Women’s Sports – A New Trend With Men? With Stephanie Curry: Stephanie Curry from the Family Policy Alliance is on with us to talk about the new trend of men joining women”€™s sports teams! What should we think about this? How should we handle this? Is this a new case of the story, “€œThe Emperor”€™s New Clothes”€?!  Tune in now to learn more!

Air Date: 07/16/2018

Guest: Stephanie Curry

On-air Personalities: David Barton, Rick Green, and Tim Barton


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Transcription note:  As a courtesy for our listeners’ enjoyment, we are providing a transcription of this podcast. Transcription will be released shortly. However, as this is transcribed from a live talk show, words and sentence structure were not altered to fit grammatical, written norms in order to preserve the integrity of the actual dialogue between the speakers. Additionally, names may be misspelled or we might use an asterisk to indicate a missing word because of the difficulty in understanding the speaker at times. We apologize in advance.

Faith And The Culture

Rick:

Welcome to the intersection of faith and the culture. This is WallBuilders Live! We”€™re talking about today”€™s hottest topics on policy, faith, and the culture. But we”€™re looking at those things from a biblical, historical, and constitutional perspective.

David Barton”€™s with us, he”€™s America’s premier historian and our founder here at WallBuilders. Also, Tim Barton”€™s with us, national speaker and pastor, and president of WallBuilders. And my name is Rick Green, I’m a former Texas state legislator.

Find out more about all three of us at WallBuildersLive.com. You can get the information on the radio program, you can get stations around the country where you can listen to the program, and you can also get past programs of WallBuilders Live there in the archives section.

Then you can go over to WallBuilders.com where you’ll have all kinds of resources for yourself and your family to equip, and inspire you, educate you. It’s just a lot of great information – DVDs, audio CDs you can download, there’s also a lot of downloadable articles. All kinds of things on the founding fathers, on the principles of America, on studying the Constitution. Check it out there at WallBuilders.com.

Later in the program, Stephanie Curry will be with us to talk about this whole situation right now in the country where men are able to go over and compete in women’s athletics. I feel like we maybe could do a commercial and say, “€œHey, have you been down with yourself coming in 5th, or 6th, or 10th, or 15th, in the guys competition? Well, hey, go over to the women’s competition. You might could win over there. It”€™s the new American way.”€ David, Tim, is this a good thing?

David:

Well, there’s a whole line of this happening right now, Rick. I was just looking at– this an article that really struck me– A guy named Robert Ludwig played college ball back in 1980. He is now 50 years old. He’s playing college ball again on the women’s basketball team at a college in California. He’s 6 foot 6, he weighs 220 pounds, he went to a judge who gave him a new birth certificate which now lists him as a woman because the judge said he could be a woman. And so now he can go back and play women’s basketball. Not quite the same thing.

This Reminds Me of a Story

David:

I”€™ve got an article here on volleyball. We have transgender male now in women’s volleyball, here”€™s dodgeball, here’s roller derby, here’s baseball, here’s cricket. We have wrestling. Here”€™s one – we have a male, a large guy, who now claims to be transgender is playing on a female semi pro football team, wrestling, sports, athletics. There’s just so many articles. This is such a big thing that’s happening right now and people are really kind of afraid to say anything about it. Which reminded me of a Hans Christian Andersen story. Do you guys know the story The Emperor’s New Clothes?

Rick:

Yeah, yeah.

David:

Yeah. And for people who don’t know it, you had this emperor who got conned by a couple of guys who came in and said, “€œMan, we have special weaving looms. We can create you just a suit that would be great for royalty and it will be so amazing.”€ And so they got on their looms and pretended to spin something, but they weren’t doing anything, there was absolutely nothing looms. So, the king sent his advisers over and they said, “€œOh my gosh, there’s nothing there, but I must have missed it. I’m not going to say anything, I don’t want to be the one to point out there’s nothing there.”€

And so it went on that all these people wouldn’t say anything. So, when they gave the suit, which was nothing, to the king he said, “€œWell, I don’t see anything, but I can’t say that because all my advisers told me that there’s something and this is a beautiful suit.”€ He put a note and worn and there’s nothing there. He’s got no clothes on at all and nobody will say anything until this little boy says, “€œHey, he doesn”€™t have any clothes on.”€ And once he called it out then everybody goes, “€œOh my gosh, he doesn”€™t.”€

Are We in the Same Place?

David:

But I feel like we’re in kind of that place right now where nobody wants to call this out. Everybody is looking like the emperor’s new clothes and, “€œI’m not going to be the one to say something. I’m not going to be the one to say that this is going on. Man, if I say something about that, I’m going to get killed by all of the other advisers of the king.”€ We’re just kind of in that crazy place.

Rick:

David, you got exactly the right analogy. And it is, everybody stay in quiet and even a lot of the female athletes have been bullied into being quiet. We’ve seen some of the gals that would have won had the guys not come over and competed in their competition literally say–

David:

You know they’re not going to say anything.

Rick:

No. They’ve even they’ve even been interviewed and said, “€œI don’t want to be the bad person here.”€

David:

Yeah, that”€™s right.

Rick:

“€œI want to take away”€. No, they know they’re going to come under attack if they say anything. So, they’re basically bullied into silence while the guys come over and think about it – the guys are literally coming over and stealing the trophies from the girls. And nobody’s doing anything about it.

Tim:

Well, guys, you’re acting a little surprised that people aren’t saying something. But isn’t this what we’ve been trained in culture to not say something or we”€™re hateful, and bigoted, intolerant. That isn’t just where people recognize the king’s not wearing any clothes. This is also where whoever his right hand man is is watching and if someone says he’s not wearing any clothes they execute the person. This is what media and culture is doing to people that would say, “€œWait a second, isn’t there a guy running against girls. Oh my gosh, how dare you?!”€

It Doesn”€™t Change Your Biological Makeup

Tim:

And this is not to be, try to be, critical and insensitive to people that might actually be struggling with trying to find out who they are, and how they identify. However, how you identify does not change your biological makeup. This is the great irony that people on the left want to argue in favor of science when they think science favors their position. They’re going argue that global warming is science, evolution is science. But now that we’re talking about gender or biology, “€œOh well, no, that’s just how you identify.”€ Well, does that mean if we identify and say, well, global warming never happened or doesn’t exist, if we identify and say, well, evolution didn’t happen, doesn’t exist. Would they be willing to accept that notion because we now identify differently? Of course not. That would be idiotic. Exactly.

Rick:

Exactly.

Tim:

This is where their logic is so inconsistent and, yet, if you call them out on the inconsistency they call you names, they are hateful, they’re mean, and they try to openly destroy you. And this is why so many people have been afraid to. But this is where I think there’s actually going to be some good news in the long run. Because I think liberals are overplaying their hand and Americans are going to come to a place where they say, “€œWe’ve had enough. No, we’re not doing this.”€ And people are going to stand up. I just am not totally sure we’re at that place yet.

Rick:

That’s a good point, man. I hadn”€™t even thought about that that these types of ridiculous things, at least most people see them as ridiculous even though they’re not willing to say anything, will cause a backlash to the left because they have overreached so far.  

Stephanie Curry is the public policy manager for the Family Policy Alliance. They’ve got groups in almost every state that pay attention to these issues, that lobby the legislature for family issues, and biblical issues. And she is going to be with us when we come back from the break to comment on this. She had a great article talking about– actually her title of her article was “€œBoys Are 10 Percent Better”€. Well, that will get you some backlash right there and I’m sure she’s gotten it. But she’s going to tell us about it when we come back from the break. Stay with us, folks. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

America”€™s History

This is David Barton with another moment from America’s history. Often today it seems that the federal government has become too intrusive in the local matters. And federal micro-management has now, unfortunately, become the norm in education, law enforcement, religious expressions, and even on what is and is not moral.

Strikingly, the Founding Fathers had intended that the federal government never intrude into any of these issues. As Thomas Jefferson explained, “€œTaking from the states the moral rule of their citizens and subordinating it to the federal government would break up the foundations of the Union. I believe the states can best govern our home concerns and the federal government our foreign ones.”€

According to Thomas Jefferson, the original plan was for the federal government to direct foreign affairs but for the states and local communities the domestic and the moral ones.

For more information on God’s hand in American history contact WallBuilders at 1 800 8 REBUILD.

Rick:

Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us here on WallBuilders Live. Stephanie Curry is with us. She’s Public Policy Manager for Family Policy Alliance. That’s FamilyPolicyAlliance.com. Stephanie, thanks for coming on. Glad you’re with us.

Stephanie Curry:

Thank you so much for having me, Rick.

Rick:

Hey, great article about a not so great thing which is that we have these guys now identifying as transgender and competing in women’s athletics. And some people might be offended by this, but of course winning. This is an unfair advantage isn’t it?

It”€™s Just a Fact

Stephanie Curry:

Absolutely. It is, Rick. Boys are just biologically different from girls. And so when you put them head to head and they’re competing against one another, boys simply have a natural biological advantage. Period.

Rick:

I’ve seen a couple of these headlines. In my home state of Texas there was a wrestling example, there was a couple of track examples, I’ve seen in Connecticut. It’s kind of happening all across the country. What I’m not seeing that kind of surprises me is outrage from especially the feminists, but frankly all women. This, to me, seems like  patently unfair and guys that are, basically they couldn’t win in the in the guy’s races and so they’re just looking for a trophy and competing in the girls program. And just, I don’t know, I can’t believe schools are actually allowing this to happen.

Stephanie Curry:

Right. And I wonder about that too. Where is the outrage? And I wonder if people just don’t know, they’re not aware, or if they’re simply buying into the lie that a transgender boy, or a boy, see, you get it mixed up – a boy who’s a transgender girl. They’re buying into the lie that they”€™re a girl.

Rick:

Yeah.

Stephanie Curry:

So, we”€™re having boys competing on girls track team because they say they”€™re girl, they say they feel like a girl, but they’re not. Their biology has not changed.

Rick:

I wonder what the– I did see, I guess it was last year in one of the races, I can”€™t remember which state it was where this happened, and the girl that would have won the race had there not been a boy coming over and acting like a girl to be in the race. She said, “€œWell, I can’t say anything because then I’m the bad person if I do that.”€ So, she was essentially quiet about it. Is that happening in these other races? Are the girls that would have taken first and second place not saying anything? Or are they saying, “€œHey, come on, this isn”€™t fair athletics here.”€

Biology Not Bigotry

Stephanie Curry:

I think it’s a little bit of both, Rick. In this story about Connecticut a few weeks ago, two transgender boys took first and second place in the 100 meter dash and the third place was a girl. Now, as far as I could tell she didn’t speak out, but some of the other girls did and their parents started petitions saying, “€œHey, this isn’t fair. There’s something not right about this. We do not want these boys who are identifying as transgender to be able to compete against our girls because it simply isn’t fair.”€

And when you look at the numbers, the stats across all scores, world record scores, everything. There’s a reason why we have men’s team and women’s team because there’s something fundamentally unfair about having a woman compete against a man.

Rick:

Well, let’s talk about that specifically because you go through all the research in your article and we’ll have a link to your article today, it’s called “€œBoys are 10% Better”€. Inflammatory message by today’s standards. Tthat would have been inherently understood in athletics even ten years ago, let alone 50 years ago. But today, people are saying there’s no difference between men and women. And by you drawing that distinction you’re being you’re being sexist. How do you answer that?

Stephanie Curry:

Well, as we like to say, it’s biology not bigotry.

Rick:

That”€™s good.

Stephanie Curry:

You can look at the numbers, and look at science, and physiology, and anatomy. And we know, at least as far as sports go, as we”€™ve said, boys have a natural advantage. Their hearts are bigger, they are able to more efficiently process oxygen, they have denser muscles because of their testosterone, they might have longer legs. There is a reason why men”€™s world record scores are almost always higher than women.

A 10% Difference

Stephanie Curry:

And, for example, the 100 meter dash which is the subject of the Connecticut story. We were saying how the world record scores, there is a 10 percent difference in a man and a woman. And there is a reason why that’s taking place. Women haven’t broken their world record since 1988. And we all know * broke that score and, no, it’s called the 10 second barrier. There is a 10 second barrier as far as the 100 meter dash. No woman has ever run under that 10 second number. And there’s a reason for that and that’s biology.

Rick:

What kind of response are you getting to your article?

Stephanie Curry:

I– we have gotten nothing but positive response so far. I’m sure there are people that are outraged by the article, but so far the e-mails that I’ve gotten were very glad that we’re talking about this, that we’re raising awareness about this, and just encouraging us to continue to be informing people about the truth. And that boys can”€™t be girls and girls can’t be boys whether they believe it or not. We need to stand up and stand up in our schools, protect our children, and ensure that we’re really paying attention to what’s going on around us.

Rick:

You say in the article biological sex isn’t a social cause to rise against and it doesn’t have an agenda. It’s just, like you said, basic biology, it’s just truth. What do you think– I know the article doesn’t really address this, but just as you did this research, what do you attribute this major change to that we would go from a fairly healthy athletic competition world in America to, now, really destroying women’s athletics? If this keeps up, you essentially are wiping out women’s athletics. What’s at the heart of all this?

They”€™ve Gotten Really Good At Their Message

Stephanie Curry:

Well, gosh, that’s a great question. Leftist activists have gotten really good at their message and they just seem to scream really loudly that we should– everyone should just be who they want to be. That you can change sex if that”€™s the way you feel. And, yet, many of us know the truth that you can’t change your sex and we need to really be paying attention to what’s going on around us. And also engaging in politics, get out and vote, pay attention to your primaries.

What happened in Connecticut, the athletic board conference claimed that they have to allow boys to compete on girls track teams because of their laws. And the Connecticut legislature passed a law that said you cannot discriminate based upon gender identity. So, for the athletic conference, that meant that they had to have boys compete on their girls track team. Now, many of us in different states would interpret that differently. And it’s important that we are able to elect legislators that represent our values and that will stand up to the truth and not buy into the lie.

Rick:

One of your colleagues out there in Washington has such good video on this that Joseph *, I show it at all of our Patriot Academy”€™s, the one where he’s on campus I’m sure you’ve seen where he’s asking, “€œIf I”€™m a–“€ as a 5″€™9″€ white guy he claims to be a 6 foot 5 Chinese woman. And the responses from students on campus, everything is fine until he says he’s six foot five and then one of the girls says, “€œWell, because–“€ He says, “€œWhy not?”€ And she says, “€œBecause you’re not.”€ And that should have been the answer to all of his claims, of course.

But I bring that up because he also points out that– one of the students responds with if he wanted to enroll in a first grade class if he claimed he was only 7 years old and the guy was like, “€œWell, sure, as long as it’s not harming anyone.”€ And my thought immediately when I saw it the very first time was, “€œOf course that would harm someone and when are we going to start seeing the examples of where this lunacy harms someone?”€ Man, it seems like, Stephanie, your article points out it’s harm– this idea is harming people.

This Idea is Harming People

Stephanie Curry:

Absolutely, Rick. And I think women are being harmed in a unique fashion. For example, when you’re allowing men to say that they’re women and they’re able to take opportunities away from women – such as, perhaps, athletic scholarship because they won the 100 meter dash–

Rick:

Yeah.

Stephanie Curry:

–because they said they were a girl. That’s a woman, a biological woman, that now can’t get a scholarship. Perhaps those boys are taking spots on college campuses, or sports teams, or even just on the championship list. Those are all things that are being taken away from women. And we have laws in place to protect women from discrimination. But if a man or a boy can now say that they’re a woman, then what do those laws mean and who do they protect?

Rick:

Yeah, yeah. No, doubt about it. Well, as you say in the article, our biology and physiology doesn’t change just because our social agenda does.

Stephanie Curry:

Absolutely.

Rick:

And unfortunately, it’s the cause of the day and it’s going to have repercussions for generations. Stephanie, it”€™s a great article. We”€™ll have a link today at WallBuildersLive.com. The website for you guys, FamilyPolicyAlliance.com. Great organizations all across the country. Really appreciate your time today, Stephanie.

Stephanie Curry:

Thank you so much, Rick. I appreciate it.

Rick:

That”€™s Stephanie Curry, public policy manager for Family Policy Alliance. Stay with us, folks. We’ll be right back with David and Tim Barton.

A Moment From American History

This is Tim Barton from WallBuilders with another moment from American history. Too often today history education excludes great black heroes from the American founding. Such as Lemuel Haynes.

Haynes, though abandoned as a baby, pioneered churches across upper New England. He became the first black American to pastor a white congregation, to receive an honorary master’s degree, and to be ordained by a mainstream Christian denomination, The Congregationalist.

He was a soldier during the American Revolution and in his churches on George Washington’s birthday he regularly preached sermons honoring George Washington. Even late in his life he expressed his willingness to go back to battle if necessary to protect America, which he called, “€œa sacred ark.”€

American history is filled with numerous examples of black heroes who are largely ignored by mainstream education today. For more information about Pastor Lemuel Haynes and other colonial Patriots go to WallBuilders.com.

Rick:

Welcome back to WallBuilders Live. Thanks for staying with us. Special thanks to Stephanie Curry from Family Policy Alliance for joining us and we’ll have a link today to her article, “€œBoys are 10% Better”€. We’re back with David and Tim Barton. And, Tim, you said it earlier– science, people want to say, “€œI’m pro science”€ whenever it backs up their argument. Here we’re just talking about basic science, but, boy, it gets you in a lot of hot water just a state these basic scientific facts that we used to take for granted.

David:

Rick, what you said reminded me of a statement made by Alan Dershowitz. Alan Dershowitz is a law professor. You would absolutely identify him as a liberal. I was engaged in a debate with him one time and as a liberal guy he’s an old school kind of a liberal. In the sense that he was able to come out and point out when Obama did things wrong. He’s been a big critic of Obama even though that was the guy he had voted for.

Pounding the Table

David:

So, he’s been really pretty straight on that and he’s got this great quote. He said, in  teaching students law this is what he said, He says, “€œIf the facts are on your side, pound the facts into the table. If the laws are on your side, pound the law into the table. If neither the facts nor the law are on your side, pound the table. I feel like that’s kind of what”€™s happening here is there’s no sides to back this up, there’s no facts to back this up, but we’re just going to pound the table.

And, Rick, you made a comment to Stephanie, you said, “€œThis 10 percent difference between men and women would have been inherently understood even ten years ago.”€ Rick, I”€™ll point out it’s inherently understood today. It’s just nobody wants to say anything about it because they will get attacked. The other side will pound the table and come after you with all sorts of attacks. But this is just– it’s radical to think that we can’t even present, as Tim said, science and facts. They love to when it”€™s in their behalf, but when it’s not then you get what you get right now which is just craziness.

Rick:

Well, as we’re going to– we”€™ve got one more break we”€™ve got to take care of– I was trying to think of a good analogy. So, you were talking about The Emperor Has No Clothes earlier. Maybe today it’s the first place trophy guy has on the wrong clothes. Okay, that was weak. That’s right. Quick break. We’ll be right back. You’re listening to WallBuilders Live.

Pastors Only Briefing Trip

Tim:

Hi, this is Tim Barton with WallBuilders and I want to encourage all the pastors out there with a unique opportunity that we’re presenting it WallBuilders. We’re doing a special tour just for pastors that you can come and learn more about the spiritual heritage of our nation. Not just seeing the sights but understanding the significance of what they are and what they represent.

We get to go to the Capitol at night.  And we get to see the spiritual heritage of our Founding Fathers, of who we are as a nation, where we came from. We bring in congressman that will tell you about current legislation, about our religious liberties  and freedom, and what’s going on in Washington, D.C.

If you’re a pastor or if you want to recommend your pastor for this trip, you can go to our website at www.WallBuilders.com. And there’s a link that’s for scheduling.  If you click on that link there’s a section for pastor”€™s briefing. There’s more information about the dates, when it’s going, and how it’s going to happen. If you want to know more about our nation, our religious liberties, our freedom, our spiritual heritage, this is a trip you want to be a part of.

Rick:

Thanks for staying with us on our final segment today here on WallBuilders Live. And I”€™ve got to ask you guys, David, Tim, as we’re closing out today, we always talk action steps. What are the action steps to this type of thing? Is it to not be the one that’s bullied and silent, but actually speak up for truth here?

David:

Well, I don’t think you’re going to find the people that are engaged in the competition doing the speaking up. It’s going to take someone else being an advocate for them on the outside. Somebody in the crowd has to say the emperor has no clothes. It was not the people around him that would do it. And so these girls that are getting beat by guys in competition, they”€™re not going to be the ones to speak out. That would be a sore loser kind of thing. That would not be appreciated by most people.

But somebody has to point out that as great as training is right now virtually every serious miler that’s a male has broken the four minute barrier. I don’t think there’s a single woman that’s broken the four minute barrier. And you can say that that’s discrimination, but that doesn’t hold up. They have excellent training facilities, they have excellent capabilities, excellent coaches, excellent everything. There’s just a biological difference that”€™s there and somebody has to be the one to point out the emperor has no clothes.

Common Sense Will Eventually Win

David:

And you know what, if there’s enough of a groundswell that comes from people just popping up and doing this on their own social media posts and other things it will eventually win. Because common sense will come back on this thing. It’s just that right now nobody wants to be seen as the one breaking the silence and saying something about it. Which means we all need to say something about it.

Rick:

Hey, Tim, let me ask you before we close out the day. When you’re talking to young people, I know I’m noticing this at Patriot Academy”€™s and maybe you’re seeing the same thing. When you get into this subject, when you”€™re actually willing to talk about this subject, they do express shock and dismay, and almost sometimes a spirit of defeatist,  defeatism that, “€œWe just felt like it was so overwhelming we couldn’t really say anything.”€ What are you hearing on that?

Tim:

Yeah, I think most the time the level of familiarness with the depth of the problem is the shock. Wait a second, what, that really happens? Because most kids are not engaged in the political climate. And the problems around the nation as much as, perhaps, we are. We’re trying to know exactly what is the pulse of America, what’s the pulse of culture, and so we”€™re intentionally are looking for the places it’s happened so that we know what’s going on and how to combat it.

But as we’re mentioning, this is something that’s pretty self-evident to young people. And one of the challenges we give is, look, where are the women who are claiming to be the feminists, right? Where’s the “€œme too”€ movement on this thing? Wait a second, right, we have to defend femininity or there can be no female, or no feminism right? No female on our left that we’re trying to fight and defend if there is no such thing as female.

It Should Be a Basic Concept

Tim:

And this is where it should be as basic as any concept we can unfold. But most people just don’t think through it. So, when young people are presented with this logical fallacy that’s being presented to them that anybody can be a woman any time, whenever they want, however they feel. Well, it just devalues where women are. And so ultimately women, the feminists, need to be standing up to this and saying, “€œNo, we have to defend our gender and our personhood or ultimately there is no femininity left.”€

And so it really– young people come out on the right side because it is pretty self-evident and logical. You have to get beyond the emotion because maybe they have a friend who’s struggling with this, but it really is basic biology. When you really just come down to what we’re dealing with and the young people that we deal with understand that well.

Rick:

Well, it”€™s good to hear and hopefully it will be discussed enough. They’re the ones that ultimately will have to be the ones to turn this around I think. Just like, David, you were saying it may not be those athletes that are on the field having to deal with this, but their classmates, certainly, can be the ones to speak up. So, we”€™ve all got to find our voice and not be silent in these in crazy times.

Women’s Sports – A New Trend With Men? With Stephanie Curry

Rick:

Thanks for listening today, folks. Thanks to Stephanie Curry for joining us today on the program. We appreciate you being a listener. We hope you”€™re also sharing the program with your friends and family, help to spread the word. You can go to WallBuildersLive.com and use the links there and spread them across your social media platforms. And then you can also help us to spread the word by going to WallBuilders.com, making a contribution one time or monthly, and be a partner with us to help continue to restore our Constitutional Republic. Thanks so much for listening to WallBuilders Live.