for federal prosecution for breaking federal laws. And it is going to the federal Justice Department, which is now headed by Jeff Sessions.

Now, had this gone to Eric Holder or Loretta Lynch it would be buried. They would never see the light of day because they are more pro-abortion than they are pro-rule of law. “€œWe don’t care what the laws say if the laws protect life we want.”€

So they would pick and choose the laws. I remember Senator Cruz for the first few years kept the number of laws they refused to enforce. It was in the hundreds and hundreds that they refused to enforce simply because it disagreed with their personal philosophy.

Well, none of the rest of us get to make that decision but somehow the feds did. So this is now going to Jeff Sessions the new attorney general. And I think you will see a very different outcome here.

He will look at it from a legal standpoint and if they decide not to prosecute it will not be for philosophical reasons it will be for legal reasons. If they decide to prosecute it will be for upholding the law not because he’s pro-life and that is such a difference when you get people in there who believe in the rule of laws, not of men.

The previous administration did not believe that John Adams said, “€œWe’re a government of laws, not of men.”€ The previous administration was not a government of laws. This administration so far has been a government of laws not of men.


We’re going to take a quick break and Vicky Hartzler will be with us when we come back, congresswoman from Missouri. Stay with us.  You’re listening to WallBuilders Live!

Moments From America’s History

This is David Barton with another moment from America’s history. Today, numerous court decisions demonstrate that there’s often a conflict between the courts, the law, and religion. Has this conflict always existed?

Not according to James Wilson.  James Wilson was a signer of both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. He was a law professor as well as an original justice on the U.S. Supreme Court. James Wilson saw no conflict between religion and the law. In fact, just the contrary.

He declared, “€œHuman law must rest its authority ultimately upon the authority of that law which is divine. Far from being rivals or enemies religion and law are twin sisters, friends, and mutual assistance.  Indeed, these two sciences run into each other.”

In the views of Founding Father James Wilson religion and good civil law were inseparable. For more information on God’s hand in American history contact WallBuilders at 1 800 8 REBUILD.

They Made 15 Criminal And Regulatory Referrals


Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders live. Our guest today is Congresswoman Vicky Hartzler. Always good to have her.  It’s been too long! Congresswoman, thanks for coming back on the program.


I’m glad to be here, Rick.


Hey, thanks for the work you’re doing in Washington. Saw that the select report was released. Chairman Blackburn who we’ve had on the program while you guys were doing the investigation, thought we’d get you on to give us a little bit of an update of what you all what you found, some of the criminal referrals and whatnot that came out of the committee.


You bet.  It was just such a horrific industry that we investigated. But I’m glad that we were able to shed some light on this industry that has been buying and selling baby body parts. We ended up giving 15 criminal and regulatory referrals to various agencies and Justice Department related to the activities of this industry.

Which included, willful violations of privacy protection of the patients, failure to obtain patient’s permission to harvest the abortion victims, we have referrals dealing with the illegal sale of the tissue, of the industry making money on it which is against federal law, and killing infants born during the abortion procedures.

This was a very sad thing to go through but I am glad that we were able to speak up for the unborn and to reveal this horrible industry. Hopefully, justice will prevail and these referrals will end up in people going to prison or being held accountable.


Yeah, I guess it’s been almost a year and a half since the investigative journalist uncovered this by doing the interviews with some of these Planned Parenthood folks and others that were involved in this.

Planned Parenthood Selling Baby Parts

One of the questions I have is did you guys find that there was anything that you needed to do from an actual criminalization of some of these activities?  Does the law need to change or is it just an enforcement of the law that needs to take place?


I think it”€™s enforcement of the law. A lot of this is going on.  People didn”€™t even know until these videos came out that there was actually an industry that was going into Planned Parenthood and other abortion clinics and was paying for the baby’s body parts and then going and reselling them at an exorbitant amount of cost.

The way they did it is just chilling. How they have sites that are like that for baby parts where people can go online and it has a drop down menu and people could click on the baby body part they want. If they want an eyeball, if they want a fingernail, if they want a brain, a liver, they would click on it and then they would click on the shipping method that they would prefer and the number of days till arrival and then they would hit send. The order would go into the abortion clinic and come out on the computer where the technician who is paid by the tissue procurement company, prints it out and then she would go to the files of the patients who are scheduled to have an abortion that day and match up the gender and the gestational age of the unborn baby, with the order.

Then go out into the lobby and befriend the woman who is getting ready to have an abortion and trick them into signing this release to donate the body parts. But they call it, I can’t remember, but they have some innocuous term that basically it”€™s the baby, without explaining to the woman what all is going to be used for.

They promise on this form says, “€œResearch has been found and cures for things like cancer, Alzheimer’s, Parkinson’s, so would you like to have the products of the pregnancy go towards this?”€ Which of course is a lie.  There has been no cure for Alzheimer’s,  for cancer, or for any of these things.

Yet, that’s how they sell it to these women that don”€™t even know that their privacy has been violated by their medical records being looked at without their permission by some stranger.

So it is just a horrific industry. The technician then would be by the bedside during the abortion and then take the aborted fetuses and babies and piece out the part that matches the order and ship it off to somebody.

People didn’t even know this existed, but now they do. They’ve been exposed for what they are. And I hope that women will choose life now realizing that this is a baby and it has value to God and to society to all of us.

What Planned Parenthood is Being Investigated For


Of course, with Planned Parenthood being the number one abortion provider in America they were involved in this as well. Several states have defunded them over these videos. Did you guys find in your investigation anything specifically on Planned Parenthood?


Well, we believe they were making money off of it because there are no expenses on their part and yet the tissue company is paying them per part. So we believe that is a violation of the federal law which says, “€œYou cannot sell baby body parts in any form.”€  It says, “€œExcept for expenses that are reasonable related to the activity.”€ But the point here is, it doesn’t have any expenses. So they’re making money off of it.

Since this came out, and since our investigation, Planned Parenthood has changed their policy and is no longer participating in this process, which I think is a victory in itself. They’ve kicked out the tissue procurement companies, that would not have happened without it.

The reality is, Planned Parenthood is still killing over 300,000 babies a year. They don’t deserve one dime of our taxpayer dollars in any form. So we’re going to continue to try to pull their funding.


Yeah, I’d seen that apparently, President Trump may be in support of that. Do you think this might get more on the federal level against, I think it’s six states, that have defunded in the last year or so since this came out? What do you think about a federal funding, what are the chances now?


I think it’s very possible.  In the House, we passed a resolution disapproval just last week that would reverse a last-minute rule that President Obama made before he left the White House in December that forced states to have to give their federal family planning money to Planned Parenthood.

There’s like five different states that have passed laws saying that the federal family planning money is not going to go to any facility that provides abortion. Instead, it”€™s going to go to the health centers in places that actually provide quality healthcare for women.


There are other options. There are other places they can go.


Yeah, President Obama tried to force states to say, “€œNo, you can’t do that.”€ We passed a law last week that would reverse that rule. Now the Senate has to take it out. But I feel confident when it gets to the president that he will sign it and that will allow states to move money however they want.

Restoring Our Constitutional Liberties


Well, last thing Vicky.  Having had a chance to talk to you in the last few months, how’s the attitude on Capitol Hill? Seems like I’ve been saying 2017, a pivot year.  Seems like we’re really not just stopping a lot of the bad things that are going on out there we may be reversing and headed the right direction and restoring some of our constitutional liberties. What’s your feeling at this point?


We’re very optimistic and excited about the opportunity and thankful. I feel like, personally, that a lot of people prayed last year and moved. He has given us this window of opportunity, reversed a lot of the bad policies that are hurting people. So I’m very hopeful that we will be able to get this done.


Well, keep up the great work and we look forward to having you get back on the radio program soon.


Sounds great, Rick, thank you.


Stay with us folks.  We’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

DVD On Common Core


Hi, friends! This is David Barton of WallBuilders. The current condition of education in America is abysmal. Not only is educational achievement plummeting, but every year, some 19 percent of high school seniors who graduate is completely illiterate. They can”€™t read at all but it was not always this way.

For generations, we taught students how to think. But after the progressives took over education in the early 20th century, things began to radically change. Education shifted from thinking to learning, which made the emphasis on the teachers rather than the students. And that elevated indoctrination above knowledge.

At that time, progressives also made massive changes in the way we tested students. They extended school from 8 to 12 years. They introduced graded education and they added compulsory education. Statistics prove that these changes have harmed education rather than helped it. And now the progressives are pushing common core.

In our new DVD on common core, we give you eight reasons why this current approach is so dangerous to our kids and our culture. We also show you an amazing history of education. So get this new DVD at

One Step In The Right Direction


Thanks for staying with us.  Welcome back to WallBuilders Live! David and Tim Barton now, thanks to Congresswoman Hartzler for being with us today and for serving on that committee, and frankly, serving in Washington. We forget that these members of Congress are serving our nation even though some of them aren’t doing a very good job. There are others like Vicky that are doing a good job. So appreciate her coming on and being with us today.

Sounds like, guys, there was quite a few recommendations of criminal activity being recommended to various government entities to prosecute?


Yeah, Rick, it’s something that on the Good News Friday stack, I actually have a few articles that journalists have highlighted some of the recommendations they’ve made. Certainly, some are very valid and recognizable things where people crossed the line or laws were broken.

Even the thing I thought was significant she said is that Planned Parenthood has now gotten out of the baby selling business, or a parts selling business as the cases were.

And that’s a huge victory, because with all the wrong that Planned Parenthood does and certainly the access they have to these aborted babies, as they would identify them, “€œfetuses”€ to even have them take a step back that is a major victory. Certainly not as far as we want to see this go.


If I can use a World War II example Hitler decided to quit killing the gypsies he just kept killing the Jews, that”€™s “€œvictory.”€ I’m sorry, but you’re right. It’s a victory and I thought about that when she said it, though.


One little, bitty baby step in the right direction. So, obviously, we got to take Hitler out. We don’t want you to kill anybody else, that’s a problem. So, not to minimize, but also we want to recognize this is something positive that they were able to put pressure on them and get them back away.

What they’re doing is already an atrocity, but it was almost a glorification of an atrocity where they’re making money off the atrocity. And so now we’re at least getting away from that a little bit. But many positive things that she identified.

They Don”€™t Deserve One Dime Of Funding


Well, I thought it was really interesting, Rick.  You asked the question, “€œYou finished all the the investigation, so do we need more laws?”€ And she said, “€œNo, we don’t need more laws, we just need enforcement of existing laws.”€

And I recall looking over this, some of these laws that are being broken have been on the books for years and years and years. Several of those laws were passed with the strong support of Democrats. Now, look where it is today.

Democrats aren’t liking the laws that they helped pass back in the day. I thought that was a great answer that she gave us.  We don’t need more laws, we just need enforcement of the current laws.  That’s a really big deal to be able to do that.

I also loved the line she said, “€œPlanned Parenthood doesn’t deserve one dime of taxpayer funding because they kill over 300,000 babies a year.”€ Boy, what a killer line. Yeah, you’re right, they don’t deserve one dime of funding.

As you mentioned, the executive order that Obama gave that states can’t defund Planned Parenthood. Now the House has moved in the step of being able to defund Planned Parenthood or at least letting states do it under Title 10. I mean those are all good steps. And for the very short period of time we’ve had this new Congress, they’ve already done some really good stuff and this is part of it, referring these 15 for prosecution.

I could not believe that those abortion clinics were saying, “€œHey, we use all these parts for embryonic stem cell research because that’s going to cure cancer and Parkinson’s and everything.”€ Whoa, pretty sure embryonic has zero cures.


Zero cures.


And I thought the propaganda they’re using to be able to get these parts to sell the parts even that is a lie on its face. So good stuff that they found that brought to light and hopefully good results will come out of this referral.


Thanks to Vicky Hartzler, a congresswoman from Missouri for joining us today. Thank you for listening.  You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live!