Trade Agreement Trojan Horse – Treaties and More: Did you know that when a treaty is ratified it becomes supreme law alongside the U.S. Constitution? Join us as Mat Staver from Liberty Counsel discusses some of the negative cultural agenda that got slipped into the NAFTA treaty and what we can do to stop it! Tune in now to learn more!

Air Date: 01/14/2019

Guest: Mat Staver

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Rick:

Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live! Where we talk about today’s hottest topics on policy and faith and how they impact the culture. We always do that from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

We’re here with David Barton, America’s premier historian and our founder at WallBuilders. Also, Tim Barton’s with us, national speaker, pastor, and president of WallBuilders. And my name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas legislator.

Check us out at WallBuildersLive.com. That’s where you can get a list of our stations across the country, where you can hear the program, or you can download it right there at WallBuildersLive.com. And then you can also get some of the archives over the last few weeks and months.

So, you might want to tap into some of those Good News Friday programs. Get some good news if you need a pick me up and you just need to be reminded that the system does work if we work it. And that’s why we’ve got to know what our rights are, we’ve got to understand those things, and know how to actually live them out in this culture.

So, that’s part of why we do Foundations of Freedom Thursday. You can get that one every week on Thursdays where your questions drive the conversation about the Constitution, the Declaration, our founding principles, and then applying those things to the issues of today. Those were available at WallBuildersLive.com as well. And then Monday through Wednesday we have great interviews. Later in the program, Mat Staver our special guest for today.

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Talking About Treaties

Rick:

Alright, David, Tim, long opening today. I got a little long winded there. Sorry about that. I was getting excited about about some of these things. Staver will be with us, Mat Staver, our good friend, will be with us later in the program. We’re going to talk a little bit about treaties, guys. Now, treaties is not an often covered topic here on our program, so folks may be wondering–

Tim:

But, boy, does that sound exciting.

Rick:

Yeah, doesn’t that sound exciting.

Tim:

Let’s talk treaties. You know, there’s nothing more riveting in like a history class–

Rick:

Right.

Tim:

–or a government class than when the professor says, “Okay, today is treaties.” And you’re just like, “Oh boy”, rubbing your hands–

Rick:

Oh boy.

Tim:

–get out the note pad–

Rick:

Head on the desk.

Tim:

–”I’m ready.”

Rick:

Yeah. So, you were all ready. I was head on the desk asleep, you know, you wake up, make sure you are drooling, all that – that was me.

David:

And so you chose to talk about treaties today that put you to sleep? So, that’s what we’re going to cover today? Come on, Rick.

Another Country Telling Us What to Do?

Rick:

I’m hoping you guys will carry this while I’m napping. No, actually, treaties is something– I always had a red flag every time the word treaties come up. Because in my mind I’m always thinking, “Okay, well that means some other country is telling us what to do.” Now, granted, that can be– there’s a lot of treaties, but that’s my simple mind. I’m always worried because I don’t want us to give up anything. I don’t want us to give up any sovereignty, I don’t want another country telling me what kind of firearm I can have, how to raise my children, how I can worship, what beliefs I can have.

David:

You’re talking about the U.N. treaty on the Rights of the Child.

Rick:

Yep, yep.

David:

You’re talking about small arms treaty. All these U.N. treaties that come to us that we’re asked to ratify UN treaties, or we’re asked to ratify NAFTA treaties. We’ve got a new NAFTA treaty coming down. We’re asked to ratify NATO treaties.

Tim:

And, by the way, what’s a NAFTA treaty? That’s a North American Free Trade Agreement?

David:

That’s right. A treaty between the three countries that join part of North America – Canada North.

Tim:

Texas, and–]

David:

Texas *laughter*, oh, it’s for countries – you’re right. It’s as Canada, United States, Texas, and Mexico.

NAFTA

Rick:

I wondered where you were going with that.

David:

It’s an agreement between those four countries is what it amounts to.

Tim:

For any listener that doesn’t know, no, no, Texas is not their own country as much as we would like to be. No, but it’s Canada, it’s the United States of America, and Mexico. So, that’s the NAFTA deal.

David:

NAFTA deal is allowing trade to go all the way from the northern part of Canada all the way to Mexico City. Pretty much unrestricted, crossing the borders, borders becomes not an issue there for– or, generally, not issues, relatively speaking.

But you’ve got treaties with NATO, you’ve got treaties that we do on things like energy with other nations. So, a lot of treaties out there and they come to the United States by way of the president or someone in the executive branch negotiating the treaty. Then the Constitution requires that go to the Senate where it be ratified by two thirds of the Senate.

And why in the world would you have such a high threshold for a Senate treaty? Why do you have to have such a big number to ratify the treaty? And the answer is Article 6 of the Constitution says that when you ratify a treaty it becomes part of the “supreme law of the land”. So, when you do a treaty you have just lifted it above federal law, you put it on the even keel with the U.S. Constitution. The Constitution is supreme law of the land and any treaty ratify. So, all these treaties–

It Overrides Everything

Rick:

That means it that means it overrides state law, right, and state judges? In fact, it specifically says that in the Constitution.

David:

It override state law, it overrides federal law, it overrides all federal regulations, it overrides everything except the explicit wording in the Constitution.

Tim:

And this is something that the president can’t do. It’s something that a judge can’t do. This has to happen specifically through the Senate is what the Constitution says.

David:

The president starts it by the negotiation and then the Senate ends it by a ratification vote. So–

Rick:

That’s a big deal when you’re talking about actually overriding what a state can do. So, we’re taking away a lot of that individual kind of mindset and even– laws vary state to state as the founders intended for it to be. But here you’re not only giving a Congress that represents the whole country now the chance to override something in a state, you’re given an agreement with another nation the chance to potentially override.

David:

So, let me ask you this question – if you look at the president’s budget this year, it’s 2500 pages long. Do you think there’s anything in that budget when it’s that long that might have slipped through without really being noticed or scrutinized?

Rick:

Just one or two things.

Pass It to Find Out What’s in It

Tim:

I’m going to say it’s like Obamacare you pass it to find out what’s in it.

Rick:

Right.

David:

That’s next for example. What was in Obamacare that we didn’t find out about until after it went in. So, what do you do if you have a treaty, like a NAFTA treaty, that generally is good on the surface for all the reviews, it’s going to help the United States trade, it’s going to move the deficit the right direction, trade deficit. But what if there’s all these other little things that are attached in there that nobody’s paying any attention to? And what if that becomes part of the supreme law of the land? And that’s what’s happening–

Rick:

And those things are even more important. Those little– well, we call them “little things” like it’s not the purpose of the treaty, but it’s something could get slipped in there that– back home. It’s even more important for – I think all three of us would agree that our value system, our ability to– our freedom of religion, is more important than our our pocketbook, right? So, we we have a hierarchy there of values and we wouldn’t give up our freedom of speech, or our freedom of religion, just to have a better economy let’s say.

David:

Yeah. And what if everyone is looking at the economic impact and the prime minister of Canada slipped in a little phrase there that deals with cultural and religious values and beliefs. And while everybody is looking at the economic stuff you find out, ooops, here’s something that’s in here that essentially is kind of a global shoji, or a global ERO, or HRO, equal rights amendment. In other words, we’re going to mandate that in the United States and Mexico you deal with homosexuality the same way we do in Canada.

George Washington’s Philosophy

David:

What does that have to do with the trade agreement? Well, that’s part of the liabilities when you start having treaties like this. And, by the way, this is why George Washington in his farewell address said to avoid foreign entanglements. You don’t want to get caught up in the practices of other nations. And this way it’s not been an isolationist, but you don’t have to go out and make treaties with everybody.

David:

So, Mat Staver has been able to identify some of the, actually, cultural agenda that got slipped into the NAFTA treaty that was not part of the trade agreement. While the trade agreement part appears to be very helpful for America, there’s some other stuff that’s there that’s worth talking about.

Rick:

Mat Staver, Liberty Counsel, good friend of our program, does fantastic work – argues before the Supreme Court, has cases all over the country protecting religious liberty and free speech in other areas of the Constitution. Looking forward to having him back. We’ve got a quick break and then Mat Staver will be with us. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Moment From American History

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment in American history. America is a special and unique nation. The average length for a constitution in other countries is only 17 years. But we’ve had ours for over two centuries. Our 4 percent of the world’s population produces 24 percent of the world’s gross domestic product and every year we produce more inventions and technology than the other 96 percent of the world combined.

In 1831 Alexis de Tocqueville of France came to America, traveled the country, and in his famous book, “Democracy in America” reported,  “The position of the Americans is therefore quite exceptional. It may be believed that no Democratic people will ever be placed in a similar one.”

This is the origin of the phrase “American exceptionalism” and affirms that America is unique because of the distinctive ideas on which we’ve been based. Including in inalienable rights, individuals, and limited government, and the importance of religion, and morality. For more information about American exceptionalism go to WallBuilders.com.

Cultural Agenda in the NAFTA Treaty

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. Mat Staver is back with us from Liberty Counsel. Always good to have you, sir. Thanks for coming on.

Mat Staver:

Thank you. Good to be with you.

Rick:

Hey, not only are you guys so good at taking cases all the way to Supreme Court defending our liberties all across the country in district courts and even with school districts and all different areas, but you’re even following some of this stuff in Washington D.C. and even some of these international agreements like NAFTA. And apparently, looks like better NAFTA than the old left, but some very dangerous provisions in there with regard to really shoji laws that are going to force communities that don’t want to have these, what I would consider unconstitutional anyway, “protections” for the LGBT community to have them through an international treaty.

Mat Staver:

That’s right. Well, we have an office also in Washington D.C. that focuses on legal and also public policies. We monitor these kinds of things. Certainly, this U.S., Mexico, Canada, proposed trade agreement which has already been signed by the president and the other two parties, that is a big improvement over NAFTA, no question about it, with regards to the United States and trade.

However, in Article 23 there are two different provisions in sections that actually include social policy changes that are significant and could be catastrophic if ratified or voted upon and confirmed by the Senate. These including sexual orientation and gender identity. It says that the parties to this agreement would undertake policies that protect sexual orientation and gender identity. If that were passed this would become the supreme law of the land.

Supreme Law of the Land

Mat Staver:

Because, as you know, the Constitution states that not only the Constitution is the supreme law of the land, but treaties properly ratified also become the supreme law of the land. That means that they are in position of authority over any state or local laws to the contrary. Just like the Constitution of the United States.

Rick:

Yeah, and that means to our local communities across the country – places like my home state of Texas, and more conservative states, if you will, that they’re going to essentially be forced to adopt these policies of a Massachusetts, or a California, or a more liberal state through this international treaty.

Mat Staver:

That’s right. And it looks like this got put in either because of pressure from Prime Minister of Canada, Justin Trudeau, and then also part of the deep state with the representative of the Office of Trade. That office likely inserted the sexual orientation gender identity. Members of the House have already issued a letter to President Donald Trump indicating that this is no place for social policy and also pointing out that multiple times the House and the Senate have rejected amending Title 7, which is the employment non-discrimination provision passed in the 1960s, to include sexual orientation and gender identity.

What they have rejected, this treaty would ultimately take our sovereignty away. And with the new Congress being seated in January, it would give them a lot of argument to say, “We need to now amend Title 7 to include gender identity sexual orientation.” And Title 9, the provision that governs colleges across the country, to include that as well. So, it would be catastrophic in so many ways. That’s why this needs to be changed. It needs to be removed. And if it can’t be removed effectively then the entire treaty must be rejected by the Senate and re-negotiated without the sexual orientation gender identity provisions.

Being Forced to Say “Yes”?

Mat Staver:

This is a good trade agreement on the face of trade, but it can be used as a Trojan horse to slip in gender identity, and sexual orientation, and impose it on the American people against their will and against the legislative absolute rejection of these provisions in federal law.

Rick:

And, Mat, What I saw in my mind as you described that is is basically that our, tell me if I got this right, that our elected representatives are members of Congress have said “no” to a policy multiple times. And that now through an international trade, basically, other countries telling us to do this, it’s going to still be passed without our representatives in Congress– well, I guess the Senate would ratify, but the House would not have said “yes”.

Mat Staver:

That’s right.

Rick;

So, they’ve basically taken something we said “no” to through our representatives and forced us to say “yes”. Going to take a quick break. Mat Staver is our special guest. Liberty Counsel is the organization – LC.org is the website. That’s LC.org. Quick break. We’ll be right back. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Pastors Only Briefing Trip

Tim:

Hi, this is Tim Barton with WallBuilders and I want to encourage all the pastors out there with a unique opportunity that we’re presenting it WallBuilders. We’re doing a special tour just for pastors that you can come and learn more about the spiritual heritage of our nation. Not just seeing the sights but understanding the significance of what they are and what they represent.

We get to go to the Capitol at night.  And we get to see the spiritual heritage of our Founding Fathers, of who we are as a nation, where we came from. We bring in congressman that will tell you about current legislation, about our religious liberties  and freedom, and what’s going on in Washington, D.C.

If you’re a pastor or if you want to recommend your pastor for this trip, you can go to our website at www.WallBuilders.com. And there’s a link that’s for scheduling.  If you click on that link there’s a section for pastor’s briefing. There’s more information about the dates, when it’s going, and how it’s going to happen. If you want to know more about our nation, our religious liberties, our freedom, our spiritual heritage, this is a trip you want to be a part of.

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. Mat Staver our special guest today from Liberty Counsel – LC.org is the website. You can go there to find out more about Liberty Counsel and the cases that they are fighting all across the country. Mat today of course talking about NAFTA and, like you said, good trade agreement, but this whole shoji ordnance thing is incredibly dangerous and Congress has said “no” to this, our elected representatives, as we were talking about before the break.

So, it’s something that, as a nation we’ve said “no” to and it would force this on communities that have said “no” to it. And yet it’s going to be slipped in through an international provision.

A Classic Trojan Horse

Mat Staver:

Yeah, it really is the classical Trojan Horse – looks good on the surface, good trade agreement, but then it ultimately has a poison pill is part of it and that can’t happen. And not only is it contrary to Congress’s rejection of sexual orientation and gender identity in federal law, but it’s also contrary to President Trump and the Trump administration. Because, as you know, since taking office he has overturned some of the unconstitutional power grabs of President Obama to use the military as a social re-engineering platform for transgender and LGBT issues as well as the Department of Education and the Department of Justice. All of that President Donald Trump has reversed and he has brought in constitutional commonsense provisions rejecting the radicalism of the previous administration.

So, this is contrary not only to Congress’s history, but it’s also contrary to President Donald Trump. On the one hand it’s a great improvement on trade, but on the other hand it’s a Trojan Horse and it cannot be confirmed by the Senate. It needs to either have those provisions removed, and if they can’t be removed, the entire trade agreement needs to go down, unfortunately, and then come back again without those provisions and be re-signed.

Rick:

I’m so glad you mentioned that about President Trump because that was what surprised me when I read this. Like you said, he’s taken on some tough fights that, honestly, I didn’t think he would. Because, man, when you go against the LGBT community they come after you. And yet he’s been willing to do these common sense things on the transgender issue and other things in the military. So, it really surprised me that this would be in there. It doesn’t sound like him and I haven’t read anything that said he wanted this, right?

Mat Staver:

No.

Rick:

This was, like you said, something that kind of slipped in.

Two Hands

Mat Staver:

I haven’t read anything that he wants it, but certainly President– or Prime Minister Trudeau in Canada, certainly he would be an advocate. And I think he got a willing accomplice in the deep state with the representative of the office of trade. That, I think, is how this ultimately got him there.

On the one hand he’s looking at it as a good trade agreement, which it is big improvement. And on the other hand here we have this Trojan Horse that got slapped in, frankly, a poison pill. It looks good and shiny and it’s certainly nice, but then if you ultimately accept it, good grief, what’s going to happen in the future is a radical LGBT agenda will become the supreme law of the land. We can’t have that.

Rick:

What’s our action items, Mat? What’s the best place to– do we call senators? Do we call our congressmen?

Mat Staver:

I think we need to call both. I think you need to call your Senators and Representatives in your state and encourage them to vote against this trade agreement with this provision. Strike the sexual orientation gender identity or kill the entire agreement if you have to and go back and re-pass it. And also, I would encourage you to contact your members of the House.

Now, they don’t have the final vote, but they do have some say and I would encourage you to make your voice known to them. Some members of the House have already written an objection to the president just before it was signed pointing out the reasons why this is problematic.

Rick:

Any indication at all on timing in terms of the Senate taking it up for ratification?

Mat Staver:

It’s going to happen sometime after the seating of the new Congress.

Rick:

Okay.

Take Action!

Mat Staver:

So, you may have an interesting confluence of some Democrats that just don’t want to pass anything that President Donald Trump’s signature is on. And then you’re going to have some social conservative Republicans that don’t want to pass with these provisions. So, we have a good opportunity to stop this. Whether we kill the entire trade agreement and go back and re-draft it or take out these provisions, either way it has to be done. So, I believe sometime January, possibly February, we’re going to see some action on this. It’s not going to happen, I don’t think before the end of the year.

Rick:

Well, that’s an easy action item. Honestly, folks out there listening, you can pick up the phone and you can get the links on our WallBuilders Live website to find your Senate office and congressional office, make that call. If we get enough people saying something about this we can stop it. But you’ve got to make those calls and encourage your senators to say “no” even though, as Mat has said, it’s a good trade agreement. This Trojan Horse is incredibly dangerous to the whole country.

Mat Staver, Thank you for all you guys do at Liberty Counsel. LC.org is the website, folks. Go there and you can actually follow the cases that Mat’s involved in as well. Make a contribution, in fact, end of year contributions, good time to do that and help these guys continue to do the good work that they do. Mat, appreciate your time, brother. Appreciate you coming on.

Mat Staver:

Thank you. My pleasure.

Rick:

Stay with us, folks. We’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

This Precarious Moment Book

David:

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These are all problems that are solvable if we’ll get involved. So you can grab the book This Precarious Moment and find out what you can do to make a difference. This Precarious Moment is available at WallBuilders.com.

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us on WallBuilders Live. Thanks to Mat Staver for joining us today and for catching this in the NAFTA agreement and hopefully raising enough of a concern about it.

We’re back with David and Tim Barton. Guys, this is not just a little bit bad, this could be huge. David, you mentioned shoji earlier in the program and, of course, we’ve had many programs over the years about shoji ordinances and the devastating effect it can have – especially on those in the in the religious community and Christian community. This could– this could force it into states and communities that have not participated in shojis. You know they would love, the LGBT community would love to take this as a hammer to those communities and force them to buy into everything that they want.

The Most Pro-Homosexual Country in the Western World

David:

Well, I don’t know of any country in the Western world that is more aggressive and pro homosexual policy than Canada is right now and the Prime Minister. You’re looking at Christian colleges being closed down because of having a traditional view of marriage and sexuality. You’re looking at pastors who have faced jail time for espousing a Christian view of morality and sexuality. Canada is just really vicious. And any opposition to LGBTQ movement going forward at 190 miles an hour or however fast they want to make it so.

So, take Canada’s very hostile policy toward Christians and traditional morality and put that into a treaty that would become the supreme law of the land in the United States. Now, again, this is not something that’s glamorous and that everybody’s noticing, but I guarantee that it will start getting pointed out by the LGBTQ community. If we don’t follow exactly what the treaty says, they’ll start taking it to court. So, they know it’s in there and will be a huge club given to them by Canada against so much of what’s happening in the United States.

So, as Mat said, this is the time to call the senators to oppose this treaty as it exists right now. There’s probably several senators, I think, that if they knew about this would stand up – James Lankford out of Oklahoma, Ted Cruz out of Texas, I think probably Senator Blunt out of Missouri, others would stand up and say, “No, no, no, we don’t want that in there. Get that out. Renegotiate that section.”

So, now it’s a good time to call because if you’re in D.C. and you get these long things coming through and you get 1,000 bills a month coming through, you don’t see all the details and you need people to be able to point out that, “Hey, there’s something you ought to look at.”

So, as Mat suggested, this would be a good thing to call your senator on and say, “Hey, the NAFTA treaty, we support the economic side of this, but you’ve got to get this shoji wording out of there, you’ve got to get this, what they call employment non-discrimination or sexual orientation gender identity, that’s got to go. That’s not part of free trade and we don’t need the culture of Canada being imposed on the United States.”

Rick:

No. Yeah, and special thanks again, once again, to Mat Staver for bringing this to our attention and coming on the program to share it with us. But now the burden’s on us, now the burdens on us as individuals to make those phone calls just like Mat was saying and David was just saying. It doesn’t take long. Send an e-mail, make the phone call, it’ll have a big impact over time if enough people will do it and that means protecting your community. Let’s make this happen.

Trade Agreement Trojan Horse – Treaties and More

Rick:

Our audience is known for being an audience of action. Most of our guests we have on the program say they get more response when they’re on our program than some of the programs that are much larger audiences because of our very action oriented folks. So, we encourage you to do that today. Thanks so much for listening. Be sure and visit, again, WallBuilders.com and WallBuildersLive.com. And please consider making a one time or a monthly donation.

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