White Slaves, Discrimination In Medical Care, And More  – On Foundations Of Freedom: Were there ever white people enslaved in America? Why is medical care restricted for individuals who refuse the jab? How does a secular worldview relate to medical care? Can we make the case that CRT, wokeness, and LGBTQ language are a form of religion and cannot be in public schools? How is “religion” defined, and why does it matter so much in this nation? Tune in to learn the answers to these questions and more on today’s Foundations of Freedom program!

Air Date: 05/12/2022

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith and the Culture

Abraham Lincoln said. “We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts; not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.”


Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. It’s WallBuilders Live. We’re taking on the hot topics of the day from a biblical, historical and constitutional perspective. We’re thankful you’re here with us to do exactly that. You know, we can get the answer to any problem in our society by having a biblical, historical and constitutional perspective. So we’re going to be talking about some things today, taking your questions, and tackling some of those issues that we call foundational principles.

So if you want to send in a question, you can send that to [email protected], that’s [email protected] and we would love to get your question on the air. My name is Rick Green. I’m a former Texas legislator and America’s Constitution coach. And I’m here with David Barton. He’s America’s premier historian and our founder of WallBuilders and Tim Barton, national speaker and pastor and president of WallBuilders. 

You can learn more about all three of us and the organization at wallbuilderslive.com, wallbuilderslive.com. That’s also where you can get archives of the program and that’s where you can make that one-time or monthly contribution. Thank you to everyone out there for putting some fuel in the tank so that we can reach more people with this message of truth.

Alright, David and Tim, let’s dive into those questions. First one today comes from Norman out of oh, I don’t have a state, Norman, wherever you are, thanks for sending in your question. He said “I was asked the following question. 

Were there white people enslaved in the United States? I honestly don’t know. And wanted to ask you as a credible Christian source knowing your depth of original source documents?” Interesting question, guys. I don’t think we’ve ever had this question on WallBuilders Live.


I think we’ve probably discussed it a little bit in some detail. Although with how much we travel and speak, it’s very possible that I’m thinking about many different events where we’ve spoken that I’m sure we’ve discussed some of this and maybe it hasn’t been on WallBuilders Live. However, with that being said, Rick, I think you’re right. I don’t know if we’ve ever had a question on Foundation of Freedom Thursday, where we got into the notion of white slavery in America. The short answer would be absolutely, there has been white slavery in America.

Civil War Times

In fact, if you go back to the Civil War leading up to some of the abolition movements, there was abolitionist. When they were writing against slavery, there’s actually pamphlets from all the way back prior to the Civil War, again, leading into the Civil War, there were pamphlets against white slavery in America because that, in fact, was a thing happening in America. 

It’s something that you can do a very basic search online right now and look for images of white slaves in America Civil War and you’ll find probably numerous different pictures that will readily come up because there’s lots of evidence there.

Now, certainly, the white slaves were not as numerous as the black slaves, etc. But when the issue with humanity is that you’re viewing other individuals as objects that are there for your service or they can help your business, whatever the case might be. When you don’t see them in the same light or the same respect as the abolitionists idea, that these are people that shouldn’t be enslaved, as violation of the laws of nature, nature’s God, if you’re embracing the notion of slavery, for whatever reason, then by and large slavery was not just enslaving a specific people group or race, although there certainly were some races that did that.

But for the history of slavery, it wasn’t just about a specific people group that was being enslaved by all the other peoples, it was every single people group in the history of the world at some point was enslaved, in some point enslaved somebody else. And that does include a lot of different looks in America, where if you study the history of some of the Irish or even some Italians in America–

You can go the history of the Asians in America, you can look at the history of the Native Americans or the black Americans or black people in general in America, African Americans or Africans coming to America, you will see that really across the lines, white people, brown people, black people, Native American people, all kinds of people dealt with the issue of slavery, both being enslaved and enslaving others. And that is actually true in America as well.

One of the First Laws on Slavery


I think there’s three of the things worth pointing out because Tim, you’ve hit it philosophically, it involves human nature and therefore it involves people. And that’s not necessarily race conscious, it sometimes happens. But it also is well beyond that. I think it was one of the very first laws written in America that specifically authorized slavery. And I think it was 1671. And it said that you could enslave Black and Indian and White. And so, all three categories were included in there, which pretty much covers the color spectrum.

And then as you look even in the early 1800s, starting about 174 through about 1816, you have America fighting the Barbary powers, are fighting Muslim powers, a 32 year war under actually four different presidents, Washington and Adams and Jefferson Madison. And in that period of time, there were at least 10,000 Americans that were taken, White Americans taken into slavery in Africa. 

So you had actually the Muslims would take Whites off of American ships in the Mediterranean and put them in slavery elsewhere. So there were a lot of White slaves there specifically. In that period of time, you have the Muslims taken about 1.25 million slaves, and they didn’t care what color they were, they just took people that weren’t Muslims and put them into slavery. So you have that certainly in the early era going up to the War of 1812 in the American Revolution, etc.

And then the third thing is you look at the foundation of the Republican Party, when they were founded in May of 1854, the nine planks in the first platform, seven of the nine dealt with race, dealt with slavery, dealt with equal rights, dealt with ending slavery, as Tim said that it was violated the laws of nature and nature’s God. 

And one of the big leaders in starting the Republican Party was a guy named Charles Sumner. He was a US senator. And Charles Sumner, who is a huge abolitionists also did plenty of writings at that time on White slavery as well, he has entire pamphlets on White slavery from 1850 period. And so you’ll find the Republicans early on took a position against slavery of all kinds, and that included White slavery as well as Black slavery or any other slavery, Native American, it did not matter.

So there’s a lot of evidence on White slaves in America. There’s a lot of forgotten evidence today because this is something you’ll hear nearly nothing about. In any kind of discussion of slavery, you won’t hear about the massive Chinese slavery that went in America in the late 19th century. I mean, that’s just pretty much gone. 

Medical Discrimination

People today think that really the only form of slavery America practiced was slavery with Whites on Blacks. And that’s not the case. It was Black on Black, it was red on black. It was any combination you can think of. So American history does demonstrate that it was not just White on Black.


Alright, great question from Norman, thank you for sending that in. Our next question comes from Denise out of Oregon. She says “David, Rick and Tim, thank you so much for schooling us on our history and our Constitution. Wish you would have been my history teacher in the way back, I listen every day. 

My question is this. How is it right for our government to restrict medical care to people who won’t take the jab? I’ve heard of two people in need of a transplant and the medical field refuses to treat them because they have not been vaccinated. Are there any legal helps they can get? I’m sure there are more of these cases of being denied life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Thank you.”

Man, guys, we hear the stories quite a bit of people not being able to get care all because they won’t get… And of course, I mean, the jab has worked so perfectly well. It’s not like once you get it, you can’t get the virus, you don’t spread… Oh no, wait, that was what the President said last summer, but hasn’t turned out to be true. 

So why do we require the jab to get medical treatment? We will never require that of anything. If you’re obese, you still get medical treatment. If you had AIDS, you still got medical treatment. Why are we going so far with this one, guys?


I think the answer is because they can. I mean, that’s just the bottom line. Why are they doing this? Because they can. Is it right? No. But they have a different view of right and wrong. This is where the real issue is, is what is your value system? And I’ll just point out that the more secular a nation becomes, the bigger its government becomes. And the bigger its government becomes, the more it coarses you and tells you what you can and can’t do and the less freedoms you have. 

So why shouldn’t they tell you who can and can’t get help or get a transplant or whatever? They have the power to decide. This is the problem of becoming a secular nation. You lose the concept that certain rights belong to all individuals simply because they were created by God. That’s all it takes to have God-given rights as you’re created by God.

Worldview and Medicine

Yeah, but if you’re not created, and if the government is the source of your rights? And this, in all essence, boils down to secular versus God consciousness. And that’s where this whole battle is. And by the way, Rick, you just gave perfect example, they keep talking about follow the science, they haven’t followed the science yet. 

They follow the science that they want to and that they agree with and that supports their positions. They’re not looking for truth. They’re looking for studies that support their position. And that’s what they point to.

And so all throughout this whole thing with the mask and everything else, there’s been so much science on either side just completely buried because it doesn’t agree with their worldview. And so, this may be an oversimplification, but they do it because they can, they do it because they have a secular worldview that does not recognize rights belonging to every individual. 

In a secular viewpoint, you see groups, you don’t see individuals and those groups are the vaccinated versus the unvaccinated or the gay versus straight or the Black versus the White or any other group they can think of. They do things in groups, and that’s part of the secular viewpoint.


You know, I think we’ve all talked about this for so many years, just the whole difference in how a culture responds if you believe in truth, if you believe in moral absolutes versus if you believe in moral relativism and everybody has their own truth. And it just seems like the world or certainly, the United States is getting a real lesson in exactly what you just described. What happens when a nation becomes secular? 

Whether you look at our big cities, and how they are just decaying into chaos, or even right here, where you just take away these basic rights that we used to understand. But you hit it, David, it’s where do those rights come from? If there’s no God in the equation, then it’s just whoever has the most power. If there’s a God in the equation, then those rights are from God. And government’s job is to protect them.

It’s really that big of a difference in worldview. But I guess it’s just never been so practical for people, at least in my lifetime, where you could point that out and say, this is what you get when you get a secular society. The good news is I think people are willing to listen now. We’ve been saying the same thing for what, 30 years, but now people are listening more than ever. I bet you guys are seeing the same response when you’re out there across the country.

Hitting Our Everyday Lives


Yeah, people have seen it demonstrated now. It was philosophical before and we could talk about a lawsuit here or a lawsuit there and incident Michigan or down in Miami or whatever. But now it’s in your backyard. It’s all over school districts. It’s all over all the local hospitals. It’s everywhere you turn. 

You’re confronted with an in your face kind of confrontation. It’s not just watching on the news or read an article about somebody else. Everybody now knows someone who’s been denied some type of service, some type of treatment, because they’re just in the wrong group and people really aren’t liking that.


Alright, guys, we’re going to take a quick break. When we come back, our next question, Phil Benson’s going to have the question. Stay with us, you’re listening to WallBuilders Live on Foundations of Freedom Thursday.


Hey, guys, this is Tim Barton, I am interrupting the normal broadcast to bring you something pretty special. This summer, we are doing a special program for college aged students 18-25 year olds. And it’s something that is becoming more and more special based on where the climate is.

In the middle of a crazy culture, in the middle of a nation going in crazy directions and right now we’re seeing in academia where even Christian universities are promoting critical race theory, teaching the 1619 project, we want to do something to help equip young people the next generation, to know the truth, the truth of the Word of God, the truth of America, the truth of the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, the free market, we want to get into a lot of this. 

And this is something that if you are an 18-25 year old, or if you are a parent or grandparent, if you have an 18 or 25 year old, if you’re in church, you know 18-25 year olds, this program is something that can be life-changing for them, you want them to be a part. Go to wallbuilders.com and look for the summer institute to be part of this program.


Thomas Jefferson said, “In questions of power, then let no more be heard of confidence in man that bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.”


We’re back here on WallBuilder Live, it’s Foundations of Freedom Thursday. And our next question comes from Phil Benson. It’s about limitations on teachers for religious expression. And here’s how I put it. He said “If teachers are limited in religious expression, can we make the case that things like critical race theory, LGBT issues and general woke things are a form of religion and can’t be in the public schools?”

Well, David, I’ve heard you say many times that even the theory of evolution has become a religion to many people. And even these things that Phil mentioned, certainly, have become religions to many people. So can we make that argument?

What is Religion?


Yeah, you can make that argument. Now, it’s not probably going to be applied because when they want to target something for extinction, they don’t look at their own beliefs, they look at the beliefs of people they disagree with, which tends to be religious people. But if you go back into the 60s, in the 60s, you have a case Torcaso v. Watkins, where the Supreme Court said there’s all sorts of religions in which they included non-theistic religions that didn’t even believe there was any kind of a god, Taoism. 

They also included anti-theistic religions, more like atheist. And so they, way back then, the Court said in the 60s, oh, yeah, all these other groups are religions too.

And then they did that as you got into the Vietnam War. In the Vietnam War is a lot of people and that very unpopular war and it was unpopular because the media didn’t like it, not because we weren’t doing the right thing. We had treaties with Vietnam and we promised to protect them from communism attacking them and we kept our word. 

And those are treaties we signed and agreed with at the end of World War II, the same with Korea. We told Korea that if the communists invade you, we’ll defend you. So both Korea and Vietnam were fairly unpopular wars but we kept our word and kept treaties.


And by the way, saying kept our word, initially, the attempt was to keep our word; obviously, with some what happened, it’s change that. But are you suggesting like when we told Japan or Taiwan or Hong Kong or Ukraine, some of these nations that hey, we will be there to help and support you if anything happens, and then like America didn’t show up and help, are you suggesting like maybe that would be contradictory to not keeping our word or?


Hey, Justin, can you run some sounds of crickets chirping right now? We just need some dead silence for a moment because that’s exactly what happened, Tim.


Yeah. And you know, this is where if we look back historically, again, the reasons that led us getting involved in Korea, the reason that led us getting involved in Vietnam was because the American government had given their word, they would help protect people against the evils of communism. 

The Korean War

And it’s even interesting going back and looking at Douglas MacArthur and what he said about the Korean War, Dwight Eisenhower, what they said about the Korean War, and they said, essentially, you’re going to have to go in and you’re just going to have to level the bad guys on this, the pro-communists, what was happening. 

And they recognize that this is not something that’s going to be really conducive for the American people to stomach. They don’t want these significant prolonged wars. But to wipe out the evil of communism the way we’ve seen it, it would be something more extreme.

And that’s where you mentioned, dad, the media shows up, the press shows up on the battlefield in the Vietnam War, and actually, it’s been very well documented. Now, some of the images that were brought back portraying one thing were actually very contradictory to what they’re supposed to portray. 

It’s something that there’s even been evidences over the last several years there’s been some really funny videos, where Palestinians, on video, you see them going in laying down and posing on the ground and pulling blankets over there, like live people pulling blankets over their head that had blood over them, pretending to be the body count of who Israel and the Israeli army has killed. And you’re like, you guys are alive.

But what happened is people recognize that there’s propaganda, you can now use film. And so propaganda is on a different level. We’ve even discussed it a little bit with this Russia-Ukraine scenario where it’s very hard at times to know what’s true, and what’s accurate information coming out of this Russia-Ukraine battle. Because when you have two nations that have the ability and technological ability to control the narrative that is leaving from the battlefield on such a level, it can shape the view of the American people.

And the Vietnam War is a great example, where the media can shape the view of the American people and sour them on something that, again, some of this by even staged photos, photos that were not accurately depicting or videos that were not accurately depicting what was happening on the battlefield, but it really swayed a lot of Americans what was going on. And war is never fun or easier, pretty anyway.

A Matter of Conscience

I mean, there’s a lot of people listening to us right now that are veterans or active duty military or reserve, and people who have been around battle, who’ve been around the war, they know, it’s not good, it’s not clean, it’s not fun, it’s not pretty. And when a lot of Americans were exposed to some of the reality and brutality of warfare, and then when media was used to shift the narrative of something that wasn’t, it changed how people viewed that. But all that to say, the reason those wars were going on in the first place was Americans working to keep their word, which was the right thing to do.


It was. And it was interesting to that there was a mindset that most of the American people couldn’t handle. Because we do see life is precious. And communist nations don’t. It’s a commodity. 

It’s just like drilling for oil or having wheat or anything else. It’s a commodity. And so when you look at Vietnam and you look at Korea, 53,000, 58,000 Americans killed, my goodness, we killed somewhere between 1.2 and 1.5 million in each of those conflicts. So we’re taking like 20-1.

But still back home, you know, every life is precious. And so even though we’re keeping our word and we are much better militarily than they are, it looks like a stalemate. When you see in the news back home, it looks like that they’re winning and that we’re not really covering ground and we’re not taking the turf. And so there was a mindset there.

And so a lot of people, instead of enlisting like they did in World War II and wanting to go off to fight, they didn’t want to enlist anymore and they didn’t want to be drafted. And the draft was there and was drafting people that didn’t want to be drafted. And they would say, well, I’m a conscientious objector. 

Well, the policy has been since back at civil war time that to be conscientious objector, you have to have a religious viewpoint and have to be attached to a specific denomination that has that viewpoint in its doctrine, which is why folks like Alvin York and World War I, the great hero, the most decorated he wrote World War I, he went in as a conscientious objector, but they would not recognize that because the specific church he went to did not have that in their doctrinal positions.

Torcaso V. Watkins

And so that was really the government’s position that look if you’re conscientious objector, show us where that’s in your doctrinal beliefs and we’ll give you that. Well, they couldn’t do that in Vietnam. And so that’s where guy started heading to Canada to get out of the United States. And they even went to court say, well, I’m not a religious guy, but this is a conscientious objector. 

And years like 1968, in a case called Torcaso V. Watkins, the Supreme Court said, you know, whatever you believe you so ardently, so sincerely that it affects your behavior, that’s your religion. And so the court came up with the definition of religion that had nothing to do with theistic religion or belief in God or anything else. They just say, whatever motivates you, whatever directs you, that’s your religion. Oh my gosh, well, let’s throw in evolution as a religion. Let’s throw…


Which by the way it is, so you totally can. But I…


Progressiveism is anything


Well, if we’re going to throw stuff in, my sincerely held conviction is that the federal government should not be taking more of my paycheck. So I oppose all new taxes, read my lips, no new taxes. That is my convictions, sincerely held belief. It is so weird how they can leave a definition so vague. But in a culture, especially, the last couple of decades where we no longer can define truth, we don’t have a standard of morality or basis of morality for then the standard to be well, it’s just however you feel, that is a crazy standard. 

But that is genuinely what the US Supreme Court said, is whatever you have a strong belief on, if you feel strongly about something, that’s all that matters and that’s your religion, which I mean, on some level, it’s true as far as a worldview is concerned.

If you have a worldview perspective, your worldview is shaping and shifting how you’re going to live based on how you view life, but just because you view life a certain way doesn’t mean it’s a religious perspective necessarily, certainly not in a theistic sense, which would go back to why you should have an exemption is if you believed that God had told you not to do something the federal government said to do. 

Religious Conscience Objections

Well, that’s a religious conscience objection. That’s one that would fit more in line with the position of the Founding Fathers or even before them, the Pilgrims and the Puritans or the Quakers or so many those who came and settled this nation, they were looking for religious freedom to worship God according to dictates of their own conscience. And so conscience was a huge concern for them, but it was the duty they believe they owe to God, not just they felt strongly about something, and didn’t want someone telling them what to do because I don’t want to do that. That’s a very different perspective.


And I think what the court did was they recognized reality that people are motivated by strong feelings, but that doesn’t necessarily make it a religion. And this got complicated when you looked at the First Amendment because the First Amendment guarantees you a free exercise of religion. Well, if you’re going to give that constitutional guarantee to anybody who feels strongly about something, then why even have the First Amendment anyway? Why do you need a constitutional protection if everybody can get protection for what they feel strongly about?

So what’s happened is I’d say since about 2000, maybe 2002, the court started going back to more of a traditional view of religion being more theistically based, at least in First Amendment protections. I mean, that was one of the great things that happened 2005 When the Supreme Court said, hey, it’s okay to have 10 commandments on the Texas State grounds and not allowed 10 Commandments in other government grounds, because they had been saying the guy who walked across the Texas ground who was an atheist, who was an attorney, he objected the 10 Commandments. Well, that says religious belief. No, it’s not. That’s his dissenting belief. He didn’t even believe in God. So how can you have a First Amendment guarantee for the free exercise of religion when you don’t have that belief?

And so everything in our documents was a very theistically oriented, at least the court has been coming back to that since the early 2000s. And I think there’s either four or five cases this year at the US Supreme Court that deal with religious expressions. And the court is coming back to protecting traditional historic religious expressions at a different level from just your belief. But there’s no question that woke and wokeism is a religion now and people worship at its altar and it directs what they do. It has an ethos. It has an ethics. It has guidelines for how you live your life.

And Glenn Beck, good friend, got on this, I think, last week, and he just said look, woke is a religion. And he just walked through it and said, here’s their beliefs. And going back to the question, yeah, critical race theory, that’s part of that woke religion. This is what you believe about the creation, your view of creation of individuals and some are created with greater faults than others and some races are more victimized than others. 

White Slaves, Discrimination In Medical Care, And More – On Foundations Of Freedom

Well, that’s your religion. But at least the good news is that the court is starting to come back to that. Now we’ll see if the people get educated on that and they follow because the people don’t buy into religion as it really means that theistic religion as defined in the First Amendment, then the Constitution is not worth much. But it’s a great question. And I think you can easily argue that woke and LGBTQ and CRT and these other things definitely are religions.


Alright, folks, etc, all the time we’ve got for today. We’ve got more of your questions that we’ll get to next Thursday on Foundations of Freedom Thursday. But thank you very much for sending those in. If you haven’t sent one in yet, and you’ve got a burning question on your mind, and you’d like us to address that, send it into [email protected], [email protected]

Also, I want to invite you to join us for the constitutional defense course. We’ve got just a handful of slots left, literally like about five slots left. And I want to offer you an opportunity to join us, you’ve got to do that very quickly. You go to patriotacademy.com, click on the Constitutional Defense tab. And then if you want to do it real quick, you can just email my son, that’s [email protected] and he will get you signed up for the constitutional defense course. If you’ve been listening to Wallbuilders Live long, you know, that’s our course where we do handgun training during the day and constitution training in the evenings. That’s a great time of both physical and intellectual training.

You get the physical training to defend yourself and your family. You get the intellectual training to defend the Constitution. It’s a one of a kind training and conference. We’ve been doing this for several years, put thousands of people through this course. All of them, absolutely, and we’ve never had anybody say they didn’t like it. 

They all loved it. You may have never touched a gun in your life, may be brand new to it. It’s actually mostly women that come to our course, about 55% women. The other 45% are dragged there by their wives. You know what I’m saying? Husbands out there that think you don’t need the training? Yeah, wives tell them, they need the training. We guys tend to think we don’t need it. But all of us need this training. Best instructors on the planet and the constitutional training is incredible as well.

I hope that you’ll join us. It’s going to be May 22nd through the 26th, so you only got a couple of days to get signed up. Email [email protected] and snag those last few slots. We won’t have another course until in the fall. So this will be your last chance to get trained for several months. I really encourage you to check that out. Thanks so much for listening today. You’ve been listening to WallBuilders Live.