Foundations Of Freedom – Real Religion With Glenn Beck: In today’s episode, we are joined by special guest Glenn Beck. He will be sharing with us his perspective on the difference between religion and faith. Tune in now to learn more!

Air Date: 11/11/2019

Guest: Glenn Beck

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Rick:

Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live! Where we’re talking about today’s hottest topics on policy, faith, and the culture, always doing that from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective. 

David Barton, America’s historian, and WallBuilders Founder and President. Also, bestselling author and one of Time magazine’s top 25 most influential American evangelicals. My name is Rick Green. I’m a former Texas state representative. Our other hosts, typically who are with us is Tim Barton. He’s a national speaker and pastor, but this week, we’ve got a little bit of a special program for you. 

Foundations of Freedom Television Program

It’s gonna be five programs from Foundations of Freedom. That’s our new television program we’re gonna have some special guests this week. Glenn Beck, congresswoman Michele Bachmann, and Dr. Carol Swain. These programs are gonna cover a wide variety of topics; powerful information. We’re looking forward to sharing it with you right here on WallBuilders Live. 

Let’s dive in right now with the first episode. 

Real Religion with Glenn Beck

It’s called Real religion with Glenn Beck. It’s Foundations of Freedom, and you’re listening to it right here on WallBuilders Live. 

America’s Founders shared a deep sense of responsibility to care for the poor. But unlike many people today, they believe this duty belongs to churches and individuals rather than the government. 

Today, many Americans relegate the task of caring for the needy to government programs. 

So whose job should it be to care for the poor? Who does it better? What is the biblical approach to public aid? 

Join historian David Barton with special guests Glenn Beck, congresswoman Michele Bachmann and more as they explore the America our founding fathers envisioned what If America’s story is bolder, more colorful, and more compelling than you ever imagined. This is Foundations of Freedom.

David:

Welcoming to Foundations of Freedom

We’ll be looking at important aspects of our common heritage about which we hear absolutely nothing today. 

Joining me is a very good friend Glenn Beck. Glenn is known as a national radio and television personality. He’s also a great entrepreneur. He’s a wonderful philanthropist, but he especially is a very good friend. 

Glenn, thanks for being here.

Justice and Mercy

Glenn:

Thank you. I wanted to talk a little bit about justice and mercy. And the difference between religion and faith. I personally think religion is part of the problem.

Because going to church doesn’t change anybody. Living your faith that you’re supposed to learn a church does. Maybe it’s just America where we have had this Christian heritage, and everything is run so smoothly for so long for the average person that we just thought okay we’d check-in; we do our Sunday thing, and we get out. 

It’s falling apart because we’re not living. 

David:

We do our Sunday thing, but we don’t do our Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday thing based on our Sunday thing.

Moral Sentiments From Adam Smith

Glenn:

So let’s go here. 

Tell me a little bit about moral sentiments from Adam Smith because the wealth of nations is still taught. But moral sentiments, which is the first part the first book in that series, is not taught, and that’s critical.

David:

It is critical because if you take the wealth of nations, we’re told, and universities say that is the basis of the free market economic system. 

Glenn:

Right. 

David:

Well, that doesn’t even make sense. 

We had the free market system America long before Adam Smith wrote that book. But nonetheless, if we give Adam Smith credit for being the basis of the free market system. What we never give him credit for is that nearly two decades earlier, he wrote that two volumes set on the theory of moral settlements, which is the basis of the economic system. 

If You Don’t Have The Religion And The Morality – It Doesn’t Work

If you don’t have the religion and morality – the basis of economics; it doesn’t work. 

Glenn:

People have heard this many times the invisible hand of the market.

David:

That’s right.

Glenn:

He writes that the invisible hand of the market is whatever the people want. Whatever the free market, whatever they’re desiring, it will make. The people desire porn; you’ll find porn everywhere. 

David:

Right. 

The Invisible Hand Of The Market

Glenn:

But if the people start to say I’m not interested in that, it just goes away. That’s exactly the invisible hand of the market. And so governments are starting to say, you come through us, and we’ll make sure all the decisions are right. We’ll do everything that lessens us as spiritual beings, does it not?

David:

It does. It lessens us as special beings. And it really changes our focus on sufficiency and reliance as well. And when you change your focus on sufficiency and reliance, it changes your behavior.

Glenn:

Explain that.

David:

Well, if you are self-sufficient and you’re an end to yourself, and you’re not accountable to anyone outside yourself, then my behavior is: the end does justify the means.

Glenn:

So let me break this down. 

Here’s a really good example. I think most people can relate to: 

I have a mortgage payment. I have a car payment. I have to meet my bills, and I have a job that I’m now doing things that I don’t agree with, I’m conflicted on, or I’m working with people that are treating me horribly. But I’m not self-sufficient because I got myself, way out of control in debt. And so now I’m a slave to the bank. I’m a slave to whatever it is.

The Difference Between Religion And Faith

David:

That’s right. But see this goes back to even what you started with – the difference between religion and faith. 

Because of faith in the scripture, God says, stay out of debt. You lose your freedom when you get in debt. Do not get (into debt), but I want a new car. I don’t want one of one hundred thousand miles. I want a new car. 

The Bible says the eyes not content with seeing. If I keep looking at new cars, I want to buy a new car. Back off and be content with what you’ve got. 

We’re at a point now where if we’re going to take care of the poor, we don’t want to take care of the poor. We want the government to take care of the poor.

I don’t want to give up my X-box, I don’t want to give up the car. Me?

You Learn To Put God First 

 The Bible specifically says that every third year, in addition to paying tithes, everybody is supposed to pay their 10% to God. We don’t pay that because God needs it. Deuteronomy says you’re to pay the tithe. You do that to learn to put me(God) first. God’s is the reason you pay into the tithe so that you learn to put me at the top of what you do. 

I love the example with Cain and Abel. He said that Abel brought the first fruit of the flocks, and God is pleased with that. It says that Cain, in the course of time, brought the crops to God. God wasn’t pleased with what Cain did. 

So, when you do a first thing off the top, God can really bless that. I’ve seen that. We both tithe, we know the benefits that suddenly your cars go 200,000 miles rather than 80,000 miles. Your clothes don’t wear out as fast. That’s what the Bible says they went for 40 years in their sandals never wore out over the terrain in the wilderness. 

Glenn:

Can I talk to you about that a little bit because the only time when it comes to tithing that I have a disagreement on is when people are saying, give 10%, and you’re going to get 50% back.

It doesn’t necessarily work that way. The blessings aren’t necessary, they can be, but they’re not necessarily –

What You Want To Seek Is Obedience

David:

What you seek. What you want to seek is obedience. God says you’ll obey me. He says give me 10%. That way, you learn to put me first. If we do that, we get the blessings back, but if I’m seeking the blessings, I’ve got the wrong motivation.

We Want To Hear Your Vet Story

Rick:

Hey friends! If you have been listening to WallBuilders Live for very long at all, you know how much we respect our veterans and how appreciative we are of the sacrifice they make to make our freedoms possible. One of the ways that we love to honor those veterans is to tell their stories here on WallBuilders Live. Once in a while, we get an opportunity to interview veterans that have served on those front lines that have made incredible sacrifices have amazing stories that we want to share with the American people. 

One of the very special things we get to do is interview World War II veterans. You’ve heard those interviews here on WallBuilders Live, from folks that were in the Band of Brothers, to folks like Edgar Harrell that survived the Indianapolis to so many other great stories you heard on WallBuilders Live. 

You have friends and family that also served. If you have World War II veterans in your family that you would like to have their story shared here on WallBuilders Live, please e-mail us at [email protected] Give us a brief summary of the story, and we’ll set up an interview. Thanks so much for sharing here on WallBuilders Live!

Every Three Year, You Give Another 10% To The Poor

David:

The Bible also says every three years; you’re to give another 10% specifically to the poor. You dedicate another 10 percent, Deuteronomy real quick, is clear. Every three years, you give another 10% that’s to be used among the poor. So if I’m following biblical economics, you know what? I’m supposed to be given 10% right off the top, but I’m also supposed to be giving to the poor. 

Glenn:

So let me go where some people have a problem because I hear this all the time. You’ll hear this all the time whenever we give foreign aid I’m talking about government. They’re going to be giving foreign aid, and people will always say there are enough people here in America that we should be helping you know in our own country. I’m sure this is like it is in every country around the world. We have enough people here home why are we helping yada yada yada. 

Well, if I may, we don’t give necessarily to people in our own country, and I’m speaking specifically about America. 

Oprah Winfrey is a great example. She built a school in Africa. When asked why? Because I tried to do it here in America and (A) there was too much red tape, and (B) People were like, and what else?

Work Six Days, Seven Rest

One of my favorite parts of the Ten Commandments that everybody overlooks is on the Sabbath day. Six days shall you work. 

It requires you to work six days, seven rest. We’ve cut that commandment.

There are people that don’t want to give their money because they’re like, I’ve been scammed on the street. I see the waste or people are ungrateful. 

It’s not about them. It’s about you. 

David:

It’s about you. 

There’s another perspective that we’ve gotten wrong as well. 

We in America have been blessed in so many ways; we were told back in Deuteronomy Moses said you guys when you get the promised land, you have so much abundance, so much plenty. You’re going to end up thinking that you did it yourself. You’re going to say look what we did, and you’re going to become arrogant. You’re proud. 

He said your blessing would become your curse because you think that you did it. 

So here we are in America, and I saw a poll recently where it said that 57% of Americans say, I’m willing to pay more taxes if it means the government will do more to help the poor. 

Glenn:

I’ve never felt charitable on April 15. 

David:

No, there’s a couple of things that really stand out here. 

The way God dealt with poverty in the Bible was, the priest was to go into the home, and the priest would say, you look like you need help for about two months. I know it’s really tough now. We’ll help you with 70 percent of what you need for two months. It was to be done locally, and it was to be done temporarily. 

Do The Most Good Of Which It Is Capable

Thomas Jefferson has a great quote here. Thomas Jefferson says I deem it the duty of every man to devote a certain portion of his income for charitable purposes, and that it is his further duty to see that is applied as do the most good of which is capable.

Glenn:

I had a bishop. I learned two things from this bishop. I was up in New Kanan, which is a town 95% Wall Street guys. This guy was a Goldman Sachs guy in the day. 

Two things happen to me. One, I found myself suddenly with money.

I grew up poor, and I didn’t know how to give to charity. I suddenly found myself with some money, and I asked how do I be responsible? 

Look At People As Investments

He said you have to look at people as investments. He said I know that sounds really cold, and a lot of you I’ve said this before and people think that’s outrageous. But I think it’s good.

Who can you give your hard-earned money to that’s going to get it closest to the person in need. Who’s that person that has the chance of really affecting others and (letting it) snowball. 

That’s why it’s offensive to me. The government 60 percent is just waste. it’s wasted and 

David:

It’s actually 70 percent. When you give a dollar to the government, only 30 cents gets to the poor. That’s outrageous 

Glenn:

That’s the kind of stuff I think the Lord will look at us and say excuse me, what did you do? That is your money that you took 

You Wasted 70 Percent Of God’s Money

David:

You wasted 70 percent of it my money.

I love the rest of Jefferson’s quote here. He says I have this duty not only to give to the poor. 

He says this I believed to be best ensured. By keeping within the circle of his own inquiry and subject to the stress to his relief and contribution, be applied. I need to know the situation. When I send it to DC, and they send it to California or Florida. It’s not the circle closest to you. You take care of those around you. 

You Take Care Of Those Around You

If every community does it, and this is going back to the thing by 70 percent. If you give a dollar to charity, and 60 cents out of the dollar doesn’t reach a target. Don’t give it to the charity. 

What you’ve got is we have these groups 

Glenn:

I have Catholic relief that says ninety-three percent. American Jewish World Service is ‘eighty-six. Operation Blessing International ninety-eight percent. Samaritan’s Purse eighty-nine. Mercury One 100 percent.

David:

That’s your charity and when you go on the radio and say we’ve got a disaster give money. One hundred percent of it goes there. The government is thirty percent.

We Have A Problem In America

David:

Let’s go a step further because we have a problem in America. 

When we look at the poor, we showed the poorest of the poor, and we think that’s what the American poorest. 

According to data from the federal government, if you are poor in America, you have more air conditioning, more television, more automobile, more red meat, and more square footage of living space than the middle class in Europe right. 

That’s poverty in America now. 

The Average Amount That Goes To The Poor Is Sixty-One Thousand Dollars A Year

Take that even a step further, right now if you’re on welfare in America there are 80 anti-poverty programs in America. 

Those 80 anti-poverty programs spread out over the poor. The average amount that goes through those poverty programs to those who are poor is sixty-one thousand dollars a year. 

The poor in America right now make more than the starting salary of a teacher and in eleven states more than the starting salary of a secretary in 39 states. If you’re in Hawaii unless you’re making a salary of over sixty-one thousand dollars a year, there’s no reason for you to get off poverty.

Second Thing I Learnt From The Bishop And Benjamin Franklin

Glenn:

So let me take you to the second thing that I learned from this bishop, and I also learned it from Benjamin Franklin.

Benjamin Franklin in a letter he wrote to England. He was criticizing England and saying how bad things were (he said) you are crippling people. He said the best way to help people in poverty is to make them uncomfortable in their poverty.

Again that sounds cold. 

Here’s a great example. I get a call from a church member that we’re going to church with. Good guy. Fallen on hard times. Really hard times and was really struggling. He calls me up, and he said Glenn, I’m trying to get home for something, and you know I’ve really fallen on hard times and if I could just borrow X number of dollars.

When he was asking to borrow, he wasn’t asking to borrow. He was asking to get. My first question was, have you asked the bishop? Because I know my church, and they have a big poverty deal.

And he said no, I haven’t. I said Well, let me pray on it, and I’ll get back to you.

The first thing I did, I called the bishop. The bishop paused, and he said Glenn, I’m going to ask you to do the hardest thing you’ve ever done. I know it’d be easy for you to write this check, please don’t. He said we were working so hard with him and he won’t do certain things that will change his life.

You Can’t Give People Everything

And I thought of the Franklin quote. They’re still there helping. But you can’t give people everything. If they’re not willing to change. There comes to a point where you have to say OK we gave you that hand up. You’re on your own. You’re standing on your own two feet, and you’re capable of doing it, it Isn’t our responsibility. 

David:

Let me read you that Franklin quote because you’ve already covered parts of it in what the bishops said.

He says I am for doing good to the poor. But I think the best way of doing good to the poor is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or drive them out of it. 

He said I’ve observed in different countries that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves and, of course, became poor. 

On the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves and became richer. 

The Act Of Tax 

He said the day you pass the act, and he’s talking about Great Britain because they pass an act of tax. The rich to give to the poor or go to charity with no accountability. He said, the day you’d pass that act you took away from before their eyes the greatest of all inducements to industry, frugality, and sobriety.

In short, you offered a premium for the encouragement of idleness, and you should not now wonder that it has had its effect on the increase of poverty.

America’s Hidden History

Hi, this is David Barton.

And, this is Tim Barton, and we want to let you know about a series that’s happening right now on TBN on Thursday night. TBN is the Trinity Broadcasting Network. Every Thursday night, there’s a series that we’ve filmed called America’s Hidden History.

And, this season is called “America’s Hidden Heroes.” The reason is, we highlight heroes from American history. For years we’ve been focusing on the forgotten history and heroes of the nation.

And now, we have a TV show just highlighting some of those heroes.

These are inspiring stories about some of the greatest people maybe you’ve never heard about. We go on location to the sites and show you where the events happened. It’s the stories of folks like Bronco Charlie, Stagecoach Mary, Jedediah Smith, Robert Smalls, and so many inspiring folks.

Now, this happens every Thursday night, and the time is gonna be different based on where you live. Either way, we think this is something that will so encourage and inspire you in learning some of these great stories from America’s Hidden History.

David:

He said, repeal that law, and you’ll soon see a change in their manners. St Monday and St Tuesday will cease to be holidays. And by the way, he quoted exactly the Ten Commandments. 

He says it says six days shall thou work. He says industry and hard work will increase and with it plenty among the lower people. Their circumstances will mend, and more will be done for their happiness by enabling them to provide for themselves than can be done by dividing all of your estates among them. 

There are two attitudes that have to be hit among people of faith if they’re gonna get this right. 

The Bible Has To Be The Basis Of The Way This Works

The first is the Bible has to be the basis of the way this works. And the Bible, over two hundred times, talks about taking care of the poor. 

If you want to study just it, get on your Ipad, Android, or whatever and look up all the verses on the poor. Then just put a piece of paper on the wall. Make three columns, and every time that verse about taking care of the poor is related to family or the individual. Write it up there. If it’s related to the church, write it up there if it’s related to government write it up there. You get done. 

There are three verses on the government side. It says when the poor come into court, make sure they get justice. When the poor come before your leaders, don’t treat the poor different from the rich. I mean, the only thing it says about the government and the poor is justice. 

Government Bear The Sword To Punish The Wicked And Reward The Righteous

Glenn:

So that’s what I wanted to say to you. 

That’s why I asked it that at the beginning, let’s talk about justice and mercy. I believe governments are incapable of mercy. 

David:

They supposed to be because they bear the sword. They bear the sword to punish the wicked and reward the righteous. They’re not supposed to have mercy toward the wicked they bear the sword for that. 

We can individually forgive. We can show mercy. We’re told and James 2:13 that mercy always triumphs over judgment. 

We’re not to exercise judgment, but that’s why God ordained government if you see this in real life, if you go into a relief agency.

There Is A Difference Between Somebody Who Is Dedicating Their Life To Charity And Somebody Whose Job It Is

Let’s take FEMA. The good people in FEMA. I don’t know them, but I’m sure there are lots of good people who have good hearts and want to do the right thing. And then I see people like you know Operation Blessing. I know those people. Really good people. 

And there is a difference between somebody who is dedicating their life to service, mercy, and charity and somebody whose job it is. I studied to be a social worker, and I’m doing these things. That doesn’t mean that you can’t have that heart, but generally speaking the organizations, one you will see is run like the DMV. You’re going there to get your driver’s license. It’s not pretty. 

I don’t know if it feels like a real charity and a really great spirit when you walk in to go get your welfare money or your unemployment money. I don’t think so. You are treated like cattle. 

They Actually Care

When you go to a charity? Because they actually care. Governments get so big, and out of control, they don’t care. There’s no accountability. 

David:

The other aspect is not only that I don’t care. They don’t love. Sometimes love means correction. 

As your bishop said, don’t give him because we’re really working on getting his thinking right, and getting his habits right. Government does not do that. That’s why the priest was told to go in the home because you need to change the way you’re doing this over here. 

There’s No Love

If you stop this right here, you can get yourself out of poverty. The government won’t do that. They just keep doling it out. There’s no accountability. There’s no love. Sometimes love means taking somebody’s in your arms and saying I need to spank you.

Glen:

How many times with our kids? I’m only doing this because I love you. Our kids say you just hate you this or I hate you because –

Every parent knows. I’m only doing this because I love you.

David:

And the kids eventually figured out. Down the road, you look back and say I needed that. I needed that kick, and government will not do that. 

God Is Smarter On Helping The Poor Than Anything Out There

So, the first thing we got to get right is it’s not the government’s role. The second thing, and I think God is smarter about helping the poor than anything out there. 

I want to read two verses on helping the poor that God uses. 

He’s talking to business owners. This is what he said and their agricultural guys. They own their own stuff. 

He says when you reap your harvest in your field, and you forget a sheaf in the field, don’t go back and get it. It’ll be for the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow that the Lord your God may bless you and all the works your good hands. 

When you beat the olive trees, you shall knock over the boughs again. This shall be for the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow. When you’ve gathered the grapes of your vineyard, don’t glean it afterward, for it will be for the fatherless and the widows. 

Then the other one he gives in Exodus, he says during the seventh year let the land lie unplowed and unused. Then the poor among your people may get food from it, and the wild animals may eat what the poor leave. Do the same with your vineyard and olive grove. So He says okay here’s the deal. You’re harvesting your weight. Round off the corners, leave what’s in the corners. 

If you forgot sheaves in the field, don’t go back and get, and you’re beating the olives out of the trees, and you didn’t beat them all out, don’t go back and get them. You’re picking the vines off the vineyard, and you missed some clusters don’t go back and get them. You leave it on the ground. The poor get it. 

The poor had to go in and harvest the wheat. That’s why I had to pick up the grapes. The poor had to beat the olive trees. The poor had to go to the land that was there for seven years, and they had to do something. 

The War On Poverty 

Glenn:

It’s why the war on poverty is so ridiculous. The Bible says the poor will always be among us. You don’t win this. You find the best way to pull the most people out. But they’ve got to want to get out. 

It’s like alcoholism. He can’t save an alcoholic. He’s got to want to get out. He’s got to get so down. They’ll all ask you. I’m an alcoholic. I know. They’ll ask if I could just have ten more bucks. If I just have one hundred bucks. If I can just have more time, I’ll figure this out.

No. You haven’t been broken yet enough to say I’m going out. 

Tomorrow: A Courageous Church

Rick:

Well, we’re out of time for today, folks. You’ve been listening to Foundations of Freedom. It’s a television series you can get right now at Wallbuilderslive.com if you go to that link there on our Web site today. 

Today’s program was a real religion with Glenn Beck. We’re getting at the conclusion of that tomorrow. We didn’t have time today to get the whole program there. Tomorrow we’ll pick up right where we left off today, and then we’re going to add another episode from Foundations of Freedom called a courageous church.

That will be with David Barton and me, Rick Green. 

So, tomorrow, you get some of Glenn Beck on real religion and then myself and David Barton on a courageous church. All of it from Foundations of Freedom. 

Looking forward to you joining us right back here tomorrow on WallBuilders Live.