Where Are the Grown Ups? With Wallace Henley: Today we”€™re looking deeper at the Kavanaugh hearings and recent happenings in the Senate. What is becoming of our nation? Do we just have a lot of people throwing articulate temper tantrums? Tune in now to learn more!

Air Date: 10/09/2018

Guest: Wallace Henley

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton

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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Rick:

You”€™ve found your way to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live! Where we”€™re talking about today”€™s hottest topics on policy, faith, and the culture. We always do that from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

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Here with us today is David Barton, he”€™s our founder and he”€™s America’s premier historian. Also, Tim Barton, national speaker and pastor, and president of WallBuilders. And my name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas state legislator.

Guys we’ve got a great article we’re going to share with folks on the website today if they go to WallBuildersLive.com there’ll be a link to it. It’s called “€œWhere Are the Grownups?”€ It”€™s by our friend, Wallace Henley and he’s going to be with us later in the program. But Where Are the Grownups? Our listeners probably already know what we’re talking about. We’re specifically asking about our U.S. Senate – where the grownups there with the way they’ve been acting lately with these Kavanaugh hearings.

Where Are the Grownups?

Tim:

Really, we could say where the grownups in America in general. It was just on display in the Kavanaugh hearings.

Rick:

That”€™s true. That”€™s true.

Tim:

Because even some of the people, and the protests, and you get on social media, and the fights that people are having, and the drama people are creating, and you’re going, “€œOh my goodness, we’re children.”€

Rick:

Yeah.

Tim:

Somebody needs a spanking right now. Somebody”€™s parent needs to come in and bend them over their knee, like, this is ridiculous. So, it really is a very valid question – where are the grownups? Again, was on full display from many senators during these hearings, during some of the accusations, and the media outrage, and just utter nonsense.

David:

One of the things that struck me as I watched the hearings, and Dr. Ford was there, and this was the second set of hearings, after the accusations came forward. So, Dr. Ford’s there and Kavanaugh was there, etc..

And what happened was Senator Grassley, who runs the committee, tried to say, “€œAlright, guys, let’s not make a bunch of sermons. Let’s get to the hearing, let’s get to the people testifying, so kind of cut your time short.”€ And  Ted Cruz did a really good job, but he had to jump, Grassley had to jump in and say, “€œTed, let’s watch it here. Come on, shorten it down.”€ So, it was going around the room, everybody was just getting their shot at the microphone with all the national cameras on them.

And then it came to New Jersey. The junior senator there, Cory Booker, African-American senator there. And I’ve never listened to Cory speak before, so I listened to him with great interest. He was extremely articulate. He was very, very, gracious.

A Look at the Hearings

David:

He talked about how much he’s learned from the Republicans there, and how much he’s learned from the Democrats, and that was the committee he always wanted to be on. And, man, he’s a junior senator there, and a junior guy on the committee, and he still– And he was just gracious, gracious, gracious, very articulate, very sharp.

And then he started going in and saying, “€œHere’s some evidence on the other side of Kavanaugh and you”€™ve got to consider this.”€ He started laying the evidence out and it was very, very, compelling. He went after it with this graciousness and this niceness and went through it all. So, as he goes through, he kept going and kept going, so Grassley tries to interrupt him and he keeps going and he said, “€œNo, no, I’ve got to say this.”€

So, he kept going. Grassley interrupted and said, “€œNot only have you taken a long time, you’ve gone past the time, you have to stop.”€ And he said, “€œNo, I’ve got to finish this.”€

So, now he’s violated the rules of the committee. Then, one of the Democrats says, “€œI”€™ll yield my time to him.”€ So, he keeps going and then he runs out of that time. And then one of the Republicans says, “€œOkay, you can have my time.”€ They just let him keep going, and going, and going.

And when he got to the end he says, “€œI am not going to vote on this nomination.”€ He just stood up and walked out of the room. He wanted to make sure everybody got his full load of everything he thought and believed and he’s not even going to vote on it. So, here’s a guy sent by the state of New Jersey to represent New Jersey in the U.S. Senate, one of only two people who can represent the state, and he walked out on the state. Not only did he walk out on the proceedings, he walked out on the state. And he says, “€œAnd I don’t care whether he’s guilty or innocent. I’m not going to vote for him.”€

Wait a minute, did you just say–

Rick:

That says a lot.

David:

Did you just say you don’t care and you’re not going to vote? That was the kind of where are the grownups? That was a very articulate 2 year old throwing a temper tantrum that’s rarely seen by the public. Now, that kind of stuff happens on the Senate pretty periodically. But to see that in public eyes, to see what he did. And I was really impressed with him up until that point and I go, “€œMy gosh, where are the grownups?”€  

So, Wallace’s article, that’s a great description of what we wanted to see and we didn’t see much of. Now, granted, Ted Cruz and Kennedy, Senator Kennedy out of Louisiana, and Lindsey Graham, they did a great job. So, there were some grownups in the room. But there was way too much immaturity for those all to be people who were elected to represent their entire states to act as immature as many of them did.

Rick:

Well, Wallace Henley is the author of that article we talk about the “€œWhere Are the Grownups?”€ He’s going to be with us when we come back from the break. Stay with us, folks. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

FrontSight Firearm and Constitution Training

Rick

Hey Friends, Rick Green here from WallBuilders Live. Tim Barton and I just got back from FrontSight Firearms Training Institute in Pahrump, Nevada. Took our families out there and did some fantastic training on how to defend ourselves and our families. And also taught on the Constitution, had a great group of people that studied the Second Amendment, studied the Constitution, and then also physically learned how to live that out, how to actually defend their families. It”€™s some of the best training on the planet. It’s a great time for families. And we love having our WallBuilders Live listeners with us on these trips.

We’re headed back out October 29th and 30th. Now, that’s coming up pretty quick. So, there’s very little time to sign up. There’s very few spots left, but we would love to have you join us. So, please go to RickGreen.com today if you’re interested in constitutional defense. That means studying the Constitution and the Second Amendment, getting the intellectual ammunition that you need. But also learning physically how to defend yourself and your family.

If you’d like to learn how to go for free with us at WallBuilders, it”€™s normally a thousand dollars to do this two day class. If you go to FrontSight.com today that’s exactly what you’ll pay. But if you go with us here at WallBuilders Live, if you are a supporter and donor to WallBuilders Live, we’re going to give you a certificate for free. Go to RickGreen.com to learn more and join us October 29 and 30th.

We’ll have some other trips later in the year, but this is going to be the best one with the best weather. So, make sure that you join us. Be sure and check it out at RickGreen.com today.

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. So, glad to have Wallace Henley back with us. Senior associate pastor at Houston’s Second Baptist Church. He spent some time as a former White House aide, and a congressional aide, and also, this my favorite par, co-wrote wrote God and Churchill with Winston Churchill’s great grandson, Jonathan Sandys. We had him on when he released the book and it’s great to have you back, brother. Thanks for your time, Pastor Henley.

Pastor Henley:

It is fantastic to be with you. Thank you.

Perspective in the Midst of Chaos

Rick:

Well, great article, by the way, on “€œWhere are the grownups?”€. I appreciate the grown up perspective with the chaos of the Cavanagh hearings. Thank you for writing it, first of all, but tell us what you mean by “€œWhere are the grownups?”€

Pastor Henley:

Well, I think the Kavanaugh hearings have exposed what is already very apparent in our culture. Especially in our political discourse, in the kind of entertainment we’re interested in, and so forth. And that is a striking lack of maturity on the part of people who ought to be grownups–

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

–and behaving like grownups. And that we’re seeing this in the tattletale atmosphere that exists in the political arena. We’re seeing it in the viciousness of some of the attacks that are brought against people not only in politics, but in many areas of public life.

Rick:

Well, you talk about the consequences of it and I think everybody saw exactly what you’re describing. It was on total display, we don”€™t have to convince them of it. And I even heard one senator say yesterday, “€œIt’s time for senators start acting like senators.”€

Pastor Henley:

Yes.

Looking Towards the Long Term Effects

Rick:

But it’s atrocious. The country is turned off. But you point in the article to the long term effects and, essentially, the warning to this childish adolescent culture. And what that ends up meaning in terms of moving towards more control, more government, more need for more guardians, all those things.

Pastor Henley:

Well, we have to understand that this sudden revival of the popularity of socialism among, especially among the young–

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

–that’s really distressing to me.

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

Because they they have not been taught history as history should have been taught. I always say that every history teacher who makes history boring ought to be made to stay after school and write a thousand times, “€œI will not make history boring.”€

Rick:

I love that. Yes.

Pastor Henley:

David Barton proves all the time that it’s a fantastic adventure.

Rick:

That’s right.

What Makes History Interesting

Pastor Henley:

And it”€™s God’s story, it’s providential history. One of the things that we saw in writing God and Churchill was that Churchill had a providential view of history. He believed that God was working in history and that people were part of it. So, that makes history extremely interesting.

But those who were so captured right now by socialism do not understand the history of socialism. And they”€™re very childish in their response to it. It’s a very immature response. And essentially, what they don’t understand is that every socialist movement is based on, not personal change, not personal transformation, but institutional change, and change forced by institutions. So, eventually every socialist movement across history has become an authoritarian movement.

The irony is that the very thing these people who say that they’re working for liberty are seeking is what will lead to the greatest of authoritarianisms dominating their lives.

Rick:

Which which makes sense if you– if everybody does anything and everything that feels good, we’re going to need government to protect us from each other.

Pastor Henley:

We will need the enlargement of government. Absolutely. And right now, for example, China is a great example. I remember when I was in the Nixon White House that this is when our opening to China came. And I remember a day when my dear friend and associate, Harry Dent, came into my office and said, “€œWallace, the president wants wants you to mobilize some prayer for the trip to China.”€ Because no one understands how closed China had been to us from 1949 until Nixon broke that by going there.  

So, there was an effort and we mobilized prayer across the nation. But here’s the significant thing – China moved into a period of new freedoms. The church again had some freedom to function. It could come out, to some extent, from underground. The economy blossomed. People were practicing free market economics.

The Way Socialism Works

Pastor Henley:

And now we see Chairman * trying to bring this authoritarian control back in because he recognizes that if they get too free they might even become people who want a free society.

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

And this is the way socialism works whether you call it Marxism, Communism, or even Naziism, which was a form of socialism.

Rick:

So, Pastor Henley, even that right there is a strong statement because most people associate Naziism with “€œthe right”€, but they forget it was a socialist.

Pastor Henley:

It was a social movement.

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

That”€™s right. Fascism is a relationship between government and corporate structures in which government directs those corporate structures. But in socialism there is actually a takeover of the private sector by government. There’s very little difference between those two approaches. Because however you approach it, those who run the markets must be subservient to government direction. And increasingly this has been the case in our country. And I’ll have to say, thank God that we’re seeing that broken right now.

But I fear that if the socialist wave captures these young people, these young idealists, these young utopians, that the kinds of free market economies – even though we do have tariffs in place right now in some cases – but the kind of free market economies that have made America great are not going to be possible.

What We”€™re Missing

Rick:

Yeah. And what you just described, and even this is the essence of your article I think, take the maturity to even understand that and think past my immediate need right now – I want this, or I want my neighbor to have this, or have more, or me to have more, so I’m going to take from our other neighbor across the street – to get past that immediate emotional response and have the maturity and intellect to think through what actually works, what doesn’t work. If I understand you right you’re saying that’s what we’re missing. We’re missing the adult conversations about these things.

Pastor Henley:

That is a great analogy and a great observation. And the fact that the adult, somebody has to be old enough, grownup enough, to be able to say, “€œBut let’s look at the big picture. Let’s link action and consequence. Let’s link decisions and outcomes.”€ Somebody has to rise up and say that. A very immature politics is one that promises everything on the short term without worrying about the long term or kicking the can down the road.

So, now we have a trillion dollars in debt in our country. I have a 15 month old great grandson, I have two great granddaughters, and I wonder about what kind of world they’re going to have with that kind of debt hanging over their pocketbooks.

Rick:

Right. Right. I”€™ve got to ask you this becuase I don’t think we had a chance to chat since this happened. But your article made me also think of not just the hearings, but I thought about back in the spring, I guess it was around May, when the kids in Florida  laid down in the Publix grocery store and literally prevented people from being able to go in and buy their groceries all because they had donated money to a great constitutionalist conservative there in Florida, Adam Putman, who was running for governor at the time.

The Difference Between Childlike and Childish

Rick

And my thought was – you”€™ve got a two year old toddler, basically, here throwing a fit. I mean, they were 18 and 19 year olds throwing a fit and throwing a temper tantrum on the ground. And instead of saying “€œno”€, the parents went in and handed them all the candy that they wanted and came out and said, “€œWe won’t do it anymore. We’re so sorry.”€ And I thought of exactly what you described in this article, it”€™s exactly what I was thinking was, where are the adults? Where are the grownups? What we’ve just done is told the kids is, “€œYou just keep throwing fits and we’ll give you whatever you want.”€

Pastor Henley:

We’ll give you what you want. Well, Jesus said that we would not see the kingdom unless we were childlike. There’s a profound difference between childlike and childish. And the kind of behavior that I’m talking about in that article and that you’re expressing perfectly is a childish kind of behavior. And increasingly this is what we’re driven to.

But I but as we look at the larger picture we are now under the influence very powerfully of cultural marxism.

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

And cultural Marxism is a response to what happened immediately before and after the First World War. There was this great hope among the Marxists that the working class would rise up after the war and launch a communist– or a revolution. That did not happen, so they began to think. And the Frankfurt School was very instrumental in this and I can’t go into detail about that right now, but that was a philosophical school based in Frankfurt at the University in Frankfurt Germany which then migrated to Columbia University in New York.

And they realized the proletariat was going to have to be something else. This group would launch this new Marxist revolution would have to be something else. So, they created the division between the oppressors and the oppressed. And the oppressed took the place of the proletariat and the oppressors became the bourgeoisie. And now we see the outcome of this in our culture.

Who Can We Point To?

Pastor Henley:

But the whole ethos of that was to stir this childish mind that would be very subservient as long as what it wanted from Santa Claus was given. And Santa Claus would be government, Santa Claus would be a class of people who simply wanted to control others. This is what we have to resist.

Rick:

Who can you point to right now that you think is offering some of that grownup, mature, perspective, in the national debate?

Pastor Henley:

Well, I see Mike Pence’s is playing a major role in that.

Rick:

Yeah, I agree.

Pastor Henley:

And I’m very grateful for his presence on the public scene. And beyond that, in the Congress and the House of Representatives, I think about my very dear friend John Culberson who is running here in the Seventh Congressional District in Texas.

Rick:

I served in the House with John, in the statehouse, years ago, 20 years ago.

Pastor Henley:

Is that right?

Rick:

Yeah. Sure enough.

Pastor Henley:

Hey, by the way, full disclosure – I was once his acting chief of staff and legislative director.

Rick:

I did not know that.

Pray Hard That the District Doesn”€™t Flip!

Pastor Henley:

Yes. District director. But nevertheless, John– that’s the reason I chose John. I ran for Congress, John beat me, there were five other people in the race in addition to he and I, all the others went for the other guy, but I went for John Culberson because I saw the maturity in him. And I spent some time with him spiritually and I saw spiritual maturity growing in him. So, he’s one of those people and we need to pray that that district will not be flipped. The Democrats are trying very hard to flip it.

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

Ted Cruz is one of those people. Ted Cruz is a man that really sees the kingdom, but he sees it in the context of culture, society, civilization. He sees the linkage between the Judeo-Christian worldview and what has made America what it is.

Rick:

That’s right.

Pastor Henley:

And this is what we have to cling to.

Rick:

That’s right. Well, and I asked you that because I want people to know there are grownup voices out there. There are some very intelligent, and very schooled, and thoughtful, people. Not just not just in the nation, but actually in these arenas and at some of the highest levels. So, don’t give up hope and know that they’re there, but let’s pray for more voices like that to be raised up and to win these elections. And like you said, some of these good guys like John, keeping them in there with these tough fights that are going.

Last thing I’ll ask you Pastor is  you watched those hearings, and you watch a lot of this stuff going on, and godly men and women sometimes will take from this, “€œI’m not doing it. I’m not stepping up and get into that arena.”€ What do you say to them to have the courage to face the challenges that are out there to still lead from the pulpit, in politics, in business, and all those other areas?

Don”€™t Be Afraid to Stand

Pastor Henley:

Well, thank God for the pastors like the man I work for, Ed Young, who”€™s not afraid at all to address things.

Rick:

That’s right. And it’s a very interesting thing what he does. I’ve been here 17 years. I’ve been through a couple of presidential elections with him and he will preach a sermon on how to vote for president. And all he does is he simply presents to the congregation the platform of the two major parties and he says, “€œYou make your conclusion, but here are the platforms.”€ And it’s very clear from that presentation that the passion of the Democrats is abortion, are other types of policies that would restrict freedoms very significantly, that would come against marriage and so forth. He doesn’t have to say that.

Then people can go all the way to the extreme to which I went which in 1999 was to actually run for Congress. And people asked me could I raise enough money? In Harris County, it takes millions of dollars to run for Congress in Harris County. And I said to them, “€œI’ll be able to raise every bit that I need.”€ Because my mission was to go into that race and use my background in government, which I which which I was grateful for, but but more than anything else to take the witness of the kingdom into that race.

And what happened was that every time the seven candidates would go out for debating, eventually, we”€™d come to a point that somebody probed me a little bit, or pushed me a little bit, on my background, so I just gave my testimony about how I came to Christ, how I came back to the lordship of Christ while I was working in the Nixon White House, going to a prayer group there. Then everybody had to come up, all my opponents had to come up with a testimony.

Opening the Door

Pastor Henley:

And the next thing you knew, the gospel of the kingdom was being inserted in this race – not because of me because there were others, John and others, who were very strong as Christians who also echoed that.

Rick:

But it opened the door for that conversation in that door.

Pastor Henley:

It opened the door.

Rick:

Yeah.

Pastor Henley:

And if we understand that our mission is to go in to be ambassadors of the Kingdom of God, if we win, praise God, thank God. But we’re there to bear that witness.

So, those who are considering running for office and wondering if they have a chance. Yeah, you have a chance. In fact, you’ll be successful if you just go in and minister the Gospel of the kingdom.

Rick:

Amen. Amen. Good work, brother. Thank you so much. Appreciate your time, appreciate you coming on. Keep up just the great example that you have and I’m looking for a new book from you soon. Are you working on one?

Pastor Henley:

I finished one that will be published in March on revival. It”€™s called Call Down Lightening.

Rick:

Oh, excellent.

Pastor Henley:

It”€™s about the Welsh revival of 1904 and the way we need it right now.

Rick:

Well, I sure hope you”€™ll come on WallBuilders Live and tell our listeners about it.

Pastor Henley:

Thank you, buddy.

Rick:

Alright, stay with us, folks. That was Pastor Wallace Henley. We”€™ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

This Precarious Moment Book

David:

This is David Barton. I want to let about a brand new book we have called This Precarious Moment, Six Urgent Steps That Will Save You, Your family, and Our Country. Jim Garlow and I have co-authored this book and we take six issues that are hot in the culture right now.

Issues that we’re dealing with, issues such as immigration, race relations, our relationship with Israel, the rising generation Millennials, and the absence of the church in the culture wars, and where American heritage is, our godly heritage. We look at all six of those issues right now that are under attack and we give you both Biblical and historical perspective on those issues that provide solutions on what each of us can do right now to make a difference.

These are all problems that are solvable if we’ll get involved. So you can grab the book This Precarious Moment and find out what you can do to make a difference. This Precarious Moment is available at WallBuilders.com.

Rick:

We’re back! Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. Special thanks to Pastor Wallace Henley for joining us today and for a great article. Be sure and read that article today. The link is at WallBuildersLive.com.

Back with David and Tim now. Well, guys, he’s definitely a grownup. I love having him on the program. We”€™ve got to get him back on the program more often. Just a wealth of wisdom there and great perspective, but it’s broader than just this hearing. Even culturally, that loss of maturity and that childish desire for the freebies is having a significant impact.

Immature Politics

David:

Yeah. And I love the phrase– I guess I didn’t love the phrase, but I thought it was a very descriptive phrase when he talked about how that it was a tattletale atmosphere there. Yeah, that’s really is an immature tattletale kind of atmosphere that was going – he said, she said, and back and forth and “€œWell, you didn’t do it. And I did–“€ and it was just that that kind of pettiness then went back and forth.

But I thought what he said was really strong about immature politics looks everything in the short term without thinking of the consequences of long term. And that was a whole lot of what we saw in the Kavanaugh hearings was throwing temper tantrums and tattletale atmosphere. And, as I mentioned, with Senator Cory Booker going out of the room on national TV, letting people see him storm out after he has dominated the time, and violated the committee rules, and disrespected everybody else who abided by the rules, and he’s not going to cast his vote, and “€œI don’t care whether he”€™s innocent or–“€ Just that kind of childishness and that’s not good for the future.

So, I thought Wallace really did have a good perspective on it and a really wise overview of what went on. It is something we need to consider. We really do want more grownups in the room especially as we go forward in national politics. And as he said, we’re now 22 trillion in the hole because we keep refusing to look at the future – we only look at the present.

Where Are the Grown Ups? With Wallace Henley

Rick:

Well, part of how do you get more grownups in the room is you raise up grownups is a big part of what WallBuilders does with our leaders program in the summer, with Patriot Academy, with the trainings that we put out there, with the materials that we put out there. We’re seeing some of the results of that. We’re seeing these young people now  10, 12 years later after we’ve sewn into them, we’re seeing them lead in their communities, and in business, and in the media, and all these different areas.

So, folks, if you want to be a part of that, if you want to come alongside the mission of WallBuilders, we would love to have you on our team. Would you go to WallBuilders.com today to learn more? You can do a monthly donation, you can do a one time donation, those finances help us to do more training, helps us to spread this good news, it helps this radio program get into the hands of more people. So, visit WallBuilders.com today to learn more.

Thanks so much for listening to WallBuilders Live.