Unhyphenated American – Are You An American Or A Hyphenated American? Â Chris Harris from Unhyphenated America poses the question, “Should we be proud to be Americans? And if so, why?” Today, we are looking more at our differences than the things that unite us. We create labels and categories where we place our identity, instead of standing united as simply Americans. If you believe, embrace, and promote the principles our nation was founded on- such as life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness- you are an American. There is no need for any prefix or suffix. Tune in now to learn how we see these patterns throughout history and learn how we can have another great awakening in America.
Air Date:Â 11/07/2017
Guests: Chris Harris, David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton
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Transcription note: Â As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.
Faith And The Culture
You”ve found your way to the intersection of faith and the culture. Â Welcome to WallBuilders Live! Where we”re talking about today”s hottest topics on policy, and faith, and the culture, all of it from a Biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.
That conversation today is with David Barton. Â He”s America’s premier historian and our founder here at WallBuilders. Also, Tim Barton, national speaker, and pastor, and the president of WallBuilders. My name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas legislator.
You can find out more about us and the program at WallBuildersLive.com. That”s our radio site where you can find a list of our stations and archives of the program over the last couple of months.
And then at WallBuilders.com, our main site, you can get a wealth of resources for yourself and your family. It”ll educate you, equip you, inspire you. You can use some of that curriculum in your Sunday school class, or your homeschool, or private school. Encourage you to dive into that.By the way, even if you’re out of school- a wealth of information for you.
Erosion of Patriotism, People Question: “Should I be proud to be an American?”
Any of us as citizens, at any age, need to be investing in ourselves and investing in freedom by getting educated about these things and knowing what we can do to be better citizens.
We’re here with David and Tim. Â And later in the program, Chris Harris will be with us from Unhyphenated Americans. UnhyphenatedAmericans.com is the website.
Guys, of course, we’ve covered this topic a little bit over the last few weeks because it is frankly at the forefront. It is the hot topic right now. There seems to be an erosion of patriotism in frankly all segments of the American society right now because people are beginning to question. Should I be proud to be an American?
Looking at Differences More Than Things that Unite- Something That”s Had to Be Addressed Every Time We Needed a National Revival
What happens is we’re looking at differences more than the things that unite. And this has always been a human problem. And by the way, it”s something that”s had to be addressed every time we needed a national revival.
If you go back to the First Great Awakening, one of the most famous sermons of George Whitefield. And Whitefield is known for being the most prominent voice in the First Great Awakening.
It’s estimated that over the 34 years that he ministered in America, over the 18,000 times that he preached, that literally 80 percent of all Americans physically heard him preach a sermon. Now you can imagine how many communities you have to go to for Americans- all of them. Can you imagine anyone who would speak today where 80 percent of everybody in the nation would hear you? Â And I don’t mean through TV, or media, or anything. Â I mean being in an arena where you”re speaking.
George Whitefield Preached to 80% of All Americans in the First Great Awakening
Actually came to a live event where you were speaking.
80 percent heard you in a live event. That’s what Whitefield did.Â What he did throughout the Great Awakening was emphasize the things that united not the things that divided.Â That emphasis is huge. And one of the things that really struck John Adams was the way that he emphasized the unity. Because we lived that time back then where there was a lot of division in America.
Whitefield Emphasized Unity
You literally had colonies fighting each other. You had even Virginia killing Christians that they disagreed with. I mean in Virginia, they would kill Quakers because they weren’t Anglicans. I mean it was a divisive time and those 13 colonies. Â Even though there’s a lot of stuff that should have been in common, it wasn’t. And so they’re fighting.
And John Adams later recounted to Thomas Jefferson a sermon that Whitefield preached. He said, “Whitefield began, Father Abraham.” Â Â And by the way, this is called his “Father Abraham Sermon.”
So in it what happens is Whitefield has a dream, has a vision that he dies and he goes to heaven, and he meets father Abraham. And remember that in America, every denomination was divided from everyone else. Â “We”re all Christians, but we were willing to kill other Christians who don’t believe like we believe.” I mean it’s just-
In the name of Jesus.
There Was A Lot of Division In Early America, Christians Would Kill Each Other for Being A Different Denomination
In the name of Jesus. Of course, that’s right. “This is in Christian love, brother, that I’m killing you.”
So it’s just ironic. Â But here’s the sermon, and this is from John. Â I’m reading this from John Adams writings. He’s writing this to Jefferson reminding him of “You remember how often he preached a sermon? You remember how many times we heard it?”
He, Whitefield, began, “Father Abraham, with his hands and eyes gracefully directed to the heavens, as I’ve seen him more than once. Father Abraham, whom have you there with you? Have you Catholics?”
“Have you Protestants?”
“Have you churchmen?” -and that”s Anglicans-
“Have you dissenters?”
“Have you Presbyterians?”
“Whom have you here? Are you alone?”
“My brethren you have the answer to all these questions in the words of my next text. He who feareth with God and worketh righteousness shall be accepted of him.” Acts 10:35. “God help us all to forget having names, and to become Christians in deed and in truth.”
And so he”s saying none of these groups make heaven, only those who fear God and do what he wants are the ones who make heaven. And it’s not about labels. Â It’s not about names.
Whitefield- It’s Not About Labels or Names
And that became so important, because when they got in the first Congress and you had a motion made that they should all open with prayer. Â Cushion of Massachusetts said, Â “Let’s open in prayer.”
And you had actually, you had John Jay and John Rutledge said, “No way! We’re not going to pray. We got some Baptists here, and we got some Anabaptists, and we got some Presbyterians, and we got some Luther- There’s no way we’re all going to pray together.”
That’s when Sam Adams stood and essentially said, “Hey boys, remember Father Abraham? He said. “I’m no bigot. I can listen to a man of piety who loves his country.””
So that really broke it down when they started remembering their unity rather than their differences. Â What made them the same rather than what separated them. And that’s a great thing for us to remember today. Start looking at the things that unite us, because there’s a whole lot more in common than there is that divides.
All These Things That We Enjoy Are for All Americans
Well, that requires us to say that there is something in common, right? I mean we have to look at what actually unites us. The concept of freedom, the idea of a constitutional republic, I mean all these things that we enjoy are for all Americans.
And reminding ourselves too, that we- this country wasn”t founded by just a bunch of white guys. One of the things I love about WallBuilders is how you’ve brought out all of these great black Patriots and other people throughout our history of red, white, yellow, black, and brown that had a part in creating the American Dream.
One of the great lithographs we have that came out shortly after the American Revolution was the lithograph that was famous and really popular in Europe. And it showed George Washington standing beside all of his European generals, and they were from every country you could think of. But they all united on the principles of liberty. Â And they wanted to defend those principles. So Washington had dozens, literally dozens- twenty of his generals just came from Ireland by themselves. Â And you had generals from Poland, you had generals from France, you had generals from Hungary. You had all these different guys from different countries. But we had so much in common.
They Were Always Seeing Their Differences, Not Their Similarities
And by the way, they had to look for what was in common. I mean that’s why “Father Abraham Sermon” was so significant. Â Because they were always seeing what made them different not what made them the same. And so he had to preach that all over the country before they got it. Thirty-four years of banging that into the heads of Americans before it took hold, took root, and grew.
We’ll take a quick break. When we come back from the break, Chris Harris is going to be with us from UnhyphenatedAmerica.com. Literally saying, “Hey, let’s just be Americans. Let’s stop being hyphenated-American.”
Stay with us. We’ll be right back on WallBuilders Live.
Moment From American History
This is Tim Barton with another moment from American history. As the American War for Independence began, the president of Yale was the Reverend Naphtali Daggett. When New Haven, the home of Yale, came under attack about a hundred citizens rushed out to meet the British.
The Reverend Daggett galloped by them on horseback, his clearable robes flowing behind him in the wind. He took up a solitary position atop a hill. The 2,500 British soon put the townsfolk to flight but the Reverend Daggett continued to stand alone firing down on the advancing troops.
A British officer confronted him, “What are you doing there you old fool? If I let you go, will you ever fire again on the troops of his majesty?” Nothing more likely was the preacher’s reply. America’s early pastors personally confronted danger and courageously led their communities.
For more information on Pastor Daggett and other colonial Patriots, go to WallBuilders.com.
Chris Harris- Unhyphenated American
Welcome back to WallBuilders Live! Thanks for staying with us today, our special guest today is Christopher Harris. He’s got UnhyphenatedAmerica.org. And Chris and I just hit it off. Â We totally agree on this. Chris, thanks for coming on bro.
Hey Rick, thanks for having me.
Yeah, I think I kind of, I don’t know, maybe I channeled you for about 15 years until I found you. Because I love this idea of us not being hyphenated Americans: African-American, Hispanic-American, Irish-American, whatever. Â But just being Americans. Instead of dividing us, let’s see what we can bring together.
And you and I have met a couple of times at some business conventions. Â And you’re saying the exact same thing. Â I had not seen your website. Â Your website”s incredible. Want to send people there- UnhyphenatedAmerica.org.
You blog there. Â But you also preach this message of saying, “Hey, let’s look for what we have in common, not what divides us.”
We Are Divided Over the Most Superficial Aspect of Our Humanity- The Color Of Our Skin
All day, every day. That is pretty much- when I wake up in the morning, and when I go to bed at night; that’s what I’m thinking about. Because it’s what’s important, Rick. I mean this nation has become more divided. Really is shamefully on the most superficial aspect of our humanity, which is the color of your skin.
And I personally don’t believe in multiculturalism. I call myself, I refer to myself as a Christian Constitutional Conservative. As a Christian, when you understand that your ethnicity really doesn’t matter. And in fact, the only culture that you have, the only culture that matters as a Christian is the culture of the church- being a follower of Jesus Christ.
So I reject things such as the “black church” or the “white church” or the “Korean church” or whatever like that. I mean I attend a multiethnic church, but I don’t attend a multicultural church.
As a Christian, You Understand That Your Ethnicity Really Doesn”t Matter
Likewise, the United States of America really there is an overarching culture of America. Which is- and I and people ask me all the time, Rick, “What does Unhyphenated America mean?”
And I say, “It’s really simple. We are exactly what we sound like. We have, if you believe in the principles that are espoused in the Declaration of Independence, and principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Those are overarching principles and if you believe in those, if you embrace those, if you promote those, then you’re an American. And that there’s no need for any prefix or suffix. You’re just an American.
If You Believe In the Principles America Was Founded On, You”re An American. There”s No Need for Any Prefix Or Suffix
This really came home to me a few years ago, two years ago, I guess now. I think I talked about this the night at the convention I spoke at, where you and I got to visit a few weeks ago. But the visit that we had with Alveda King, Dr. Alveda King- Martin Luther King Jr.’s niece, there in the church where he was raised. And she made that point. Â After we’d done all, we spent time, had kind of the interview, she’d told us all kinds of cool stories.
And then she just looked at us and said, “You know, all this talk about race has got to stop. We are one race, and we may have different-“ just like you said, “different ethnicities, but I’ve got brothers and sisters that have all kinds of different colors of skin. But to separate us, instead of saying that we’re the human race, and bringing us together based on that is what’s causing the problem.”
Why Is It That Our Politicians Often Don”t View Americans as Americans, But Rather Hyphenated Americans?
I never really thought about it that way. That makes sense. Â So why is it that, let me just be blunt- why is it that black leaders like yourself and Alveda King get that. Â But you don’t hear that very often from most of our politicians?
Wow, that”s a deeper question. If you’ll allow me a few moments to kind of try to give some background on that. My personal belief and I know you”re a big historian. I”m a pseudo-historian. I don’t have a degree or anything in history. Â My degree”s in business management. But my own study of history has shown me that. Â And I have to go back say, “I’m a big fan, a big proponent- an acolyte if you will, of Booker T. Washington. And I tend to refer to him, as a term of endearment. I refer to him as “that dude.””
That”s just when people hear me talk about, “He said “dude.””
He”s just. Â Wow, when you read his writing. Because he was born in 1856 and he passed away at 1915, but he was born a slave.
Booker T. Washington and MLK Promoted the Same Principles
And here’s the thing that he was promoting. Â He promoted all the same principles that Martin Luther King was promoting. Of course, he was born before Martin Luther King. But he also promoted the economic principle.
And here’s the problem. Â If you look at what happened- I tend to break up the history of blacks in America into about three, 50-year segments. The first, basically from 1865 to 1915, which incidentally coincides with the death of Booker T Washington. The next from 1915 to 1965 which coincides with the death of Martin Luther King. Â And the, I guess, the end of the civil rights movement. And of course, from 1965 until present, give or take a few years.
But here’s the thing, from 1865 and 1915, the overwhelming thought process, among blacks after having been freed from slavery was “We just simply want liberty.” OK, that’s all they want is, “Leave me the heck alone. Okay?”
After the Blacks Were Freed From Slavery, They Just Wanted to Be Left Alone
“I have been a slave, leave me alone.” And Frederick Douglass was known a slave. Â He gave many speeches. Â When the question was asked, “What should be done with the negro?”
He says, “Do nothing with us.” Basically, leave us alone. It was your meddling, it was your attempts to do something that did us the most harm.” And that’s what was going on.
It was Liberty.
Let us stand on our own two feet. Â And then let us fall down, and let us stand up, and let us run unencumbered. Â From 1915 to 1965, unfortunately, Rick, in all that we saw an increase in government. Right? I mean, you had from Woodrow Wilson’s administration all you saw the rise of big government. And of course, deadly, you saw this decrease in liberty among blacks. The Jim Crow Era really kind of took root.
From 1915 to 1965 There Was An Increase in Big Government And Decrease In Liberty Among Blacks
And so here’s the thing. Â And understand we saw what a lot of blacks started focusing on. At that point from 1915 in 1965 was equal justice under the law. The problem was many of the leaders in that early part were people like W. E. B. Du Bois, who by the way, in case your listeners don’t know- was a flaming communist.
A lot of people don”t know this. Â You can just do a google search and you’ll see in 1964- give or take. Â Don”t quote me on exact that. But if you just Google “W. E. B. Du Bois communist New York Times” you’ll see he came out in a New York Times announcing at 90 something years old, that he had joined the Communist Party.
Leaders Like W. E. B. Du Bois Brought Communist Influence. Â He Wanted More Government Involvement in the Community
But he was one of the greatest influences. That- and he was a counterpart, he was not in association with- he was a counterpart to Booker T. Washington. He pushed the political agenda. Booker T. Washington said we need to focus on strengthening our families, and we need to focus on strengthening our economy. And when we have those things, the political power will rise from that. Don’t focus-
-on political power, focus on the social and economic. You’ve been slaves for a couple hundred years. You need to learn how to stand. Â You need to learn how to walk. Don’t try to run. And so, but you know you had Du Bois out there who said, “No, try to take off at a full sprint.” And we know what the consequences and repercussions were, so.
So he must have wanted too. Â I mean as being a communist, he must have wanted more government involvement in the community.
What We See Today Is the Result of A Hundred Years of Pushing for Political and Social Agitation Instead of Focusing on Family and Economic Growth
Exactly. And that was the thing. And so then what happened after the death of Booker T. Washington. Â You had the NAACP and all those other people. Â Which- by the way, that is a communist organization. It was founded by a bunch of socialists. Nobody wants to talk about that because that’s- it’s not politically correct. You’re not supposed to criticize them. Â But I’ll tell you, the NAACP was founded by a bunch of socialists.
The same sort of people who founded the Frankfurt School, at Columbia University. Who helped to push Cultural Marxism. So just to give depth and breadth to this whole conversation, what we’re seeing today in 2017 and what has now become the African-American community which is a whole other issue. Is the result of a hundred years of pushing for political agitation, for social agitation- instead of focusing on internal social growth and politi- and economic growth.
Instead of yeah, not for –exactly what Booker T. Washington was saying. It needs to be the strengthen the families, strengthen the economic situation from a free market perspective. Â Look at how many inventions he had, and how many things he did from that perspective. And looked for ways to have competition, even when it came to the- all the Tuskegee things that happened. It was not, “Government do it for us. Â We want to show you we can compete in the marketplace.”
Booker T. Washington Promoted the Idea of Self-Sufficiency
Exactly. So he promoted the idea of self-sufficiency. But also being able to provide a product, good, or service in the marketplace that the marketplace wants. And he’s famous for saying things that essentially- that if you’re really good at what you do, the market doesn’t care about the color of your skin.
Booker T. Washington Is a Forgotten Part of History, People Today Are Not Learning About These Black American Heroes
And the facts are- and I’ll tell you Mr. Green that- once again, as a self-professed acolyte of Booker T. Washington, I’ve made it one of- part of my mission is to get his message out there. Because he’s a forgotten part of history. I know that you and David Barton have been pushing about the forgotten black heroes of the revolution. Â And I appreciate that man.
It was so good at the convention. Â You and I were asked that. Â There were so many young black men and women who I know for certain, had no clue on the things you were talking about. Because look at the public education system.
So you provided more education for them than they had ever received in their lives.
Booker T. Washington Is A Perfect Example of True Exceptionalism
And that’s what we all need to be doing more of. No doubt about it. I couldn’t agree with you more about Booker T. Washington being a forgotten hero. Â Somebody, we should be- I mean, I put him up there with Henry Ford and all these guys that led the way in making our free market work as well as it does.
A perfect example of true exceptionalism where personal hard work and exceptionalism, where it crosses with a national exceptionalism. So if you’re in a nation that will reward that, then it lifts all boats. It helps everybody.
Certificate of Forgiveness
Man, Chris, I wish we had more time. But before we go, you got to tell us about the certificate of forgiveness. I found that on your website, and I’m totally curious. Tell us about it.
That is a little tongue-in-cheek that was created by my partner. Â My mentor is a guy named Kevin Jackson. You might have heard of him, he’s a-
Fox News contributor. And yeah, Kevin”s my buddy. Â He’s my mentor. And one of the things that we both come across as very serious people, and we are very serious people. Kevin and I both like to crack a lot of jokes. Â So it’s kind of a tongue-in-cheek thing.
The fact that there’s a lot of white people out there who are wracked with white guilt. And one of the problems with white guilt is it leads you to be what I call, “stuck on stupid.” Â Â That it leads you to sit there and say that- it’s like you’re giving yourself beatings every day.
You Cannot Be a Victor And a Victim At the Same Time
And so you”ll say anything that black people do, or as people say African-Americans – Â Which I don’t use that term for myself. Â But anything that African-Americans do- as a white person, you’re not supposed to criticize or condemn or anything like that because you’re white.
And so and you feel guilty. Â The current education system says that black people are victims. But you cannot be a victor and a victim at the same time.
And so we have to choose which one. Choosing to be a victor does not mean that you haven’t suffered in the past. It doesn’t mean that you haven’t suffered any injustice in the past. It just means you’re going to outgrow them. But it’s hard for us to outgrow them when you have people who are constantly reminded. Â And in their mind, they’re sitting there thinking, “Well, I want to be sensitive to it.”
White Guilt. Build a Bridge, Get Over It, and Focus on Being an American.
Well, okay. Â Acknowledge that it happened. Â But you don’t need to keep trying to remind me of it. And we want to give this to white people, and literally, we will actually send you one. If you order one on the website, we will send you one. It”s your certificate of forgiveness.
We, the Unhyphenated Americans, forgive you of your white guilt. Please build a bridge. Â Get over it, and go on and focus on being an American. And let me and others focus on just being an American.
Well, I love one of the last lines in it. Â It says- the person’s name filled in “being released of all guilt, shame, and debt- real or imagined, may join the rest of the citizens of the U.S. free from the burden of apology or lowered self-esteem and can now stop making tax paid Americans pay for said guilt, shame, and debt.”
So, really well done, man. Â Really well done. And we need to get these in a lot more hands. No doubt about it.
Go to Chris”s Website UnhyphenatedAmerica.org
Hey man, best place for folks to read your blog as well, would be the website, right? UnhyphenatedAmerica.com.
I mean .org. Â Sorry, got it wrong.
UnhyphenatedAmerica.org or they can find me on Facebook. The Facebook page is Unhyphenated America.
All right. Â We’ll have links to both of those places on our website today at WallBuildersLive.com. Chris, great having you on, brother. Appreciate it. Â Look forward to having you again.
It’s my pleasure and my honor. Rick. Thank you.
Stay with us folks. We’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.
Have you ever wanted to learn more about the United States Constitution but just felt like, man, the classes are boring or it’s just that old language from 200 years ago or I don’t know where to start? People want to know. But it gets frustrating because you don’t know where to look for truth about the Constitution either.
Well, we’ve got a special program for you available now called Constitution Alive with David Barton and Rick Green. It’s actually a teaching done on the Constitution at Independence Hall in the very room where the Constitution was framed. We take you both to Philadelphia, the Cradle of Liberty and Independence Hall and to the WallBuilders” library where David Barton brings the history to life to teach the original intent of our Founding Fathers.
We call it the QuickStart guide to the Constitution because in just a few hours through these videos you will learn the Citizen’s Guide to America’s Constitution. Â You’ll learn what you need to do to help save our Constitutional Republic. It’s fun! It’s entertaining! And it’s going to inspire you to do your part to preserve freedom for future generations. It’s called Constitution Alive with David Barton and Rick Green. You can find out more information on our website now at WallBuilders.com.
We’ve Got To Speak Truth in Love
Welcome back to WallBuilders Live! Thanks for staying with us today. Thanks to Chris Harris for joining us as well. We”ll have links to his website and our website WallBuildersLive.com.
We’re back with David and Tim. Â And guys, that’s really exactly the attitude that we want to see more of. Â I think everybody wants to see more of.
But how do we get there? We’ve got to speak truth. We’ve got to speak truth in love. Â I love the way Chris is just laying it out there.
I love the way he broke up black history. You get to the death the Booker T. Washington, the death of MLK, and then the present. And he was reminding us that Booker T. said, “What’s to be done with the Negro?”
I had forgotten all about that speech. “What”s to be done to the negro?” And the answer is “Leave us alone. We can do it. Get out of our way, we just”¦”
Richard Cain- Minister and Congressman From South Carolina, “All We Ask of This Country Is”¦ To Give Us Freedom to Accomplish Our Destiny”
And that reminded me there was a black congressman right after the Civil War. Â His name was Richard Cain. He’s from South Carolina. Again one of the many who lived through slavery, who had it really rough, who had it really tough. Now he’s in Congress.
He’s an AME Bishop, by the way, he’s a minister and a congressman. And here’s one of the speeches he gave way back then. Â It sounds exactly like what Chris is saying- is exactly like how we need to think.
But here’s what he said. He said – Now remember a black man in a really rough time. He said,
“I have no fear for the future. I have faith in this country. Let the laws of the country be just. Place all citizens upon one, broad platform. And if the Negro”s not qualified to hold his role in this contest of life, then let him go down. All we ask of this country is to put no barriers between us, to lay no stumbling blocks in our way, to give us freedom to accomplish our destiny. Do this sir, and we shall ask nothing more.”
That’s the same tone Chris was talking about. And that’s what we all need, is like “Get out of our way. Â There’s a whole lot here that we don’t need hyphenations. Â We don’t need to divide. Â There’s a lot. Just let us do it.” And that’s a great message.
We”re Not Hyphenated Americans- We are Americans
Well guys, even one of the things on his website, he has a link to that famous Teddy Roosevelt speech- “Unhyphenated America.” Which I don’t know when this phrase first came about, but certainly Teddy Roosevelt as he’s making this appeal that- “Look, we’re not all this German-American or whatever European nation you want to point to. Â Or African nation you want to point to. Â We’re Americans.”
And even on Chris’s website, Unhyphenated America, they reference and talk about this incredible speech from Roosevelt. But this was something that on both sides of the aisle, with all different kinds of ethnicities, we understood this concept is- “Look, if we’re in America, we want to be Americans. We want to be successful. We want to do this.”
And this is really a concept that, as Chris pointed out, this is something we ought to get back to. Â Because this is the fabric of what’s made America America.
It Is Not About the Color Of Your Skin, It”s About the Content of Your Character. Let”s Stand Together- As Unhyphenated American.
And not- as you point out Tim, I mean Roosevelt, over a hundred years ago. This is not a new challenge for us, right? People are always going to try to divide. They don’t want us united. And we have to be willing to say, “No, you’re my fellow American. I don’t care what color your skin is. I care about the content of your character. Â Let’s stand together.” Unhyphenated Americans. Love it.
Thanks, Chris Harris for joining us. We’ll have links to his website today at WallBuildersLive.com. Thank you for listening to WallBuilders Live.